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Police: Armed customer stops KFC robbery

Discussion in 'Legal' started by Desertdog, Aug 21, 2006.

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  1. Desertdog

    Desertdog Member

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    Police: Armed customer stops KFC robbery
    http://www.indystar.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20060818/NEWS01/60818008

    By Vic Ryckaert
    vic.ryckaert@indystar.com
    Police say a would-be robber is in jail this morning after a customer foiled the suspect’s attempted hold-up of a restaurant on the Westside.


    William McMiller Jr., 40, was arrested on an initial charge of robbery after he demanded money and threatened to shoot a cashier at the Kentucky Fried Chicken, 2801 W. 16th Street, at about 3:20 p.m. Thursday, according to Indianapolis police reports.
    McMiller, records show, is being held in the Marion County Jail on $80,000 bond.

    McMiller, police said, ordered a bucket of chicken then told cashier Deanne Slaughter: “Give me the money before I shoot you.”

    The suspect held his hand in his back pocket as if reaching for a gun, police said, then lifted his foot to jump over the counter.

    Paul Sherlock, a customer sitting in the dining room, approached and pointed a Taurus 9-mm handgun towards the suspect’s back.

    The suspect raised his hands over his head, police said. Sherlock ordered him to lean against a window with his hands up until police arrived.

    Police found a long screwdriver, not a gun, in McMiller’s pocket.

    Sherlock told The Star today that he was acting on instinct.

    “I was nervous man, I ain’t gonna lie, not scared though,” he said. “It never crossed my mind that he might try to do something to me.”

    Sherlock was in the restaurant waiting for a friend who works there when the robbery occurred. The suspect was focused on getting the cash and didn’t notice Sherlock moving in from behind.

    He said he hopes McMiller spends some time in prison for the crime.

    “I hope he gets what he deserves,” Sherlock said, “at least a little time to think about what he was doing.”

    Sherlock had a valid gun permit, police said.


    Call Star reporter Vic Ryckaert!at (317) 444-2761.
     
  2. Autolycus

    Autolycus Member

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    Its nice to see people helping out.
     
  3. Biker

    Biker Member

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    Ah, the CCWer passed up a perfect Clint Eastwood moment. When the robber gave up and raised his hands, the hero should've used the classic line, "What's the matter Colonel Sanders....chicken?"

    Biker
     
  4. HighVelocity

    HighVelocity Member

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    I'm dyin over here! :D
     
  5. Ezekiel

    Ezekiel Member

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    This is not a guy I want whipping a gun out in the middle of a robbery when a weapon is not seen. Give the loser his ~$35, some chicken, and get him the Hell out of there: much safer then John Q. playing John Wayne.

    "The Good Guys were lucky here, that's all."
     
  6. roo_ster

    roo_ster Member

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    I'm glad you don't have a say in the decision.

    Maybe you can help eliminate "shall-issue" CHLs in your state of MO so that only folks you think qualified can pack heat.
     
  7. mons meg

    mons meg Member

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    Maybe he missed the part abotui the robber verbally threatening to shoot the cashier... :scrutiny:
     
  8. Vitamin G

    Vitamin G Member

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    Makes me want to see some ballistic tests to see what happens to various JHP's when they go through 1 layer of denim, then 6 feet of air, THEN 1 layer of denim, then the gelatin.
    Just in case I ever work at KFC.

    I like to think i'd have done the same thing. Bonus points for no one dying.
     
  9. Ezekiel

    Ezekiel Member

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    Oh, I'm sure that I get a vote, just like anyone else.

    Let's use some of the knowledge that I happen to have though life experience, education and employment, okay?

    If this loser is holding up a KFC -- they have glass partitions here, by the way -- he's not a Master Criminal. Second, if the weapon is designed to induce fear or be used, he presents it. Finally, although a screwdriver can be a deadly weapon, it is not so dangerous as John Q. interjecting himself into a potentially stressful situation with a firearm. A lot more things go bad with a handgun as compared to a screwdriver, regardless of their equal status as tools.

    (sigh) What you likely had was a lone crackhead, carrying something he could defensibly argue was not a weapon, trying to find something to eat and loose cash for his next rock. Basically, a street urchin.

    Such is MUCH less dangerous then John Q., with delusions of grandeur, deep in the throes of Gun Mentality(tm). :banghead:
     
  10. hankdatank1362

    hankdatank1362 Member

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    That "street urchin" could have quite possibly stabbed some poor girl that didn't give him his money or his extra crispy fast enough. Any threat of violence should be met with superior force and the willingness to back it up, as this good citizen had. Just be glad no one got hurt (Although I wouldn't shed any tears if the crackhead happened to catch one or two hot ones, but in this scenario, it wasn't called for.)
     
  11. El Tejon

    El Tejon Member

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    1. There are no glass partitions in the KFC on the westside of Indianapolis (Speedway).

    2. Whether or not he is a Master Criminal is immaterial. What is at issue is whether the robber is a threat to yourself or others as judged by the reasonable man standard.

    3. I would not discount a screwdriver so quickly; I have seen a murder committed with a shampoo bottle. As well, I have had screwdrivers used in Aggravated Batteries and Att Murder (they work real well in an "ice pick" hold straight into the neck or clavicle). A deadly weapon is per se or manner of use. A screwdriver can be a deadly weapon by either category.

    4. I do agree that the decision to act was optional for Mr. Sherlock. I for one do wholeheartedly agree with Ezek that some who carry guns are subject to Batmanitis. However, Mr. Sherlock was certainly within the law (if the fact pattern is correct [granted big if for the media]) to use his firearm as he did.
     
