Please help me select my first safe (and by safe I mean RSC)!

[akgriffin]

i would look up liberty safes. Its american made, which is the biggest reason for me to look.

 

[Ultra]

Sounds like you're describing a Graffunder

Don't get me wrong, they're are real nice safes, but for the price of a B or C rated Graffunder you could buy a TL-30 or a used TL-30x6. And you could upgrade a Sturdy to B rated for half the price.

 

[a1abdj]

Don't get me wrong, they're are real nice safes, but for the price of a B or C rated Graffunder you could buy a TL-30 or a used TL-30x6. And you could upgrade a Sturdy to B rated for half the price.

This really depends on what you're looking at. One of the reasons the Graffunders (and Browns and others) are so expensive is that they are using steel plate instead of composites. A composite TL-30 will cost much less than a steel plate TL-30. I don't know if it was this forum or not, but I calculated that the steel used in a recently purchased Graffunder E rate would have cost me around $5,000 for the plate alone, not counting the labor to assemble it, nor any of the other parts, finish, or interior.

I didn't know that Sturdy offered 1/4" bodies and 1/2" doors, but if they do, I'm assuming the price will go up accordingly to match the cost of the materials.

Of course if you know where to look, you can find a gun safe that already has 1/4" worth of steel in the body, 1/2" worth of steel in the door, a cast fire liner, all sorts of commercial safe features, and a price tag very similar to the lighter weight Sturdy.

 

[TXdefender]

I don't know if it was this forum or not, but I calculated that the steel used in a recently purchased Graffunder E rate would have cost me around $5,000 for the plate alone, not counting the labor to assemble it, nor any of the other parts, finish, or interior.

Based on what I just paid for some steel plate, just the steel outer shell of your safe would have cost me $5,600.

Ya, it was my E Graff. Something about plate steel makes me feel warm and fuzzy inside, a composite safe doesn't do it for me though it might work quite well. Plate steel is expensive and heavy, if you decide to go this route keep those in mind.

I also own a Liberty Colonial 23, Timber Ridge by Gander Mountain, it was my first "safe" and served me quite well until my collection grew and I decided to step up my security. It is not a bad route to go as long as you know what you are getting into. It uses a 12ga body and door along with sheet rock insulation. I will not be critical of folks who choose this type of protection as different folks have different needs. Just don't get pulled into Liberty's marketing hype like I did and think you are buying bank vault type security, my Graffunder doesn't even provide that though better protection than the Liberty.

 

[CodyWayne718]

Like how I asked the OP a question about the safe he started this thread about in the first place an now we got two pages of six different "B" rated safes an everything else. Nice job!

 

[a1abdj]

Like how I asked the OP a question about the safe he started this thread about in the first place an now we got two pages of six different "B" rated safes an everything else. Nice job!

Well you just joined, so you don't know how these safe threads work. I'll get you up to speed.

1) Somebody posts a question about a safe. Could be general or specific, doesn't really matter.

2) Myself or one of the other safe guys on the board attempt to answer the question based on our professional experience

3) A few other members with similar safes or issues will typically share their stories or opinions

4) Sturdy safe owners chime in about how the OP should have bought a Sturdy

 

[Ultra]

You forgot number 5!

5) a1abdj knows best, because he's just smarter then everybody. And we're not only talking safes.

A word to the wise. When safe salesmen tell you they're going to sell you 1/4" worth of steel in the body, 1/2" worth of steel in the door make sure they're not adding the inner liner to the outer shell to come up with a cumulative number.

 

[Ultra]

I didn't know that Sturdy offered 1/4" bodies and 1/2" doors, but if they do, I'm assuming the price will go up accordingly to match the cost of the materials.

5 gauge body (0.2188 )plus 7 gauge (0.1875) reinforcement =.4063
That's much thicker the the .25 wall of a B rated safe.

Door 5/16 inch (.3125) plus 7 gauge (0.1875) = .5

So overall that's thicker steel then a B Rate Graffunder. And if you add up the price it will be around half, give or take, when you include delivery for the Graffunder.

As I mentioned before Graffunders are really nice safes, it's just good to know your options.

 

[a1abdj]

5) a1abdj knows best, because he's just smarter then everybody. And we're not only talking safes.

Actually we are just talking safes. If you could point me towards somebody around here that has more experience and actual hands on knowlege than I do when it comes to safes and vault doors, I'd like to meet them.

A word to the wise. When safe salesmen tell you they're going to sell you 1/4" worth of steel in the body, 1/2" worth of steel in the door make sure they're not adding the inner liner to the outer shell to come up with a cumulative number.

Perhaps you could explain why not? Steel is steel correct?

You will never hear me say that a cumulative thickness is better than the same thickness in a solid sheet, in fact, if you search around, you will see exactly the opposite.

Of course we're not talking steel plate safes here, we're talking about Sturdy safes, which use sheet steel. I'm comparing them to other sheet steel safes. If you want to compare steel plate safes, I'd be happy to do that, but Sturdy can not be part of that conversation.

5 gauge body (0.2188 )plus 7 gauge (0.1875) reinforcement =.4063
That's much thicker the the .25 wall of a B rated safe.

Door 5/16 inch (.3125) plus 7 gauge (0.1875) = .5

You may want to check your math, as your numbers are a bit heavy.

Regardless, you keep wanting to compare apples and oranges. Can you order a safe heavier than a typical gun safe? Sure. Can you get one heavier than that one? Yup. How about one heavier than that? Yes. One even heaier than all of them combined? All day long.

You can add as much steel as you want, to any gun safe that you want, and I can still show you a safe that's more secure.

So overall that's thicker steel then a B Rate Graffunder. And if you add up the price it will be around half, give or take, when you include delivery for the Graffunder.

Yes, but don't listen to a manufacturer when they tell you they're going to sell you .4063" worth of steel in the body, and .5" worth of steel in the door. Make sure they're not adding the inner liner to the outer shell to come up with a cumulative number.

The safe with a solid 1/4" plate and a solid 1/2" door is still the more solid safe.

As I mentioned before Graffunders are really nice safes, it's just good to know your options.

I suppose this is why Sturdy and its supporters get all twisted out of shape when I can sell them a heavier built safe for less than the Sturdy.

 

[a1abdj]

It took a while but I found that thread again. I have the engineer's name and number from UL and I will give him a call Monday (although I'm sure he has better things to do.)

Any update on the details of this call?

 

[788Ham]

ColtPythonElite,

Sorry I didn't get back and get you answered! Yes, it was the FatBoy I was referring too. Also sorry about the web site, not being able to get on, just looked at the magazine I had in hand! The Fat Boy I looked at, sure looked to have a heavier door gauge than 7, looked to me to be thicker than 1/2 anyway, closer to 3/4" , plus the door backing that was affixed to the inside of the door.

 

[a1abdj]

The Fat Boy I looked at, sure looked to have a heavier door gauge than 7, looked to me to be thicker than 1/2 anyway, closer to 3/4" , plus the door backing that was affixed to the inside of the door.

That's an optical illusion created by folding thin steel around a sheet of gypsum board. I believe it's 11 gauge (1/8").