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Post and Dot style pistol sights

Discussion in 'Handguns: General Discussion' started by daniel craig, Jul 29, 2021.

  1. daniel craig

    daniel craig Member

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    Has anyone used these?

    the back sight is just a shallow V shape with a vertical line and the front sight is just a dot. Seems like this would be good for quick acquisition but I have no idea.
     
  2. The Glockodile

    The Glockodile Member

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  3. Madcap_Magician

    Madcap_Magician Member

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    XS Sights makes sights in this 'lollipop' style. I dislike them, they are fast but imprecise without more practice apparently than I had. Plus, the abundance of more standard sight shapes that now have the majority of the benefit of the big 'dot' - Trijicon HD, etc. with a big orange, yellow, green, or red ring around the front sight tritium and much smaller white rings around the rear sight tritium vials, means you can get more precise sights that are just as fast in my opinion.
     
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  4. Telekinesis

    Telekinesis Member

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    I had a set of XS big dot sights on a glock and they were great for close, fast, and moving shots, but I never was able to be as quick at longer shots as I wanted (while maintaining accuracy).

    I switched them out with Ameriglo I Dots which have a front sight very similar to the Trijicon HD sights and a standard notch rear with a single tritium vial at 6 o’clock. I think it’s a good compromise between an attention grabbing front sight for close/fast shooting and a more traditional sight picture that is useful at distance.
     
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  5. JR24

    JR24 Member

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    Very much the same, but I went with the square box Ameriglo CAP on my Glocks. Have the HD on my HK and I really like those too.
     
  6. shoobe01

    shoobe01 Member

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    Agree generally with this. They are just pistol versions of the express sight, as used mostly (originally?) on dangerous game rifles. In the good old days, the guide would certainly have one on his rifle for a safari, etc. You as the paying hunter likely would not because you are taking a carefully aimed shot at the end of a careful stalk, so want that precision, and may well not be so trained so a sight easier to center up is important. The guide is generally set up to take a snapshot at close and rapidly closing range that must not hit, but location is less critical than A Hit.

    FOF-Bolt_vs_Double_3_F.jpg

    This is basically a step better (more precise) than simply snapshooting.

    The theory is that handguns are always used like that, in defense, at close range, where any hit Now is better than a good hit In A Moment. I am not at all sure I agree as notch-and-post pistol sights are just fine, bright fronts give you the same snapshooting capability, etc. Express sights are harder to line up — as stated — when you have the spare time so there's no fallback when you need to make the longer range or more precise shot because the first ones aren't doing it.

    But... some people like them. No real way to tell until you try them of course, but if you do, get data to not fool yourself. See your scores per time, at various ranges and lighting conditions then run the same drills with the new sights once used to them, and see if better or worse.
     
  7. JTQ

    JTQ Member

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    Post and dot is not just...
    Von Stavenhagen style has been used by SIG, and as mentioned above, the Beretta M9.
    https://www.realgunreviews.com/brief-history-von-stavenhagen-sights/

    They are different than "express sights" as would typically be described like the XS Big Dots https://www.xssights.com/Handgun_Sights_Brand_Selection_Page_pr-8208.aspx

    There are also dot over dot like Heinie Straight 8's https://www.heinie.com/1911-classic-style-straight-eight-sight-set.html

    There is also the horizontal bar and dot like Ameriglo CAP sights https://ameriglo.com/products/listing/glock-cap-sight-sets
     
  8. wgp

    wgp Member

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    I have not tried a rear V/front dot, but I much prefer the rear post/front dot over the common three-dot. Chose the M9 over the 92FS because of the sights on the M9. I also like the Glock horseshoe/front dot.
     
  9. usp9

    usp9 Member

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    Post and dot is Kahr's standard sight. Walther used them for years. Personally I like three dots.
     
  10. herrwalther

    herrwalther Member

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    One of my 1911s came with a blackout rear notch with a white front sight. I changed it to a 3 dot sight within a week after the first range visit. My Walther Q4 also had the same kind of black rear notch. I replaced that with an optic. In short, no I don't like them.
     
  11. .38 Special

    .38 Special Member

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    I despise them, myself. Even on a rifle I prefer a square notch over a V, finding it nearly as fast and much more accurate. On a handgun, with its much shorter sight radius, the speed difference amounts to essentially nothing, while accuracy goes straight to hell. To each his own, as always, but I personally have no use at all for a V on a handgun.
     