  12. Desertdog

    Desertdog Member

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    Bradyite.

    More people are probably killed by cops than CCW holders too.
    The next time the BG may have had a gun instead of a screwdriver.

    Good going, Good Guy.
     
  13. rino451

    rino451 Member

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    Could mean that he did what he did w/o regard for his own personal safety. Bravo!

    Regarding possible threats, who is going to go through the mental math:

    Ok, he's already threatened to shoot someone but I don't see a gun so I'll wait until I see a gun.

    Ok, I see a gun, but he's only threatened to use it so I'll wait until I know he will for sure...

    Ok, he just killed the clerk, guess I should act...

    To late. You just lost the initiative and noe someone's dead. Why carry in the first place?

    Sounds like the good guys actions are being criticized because of the weapon being a screwdriver trump his threat to shoot. One HAS to assume that he had a gun and intended to use it. He said as much.

    Win or loose, the Good Guys can't stand idly by definition.
     
  14. Sawdust

    Sawdust Member

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    Yeah, we should just let the poor criminal make-off with his booty. :rolleyes:

    I don't care if he was stealing just one nugget. He threatened the life of another, and he's a thief.

    Good shoe.

    Sawdust
     
  15. Biker

    Biker Member

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    Batmanitis...

    That one got a Bailey's and coffee snort (right out the nose) El Tejon.

    Biker
     
  16. Ezekiel

    Ezekiel Member

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    "You're going to wack a guy for a nugget?"

    Ridiculous.

    "Batmanitis", "Gun Mentality(tm)", "Chairborne Rangers," etc. -- they're all the same people... :banghead:
     
  17. Ezekiel

    Ezekiel Member

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    If you do not do "mental math" before, during and after the perceived threat, you are the threat.

    It's not that hard... :fire:
     
    Last edited: Aug 22, 2006
  18. orangeninja

    orangeninja Member

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    Sometimes CHL holders get shot.......it happened in Tyler when an AK47 maniac was taking out people all over the court house. A CHL holder shot the suspect (from reports) multiple times but the badguy had body armor and killed the CHL holder.

    But in this case I think you've got a clean pinch. Bad guy says he has a gun, who are we to question that? Act accordingly. The suspect is really lucky...the CHL holder could have simply shot him......after all, it was a panicy type of situation.

    BTW........street urchins hurt people all the time.
     
  19. WayneConrad

    WayneConrad Member

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    I am amazed that some of us are willing to let the bad guy claim and act like he is going to kill someone and yet stand by. Clearly, the lawyers and gun grabbers have won when our first thought is not on saving lives, but is instead on how the civil suit and the newspaper article will play out.
     
  20. Ezekiel

    Ezekiel Member

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    "Anything to justify gunplay, right?"

    The loser can say whatever he desires. At the point of John Wayne interception, there had been no weapon production and there was a counter -- minimum -- between the would-be thief and the person "threatened."

    Instead, "Mr. Heroic" sneaks behind the guy like a ninja (how long did that take?), whips out his Taurus, and places two people in the line of fire (what was his backstop?) over some chicken. :barf:

    Give the guy his extra crispy and $35 without escalating, introducing random elements, or otherwise endangering other bovine John Q.-types because you felt like playing Rambo in a restaurant. This is all about environment. Personally, I cannot justify to myself how anyone should get shot over the Colonel's recipe.
     
  21. Biker

    Biker Member

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    Seriously, everything depends upon the terrain and situation. A guy has a screwdriver and wants a couple of wings and $20 ("And throw in some coleslaw!). If he isn't really a threat, do you really want to hole him? There are consequences and reprocussions that accompany a killing that go far beyond the courtroom. Putting a man in the ground - unless he really needs killing - should be the last option.
    A wine-reeking bum toting a Craftsman, flathead WMD can usually be dealt with in a less harsh manner. If he had a gun, he would have shown it in all likelyhood.
    I wouldn't draw down on the guy unless I was reasonably sure he was a real threat.
    Being a hero ain't all it's cracked up to be.
    JMO...

    Biker
     
  22. Ezekiel

    Ezekiel Member

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    Truer words have never been said. :D

    Your analysis is the same as mine, but with a lot less "cynical nature."

    Kudos!
     
  23. Ezekiel

    Ezekiel Member

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    Ease up, Tackleberry! :evil:
     
  24. Thefabulousfink

    Thefabulousfink Member

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    Good men should not abide evil where ever they may find it.

    Yes, there are things that could have been done better.
    Yes, the situation could have turned deadly.

    But the fact of the matter is that no one died and the bad guy is in jail. IMHO if a more John Qs had a bit more John Wayne in them we would have a lot less crack heads thinking that they can rob a place for easy cash.

    But I suppose that is not the MAIN argument for CCW.:rolleyes:
     
  25. Phantom Warrior

    Phantom Warrior Member

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    I think it isn't entirely fair for us to quarterback the situation after the fact. The guy had maybe a minute to make a decision based on incomplete information. He didn't know what the guy was actually packing and he had no idea as to the guy's actual motive and willingness to commit violence. I also don't think it's fair to automatically assume the guy was only interested in $35 and maybe some chicken. Maybe he was. But maybe he would have killed the girl or roughed her up or dragged her along as a hostage to cover his get away. Maybe the simple fact that Sherlock had the drop on him prevented him from doing anything more serious.

    The bottom line is that the situation was resolved without anyone hurt, a crime was prevented (possible several), and the criminal was apprehended. I think this one goes in the win column.
     
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