Range Report: The all new Ruger LCR Ricochet!!

Discussion in 'Handguns: Revolvers' started by mesinge2, Jan 3, 2016.

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  1. mesinge2

    mesinge2 Member

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    I was super excited when Ruger released the 9mm LCR. I wanted a 9mm revolver as a back up to a 9mm semi-auto. And as I have Glocks, Berettas, M&Ps, Rugers, etc I did not feel like buying a compact version of each one to share magazines with the full size. I figured the 9mm revolver was perfect if I needed to reload with it the first moonclip would extract and then I could load right from the spare mag in a major emergency.

    And I had to get it before Ruger discontinued another 9mm revolver. I waited too long with the 9mm Sec Six and SP101. Not again.

    Sooooo

    It was a selfish Christmas present to myself :evil:

    My%209mm%20Ruger%20LCR%201_zpst9xjxean.jpg
    My%209mm%20Ruger%20LCR%203_zps2nzjyrap.jpg








    Well with the first range trip I discovered that "with Sturm and Ruger gun shoots you!!"

    I brought 115 grain Winchester white box ammo, 115 grain Federal American Eagle, and Hornady 124 grain JHP/XTP.

    After 15 rounds of the Winchester I had a fun experience. Let me recap: Bang, Bang, Bang, Bang, Poof & and dang that hurt a lot! The fifteenth round out of the gun hit the backstop and came right back and hit me in the leg.

    Now, I have a welt and a decent bruise (come the next morning).

    From what I can gather the round was slowly walking out of the brass, reducing the pressure, and therefore reducing the velocity enough to slow the bullet down enough that it couldn't penetrate the backstop. I chalked it up to the WWB ammo and continued with the test. The Hornady performed flawlessly and made an awesome group. Especially, for a super light 9mm revolver in DAO with a ~1.8" barrel at 15 yards.

    This is 15 rounds of the Hornady XTP at 15 yards aimed at a red pasty from a Shoot-N-C:

    Grouping%20336%20%20%20%209mm%20Ruger%20LCR_zps4dubhnct.jpg


    Then I went to the Federal 115 grain and 40 rounds were flawless, but I was still curious about before. So, in the last ten rounds of that box I fired 4 rounds and inspected the bullet, here is the fifth round below, look how much it walked out of the casing:

    LCR%20Issue%205_zpsgbsxekn2.jpg
    LCR%20Issue%206_zpsthe13dmf.jpg








    The tenth round was worse, when I pulled the moonclip out of the cylinder the bullet was barely in the casing, maybe less then 1mm still in the brass. When I went to reinsert the round the bullet fell out of the front of the cylinder and the powder fell in my hand. The one that fell out of the cylinder is on the right and the one that bounced of the wall and hit me is on the left:

    LCR%20Issue%202_zpsa3nmcgi5.jpg
    LCR%20Issue%204_zps0rlxuxng.jpg












    Ruger will be hearing from me come Monday morning!! :fire:
     
    Last edited: Jan 3, 2016
  2. Dan-O

    Dan-O Member

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    Hardly the guns fault. Other than the fact it's so light it's making that 5th round jump crimp.
     
  3. mesinge2

    mesinge2 Member

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    Two ammo manufacturers though?
     
  4. HexHead

    HexHead Member

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    You had no issue with the Hornady, right? No backing out?

    Your using cheap, crap ammo like WWB and Federal is hardly Ruger's fault. 9mm wasn't made for revolvers, it uses a taper crimp instead of a roll crimp like .38, .357, .44 etc. do. If you're going to use 9mm in a revolver, best load your own and roll crimp it.
     
  5. Sam1911

    Sam1911 Moderator Emeritus

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    Yeah! I've heard that some guns can make your ammo go bad.




    ;)

    Wonder what in the world Ruger could possibly do to hold the bullets in the cases of your ammo for you? But I'm sure they'll be exceedingly polite and let you send it back to them. And will be exceedingly polite when they send it back with a note saying something like, "Inspected: Firearm determined to be within specifications."


    Sometimes ammo doesn't have the proper neck tension to hold the bullet still under recoil. In autos this usually results in the bullets getting pushed back into the case a bit too far, especially when a round in your carry ammo gets chambered a few too many times. In revolvers, bullets can back out and tie up the gun.

