Problems with the 45 Auto

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ArchAngelCD

ArchAngelCD

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Hello everyone. A while back I posted a thread asking about the Lee explanation die for the 45 Auto not flaring the neck enough not to shave the cover off a plated bullet. I put the bullets aside for a long while but went back to them last night. I'm still having a problem and I'm fairly sure the expander is just too small. I can get a custom expander plug made by Lee but they want over $30 + Shipping, I'm not spending that. I will however but another die if someone can tell me which might do a better job. Maybe I should just but a Lyman Neck Expander M Die for 45 Cal handguns. Midway USA has them for $22. What say you?
 
I have the 45 Auto Hornady Custom grade set. If you can find just the expander out that set it would probably be pretty cheap and they work well. When I first was learning to load pistol rounds, I accidentally flared a case so much with hornady die, it really looked like a bell. Oops.

I havent used a lot of other dies to compare to, but my hornady ones get the job done, and they give you 100 free bullets when you buy a set
 
Try the Natchez 2015 Master Catalog

It lists die sets and individual dies from several manufacturers
 
http://www.thehighroad.org/showthread.php?t=750503 A tilting bullet , not helped by a universal expander . A custom seating plug that fits the bullet would seem to be the answer?
The Bullet Seater Plug that comes with the die set is as close to generic as we can make it. If you find that the bullet seater plug deforms the nose of the bullet you are trying to seat, we can make a custom bullet seater plug to fit your bullet. For this we would need a sample bullet, payment of $8 plus shipping.
Current lead time is 4 weeks.


Please send sample bullet and your invoice/order ID to:

Lee Precision, Inc.
4275 Highway "U"
Hartford, WI 53027
Click to expand...
http://leeprecision.com/contact-us.html
 
If you followed the instructions for use of the Lee dies and are not getting enough "bell" at the case mouth something is wrong. Check the instructions and be certain to follow them and try again.

Lafitte
 
Bullet shaving on seating - die adjustment.

My shaving of a .452" lead bullet in an RCBS seating die was caused by a to small internal diameter of the die. The bell/flare was removed to soon. To fix ,take a wood dowel and wrap with emery paper. Spin it with a *drill. Open the seating die a few thousands. Test progress by
using an empty case with maximum flare. Measure before and after running part way in to the die. Take 4 measurements, mouth, middle , almost fully in and full in. Do not go to deep with the emery paper/dowel, or the tapered crimp will be removed. bulletseatingdie.jpg
 
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If you've loaded other bullets with that die set, I think the bullets are the problem or your die set-up. Sounds like you aren't flaring the case mouth enough; that's usually the case with plated or cast bullets.
 
I had the same problem with 1 of 5 bullets when seating nominally oversize PC bullets. I got a Lyman Neck Expanding (M) die. Problem solved.
 
Are you sure you set the expanding die correctly?

I use the Lee 45 ACP die set to load 45 ACP with both Berrys and Xtreme plated bullets. I have used the Lee powder through expanding die (mine is marked Lee 45 ACP - C4) both on a Lee Cast Turret press with the Lee powder measure riser and powder measure on top and on a Hornady LockNLoad AP press with the funnel adapter. I have never shaved a bullet. If you are using the funnel adapter make sure that it is screwed down tight. If you are using the powder measure, make sure that the riser and powder measure are screwed all the way into the die. The powder funnel or powder measure provide a stop for the expanders travel. I can adjust mine from too small a bell to too large.
 
I have replaced a couple Lee powder through expander dies with the Lyman M dies and have been happy with the results.
I disliked the common Lee powder drop through ever since I started reloading. I have never used the Lee powder drop they are compatible with and hate the fact that the expander would move up and down inside the die.
 
Hey ARCH,
I know that you know how to set up dies so I think there is a flaw in your die or the bullets. I have the same dies and have no issue with any form of bullet.
 
+1 to what Rule3 said. You know what you're doing... I've not had any issues with the Lee dies loading .45acp using both lead and plated bullets, and even for 45 Auto Rim.