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  12. .38 Special

    .38 Special Member

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    Of the post-and-notch sights fitted with dots, I can take them or leave them. I assume the various glow-in-the-dark dots are useful for low-light situations but do not have enough experience with such scenarios to really say. I find dots, lines, etc. somewhat distracting otherwise, and prefer plain, soft black for maximum precision, but can still manage dots when necessary.
     
  13. Nuclear

    Nuclear Member

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    Dot the I iron sights are my favorite, I just wish I could get them for more handguns than old Sigs and Kahrs.
     
  14. 9mmepiphany

    9mmepiphany Moderator Staff Member

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    Express sights work very well on a rifle, but putting them on a pistol indicates a lack of understanding of why they work and how pistols sights work.

    Express sights work on a rifle because you have three points of reference for alignment...the shoulder, the rear notch and the front blade. When you remove the rear point of support, you lose all the advantages of the express sight. XS marketing has won many customer over, but there is no advantage to using this sighting arrangement over traditional notch/post sights
     
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  15. 9mmepiphany

    9mmepiphany Moderator Staff Member

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    I have and they offer no advantage as to acquisition other than in the mind of the user...they are actually slower as distance increases. Anything that this sight arrangement offers can be accomplished with a regular notch in the rear sight.

    A vertical post under the rear notch...like on SIG, Beretta and Kahr...work fine, as you can paint over or just ignore the post. 3-dot sights with 2 dots on the rear are almost as bad as the express sights. Anything on the rear sight will draw you eye to them, when the slide comes into your line of sight, which slows down your ability to align your sights to make a shot.

    The fastest alignment is usually obtained with a blacked out rear and a dot on the front sights. The old Guttersnipe sighting system might have been faster, but it requires a lot more dedicated practice to work reliably
     
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  16. Riomouse911

    Riomouse911 Member

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    For fast reaction, close in combat shooting I doubt you’ll even use sights. I don’t until I’m shooting at 15 feet or more in these situations. When focusing on the threat, the background, other possible threats, your family, whatever, looking toward sights and attaining a sight picture won’t happen.

    It may have been Jim Cirillo (Maybe it’s Ayoob or Leatham?) who had a close combat drill where they trained folks by placing tape over the rear sight and having the shooters use the shape of the gun as a sighting tool for close in gunfighting rather than sights. This skill works great in these fast situations, and practiced shooters will shoot amazingly well should they utilize this type of drill.


    A few of Cirilo’s thoughts:
    https://warriorlife.com/featured/jim-cirillo-3-confessions-of-modern-day-gunfighter/


    If you can get his book Guns, bullets snd gunfights it’s a good read. Obviously it’s dated equipment and ammo-wise, as almost all classic handgunning books are (Sixguns, No Second Place Winner, etc.) but the technique and mindset stuff is really good.

    Stay safe.
     
    Last edited: Aug 5, 2021
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  17. peeplwtchr

    peeplwtchr Member

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    I've got XS big dots. I actually prefer the medium dot they make. These are lightning fast sight acquisition, but you need to train with them to be proficient. They aren't 50yd sights, strictly self defense. I like the TruGlo TFX sights better for ll around use.

    As far as the XS glow in the dark, they light up like headlights.
     

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  18. Zerodefect

    Zerodefect Member

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    Junk.

    Pistol sights should err towards longer distance accuracy. XS bigdots work great at ranges where I really don't even need sights, and then they are far slower at long ranges. It's a lose lose situation. Worst $80 I've ever spent.
     
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  19. 9mmepiphany

    9mmepiphany Moderator Staff Member

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    This is what I lean towards also...their medium dot isn't much better as you still have to deal with a front sight that doesn't present a flat top.

    What the rear blade of the XS sights offer is a way to ignore the "ears" of the rear sight...to prevent slowing down to align them with the top of the front sight. You can easily do the same thing just as quickly, with a conventional rear sight blade, by simply looking through, or over, the notch in the rear sight. What you are in essence sighting with is the top of the slide (see Stressfire sighting)

    In Action Pistol games, with targets largely fairly close, competitors would use any sighting arrangement which would offer any speed advantage. The XS sights were tried when they first came on the market. That no one still uses them in competition would seem to indicate that they offer no speed advantage
     
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  20. wally

    wally Member

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    I first saw an XS sight set on a used Kimber 1911 at a gun show, I asked if the precious owner was Mr Magoo.
    :)

    The basic design is sound on rifles with a gold bead front preferred. My .357 Mag Marlin lever gun had them and they worked great, but with the short sight radius of a handgun just too much ambiguity in the alignment. I'm with Zerodefect they can be very fast at ranges you don't really to use sights.
     
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