    You got unlucky and caught a round that glanced off the backstop just exactly wrong. That wasn't because there wasn't enough pressure in the chamber to properly accelerate the bullet. Just happenstance. If you've not seen bullets bounce back, you haven't shot enough. Happens all the time. Wear your safety glasses and keep a stiff upper lip.



    Saying this is Ruger's fault is like saying Ford is to blame for the odd smell of your car, when you've been driving around your uncle Fred who just went on a bean curd and egg salad diet kick. :D
     
  6. mesinge2

    mesinge2 Member

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    Then the manual or website should denote the gun performs poorly with certain makes of ammunition. I have no use for a gun that in order to practice with I need to spend a fortune on ammo. I generally shoot a few hundreds rounds of ammo a range session. I am not about to shoot this gun with only Hornady for the entire time I own the gun. I have well over 100 handguns in my collection and while I have had issues with WWB (why I initially assumed ammo problems), Federal American Eagle has never let me down in 25 years of experience I have shooting firearms.

    If this is an artifact of the platform in this caliber it is being sold post-haste.

    And before the word "limp-wrist" pops up. The recoil of this gun is very light (and it is quite accurate, I want to like it); I never limp-wrist my 44 mag snubbie:

    Flash5344magwithDeerGrenades.jpg
     
    Last edited: Jan 3, 2016
  7. Sam1911

    Sam1911 Moderator Emeritus

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    Ok, if the concept of a gun working best with certain ammo -- or not working well with certain ammo -- bugs you, sell it.

    No biggie. We tell people all the time that they have to try out a big selection of ammo in their new gun and find out what it most likes to eat. Prove what ammo is most reliable and accurate in their gun, and then buy it THAT ammo. If you've never seen that phenomenon in real life before, now you have, and you can tell your students (you're an instructor, right?) why it is so important that they try different loads in their gun and make sure they're buying suitable ammo for the weapon they're carrying!

    Great teaching/learning point right there!
     
  8. Sam1911

    Sam1911 Moderator Emeritus

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    And you also can give them a very good example of why you ALWAYS practice malfunction drills with whatever gun you're using. Because any ammo can let you down at the worst moment and you have to get that gun back up and in the fight as quickly as possible.

    You can blame the gun...though it is inconceivable why you would. You can blame the ammo. But malfunctions HAPPEN. Better to know how to fix them fast and roll on than continue along telling yourself "my gun is reliable!" No it isn't. You gun, your mags, your ammo, you yourself... just haven't malfunctioned YET. ;)
     
  9. mesinge2

    mesinge2 Member

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    I do tell them that, but all 9mm ammo is a light crimp so, short of loading my own 9mm, it will most likely have this issue with any ammo given enough time with the ammo. Also, the 9mm bullet should not have been able to fall out of the front of the cylinder without applying some force. If the cylinder was properly stepped down like it should have been this would not have been possible.
     
  10. Sam1911

    Sam1911 Moderator Emeritus

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    You're talking about the chamber throats? If you were shooting cast bullets, the throats MIGHT be tight enough to drag on the bullet and keep it from sliding out, but jacketed bullets are sized slightly smaller than cast for the same rounds and most will drop right through the throats. Jacketed 9mm tends to measure about .355". Cast will measure more like .356-.357". The throats will be cut to ... who knows? :) Classically they'd be around .357" but you'd have to measure them very carefully to know for sure.

    Again, not a problem Ruger caused. Just how things are.


    EDIT:

    Ok, doing a little more checking, some folks have found 9mm revolvers with VERY tight throats. Like down to .351"! And they guessed that that might have been done to hold back any bullets that did jump their crimp, as a last ditch effort to try and keep the gun from being tied up by a bullet that slipped forward. That makes a lot of folks mad because swaging your bullets that far down below bore size would be horrid for accuracy and murder on leading if you shoot cast bullets. So those folks were having their throats cut to .355-.356" to get the proper accuracy and stop leading problems.

    Seems Ruger might be "damned if you do, damned if you don't" on that front. Personally, tight throats would drive me NUTS, but I shoot 99% lead, so it would be a killer for me.