I'm guessing that you've got a lemon somehow.

QUESTION: does chamfering the case help at all? May tell us something.
 
Here is another vote for the Lyman "M" expander die. They will expand the case mouth .002" - .004" without making a flare or bell. The bullet will fit tight in the mouth, stand straight up, and it will seat without shaving the lead or plating.

I use them for both rifle and pistol and am very happy with the results. A flared or belled case mouth will allow the bullet to tilt to one side or the other if you don't hold it straight. The "M" die eliminates that problem.
 
for what it's worth, I loaded a few thousand .45 acp with 230 gr berry's plated round nose before I moved that work to a dillon - no problems with shaving on the lee dies at all
 
Are the cases crushing if the powder through die is turned way down? I can't see the expander being that out of spec.
 
Possible bad die?

I have the Lee dies for .45. I don't have any issue using lead bullets (MBC) and the Pro Autodisk. (autodrum now)
 
I think Rule3 is on to something, sounds like a defective die.

So as Rule3 said, you obviously know how to set up a die Arch, that said, you also know that when adjusted down enough to bell, one can bell a case mouth enough to almost split it. So unless something is wrong with the die, you shouldn't be experiencing any shaving issue's, IMHO.

The only other thing I can add, is that when I trim my handgun brass, and I do, it leaves a sharp lip, both on the inside, and on the outside. So when I ream and chamfer, I always check to make sure the internal lip has been completely removed, other wise it will surely shave. Just a thought if you do trim.

GS
 
ArchAngelCD, as others posted something doesn't sound right.

Could you give us some measurements?

With my Lee dies, after the cases are resized, they measure around .467" at the mouth and I flare the case mouth to about .472" which allows .451"-.452" sized bullets to just sit on the case mouth without tilting. I seat and taper crimp in the same step to .470"-.471" and do not shave the plating off the bullet.

If you are shaving the bullet or tilting the bullet while seating, especially from once fired cases with sharp case mouths, try chamfering the inside of the case. I use the Lee chamfer tool and a light twist on the case mouth does the job for me.
 
Sorry my OP didn't give all the information. The Lee dies are over 10 years old now and I never had a problem with any other bullet but the 185gr Berrys bullet. I know how to adjust dies so I won't need to read the instructions again. I can't get enough explanation to prevent the bullet from tilting ever so slightly and shaving the plating.

243winxb, thanks for the Lee link but how did you find my old thread lol? If the custom expander was only $8 I would have ordered it long ago. They want $30 plus the $8 shipping.

I was really wondering if another company's die would expand the neck slightly more so thank you Walkalong for telling me the RCBS die just might do that.

Sorry, I'm giving up on the Berrys bullets and I throwing out what was left in the box, problem solved... Now back to the regularly scheduled programming.

Thank you all for the help.
 
ArchAngelCD said:
The Lee dies are over 10 years old now and I never had a problem with any other bullet but the 185gr Berrys bullet.
Click to expand...
Many of my Lee dies are 10-20 years old.

Since you experienced shaving of plating problem only with this particular Berry's plated bullets (not sure if you used other Berry's bullets), it could be a batch related issue. Perhaps this particular batch of bullets had issues with plating?

I have used Berry's plated bullets for over 20 years and never experienced shaving of plating with my Lee dies. I have also used HSM/PowerBond/Rainier/RMR/Speer TMJ/X-Treme plated bullets with my Lee dies and have not experienced shaving of plating.

I am curious if the bullets are ever so slightly tilting during seating to cause shaving of plating.

If you are interested, send me some bullet samples to see if I could reproduce the shaving problem. If I have the same problem, you can contact Berry's MFG customer service for replacement.
 
ArchAngelCD is going to send me some of the bullets.

If I experience the same problem of plating shaving with my Lee dies then the bullets will be suspect.

If I do not experience the same problem then problem would be something else.

Will keep you all posted.
 
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