    Guess you won't have THAT problem! :)
     
    Last edited: Jan 3, 2016
  11. Master Blaster

    Master Blaster Member

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    A few years ago I bought a Colt revolver that did the same thing with any ammo I tried in it it was a .357 mag Lawman MKIV so it was not a light weight gun. Some times the 6th round would jump crimp enough that it would tie up the cylinder. It did it with my reloads and it did it with factory ammo as well. Shoot four rounds and the fifth and sixth would be backing out of the case. I shot the same ammo out of numerous smiths I own with no problem or signs of bullets moving. As a test I even used some of my .38 special jacketed hollowpoint hand load ammo in my 642 and kept one round in the cylinder for 25 shots and it did not move at all. 6 rounds of the same hand load in the Colt and the fourth and fifth bullets were backing out o the case in the cylinder.

    I sold the revolver because I could never figure the problem out.
     
  12. mesinge2

    mesinge2 Member

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    I just realized that Ruger put the wrong manual in my box, I perused their sight and on page 12 of the 9mm LCR manual it mentions bullets jumping crimp. My manual lacks this page entirely and makes no mention to the 9mm caliber or moonclips at all.
     
  13. Sam1911

    Sam1911 Moderator Emeritus

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    Oh? What does that page say? Just watch out? Or does it have some specific recommendations?
     
  14. mesinge2

    mesinge2 Member

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    Just watch out, no manufacturer recommended or bullet weights.

    https://ruger-docs.s3.amazonaws.com/_manuals/lcr.pdf

     
  15. 460Shooter

    460Shooter Member

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    It sounds like a slight flub on Rugers part with the manual. But I'd try different ammo before complaining at them. You may have a relatively simple solution.
     
  16. mesinge2

    mesinge2 Member

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    Also, the gun is not all that lightweight at 17oz, an all steel S&W model 36 weighs 19.5 oz. The gun's weight shouldn't be an issue here.
     
  17. OilyPablo

    OilyPablo Member

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    Was it the wrong manual altogether or old revision?
     
  18. mesinge2

    mesinge2 Member

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    I think its the old version before they had the 9mm and .327 caliber models available as neither one of them is mentioned.
     
  19. OilyPablo

    OilyPablo Member

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    Oops! Assuming the FFL didn't mix it up, someone at the factory put an old manual in.
     
  20. mesinge2

    mesinge2 Member

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    That could be too.
     
  21. Drail

    Drail Member

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    17 0z. is NOT a lightweight gun? Are you serious?
     
  22. mesinge2

    mesinge2 Member

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    Exactly. Weight, in this case, should not be causing crimp jump.
     
  23. eldon519

    eldon519 Member

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    You seem very concerned with what "should be" which seems to be solely determined by you. I recommend you come to grips with what is, or just move on from the gun. The same thing happens even in the .454 Alaskan, even with premium ammo. It isn't Ruger's fault.

    If you aren't ready to give up, you still have lots of options to try. You could try something like Wolf or Tula, the steel case might have some extra tension on the bullet. Or perhaps try a heavier bullet weight since it'll have more length to hang onto though I suppose it also has more inertia and more recoil. That may be why the XTP held, it is 124 and an HP, both of which will make it longer and thus seated deeper.
     
  24. Sam1911

    Sam1911 Moderator Emeritus

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    :) It is certainly lightweight enough to exacerbate issues with crimp jumping, considering that some 9mm handguns are more than twice as heavy.

    But like Eldon said, it's just the nature of things. If you find a defensive ammo that seems to not do this at all in your gun, GREAT, carry that ammo. And practice your malfunction drills, just like you should anyway. (Understanding that a bound up wheelgun may be a bit harder to get un-stuck than a stovepiped auto.)

    If you just can't trust it, sell it.

    But either way, I sure wouldn't call Ruger and give them an ear-full over something they had nothing to do with.
     
  25. bluetopper

    bluetopper Member

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    Poor factory crimps on those two brands of 9mm ammo, not your guns fault in the slightest. Maybe the next batch of the same brand of ammo might have firmer crimps, who knows? Maybe the next batch of Hornady ammo might not have firm crimps?
    The gun does what it is designed to do, it seems very well.

    Get yourself a 9mm crimping die, set it for a firm crimp and run your factory ammo through it first. That's your only solution.
     
    Last edited: Jan 3, 2016
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