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Rare 1911

Discussion in 'Handguns: Autoloaders' started by gunman42782, Jan 4, 2008.

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  1. gunman42782

    gunman42782 Member

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    Watched American RIfleman TV today and they told of a 1911 made in Canada during the closing days of WW1 by North American Arms (no relation to the NAA mini-revolver that I know of!) that is the rarest of all 1911 variants. Only about 100 of them were made. The price if you can find one in 90-95% condition? $25,500! The bad thing is that because they are so valuable there are a lot of idiots faking them, and they said on the show that there were probably more forgerys floating around than the real guns! Anyway, I thought this very interesting, as I never heard of this particular gun, and here I thought I knew everything!
     
  2. GRIZ22

    GRIZ22 Member

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    I think the rarest 1911s are those made by Singer Sewing Machine during WWII. Not sure of the numbers but is the Canadian made one rarer?
     
  3. CryingWolf

    CryingWolf Member

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    I think Singer made 500 delivered. I think a Singer just recently sold for $46,000 or so.
     
  4. SDC

    SDC Member

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    Yes, the NAA-made ones were produced at the original Ross rifle factory in Quebec, but they had just gotten production started when the war ended. Believe it or not, one of these was used in a robbery up here, with the "take" from the robbery being only a couple of hundred dollars. One of the odd things about these is that they're not serial-numbered on the frame, only on the slide.
     
  5. XDKingslayer

    XDKingslayer member

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    There were only about 100 of the NNA 1911s produced.
     
  6. The Lone Haranguer

    The Lone Haranguer Member

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    I knew I had heard that. :D Talk about irony - his gun could have fetched ten times that, or more.
     
  7. whitebb

    whitebb Member

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    Probably less jail time for the armed robbery than selling a gun in Canada.:what:
     
  8. Superlite27

    Superlite27 Member

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    This is hillarious! Any links to an article? Where can I read about this? Questions abound. Where did he get it? Stolen? Did the robber ever find out how much it was worth? What ever happened to it? Was it destroyed as an "evil" illegal firearm?

    Just.....WOW!
     
  9. SDC

    SDC Member

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    It ended up in a forensic collection up here (sort of lucky, since it's a genuine piece of history), but I bet he's still kicking himself over that boner. I didn't hear where HE got it from, though. The Canadian War Museum has an amazing collection of firearms that includes at least one of these as well, but they hardly ever go on display.
     
  10. HisSoldier

    HisSoldier Member

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    No, one wouldn't want to traumatize people by letting them see a murderous handgun. Guns make normal good hearted people into murderers! Just seeing one is about all it takes, the spirit of evil so pervades them.
     
  11. BlindJustice

    BlindJustice Member

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    I think Singer made about 800 during WWII then
    shifted to manufature other items for the War.
    Anybody know the numbers of 1911s produced by
    COlt
    Remington-Rand
    Ithaca
    During WWII?

    or how many of the Norwegian 1914 were produced.?
     
  12. bannockburn

    bannockburn Member

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    Blind Justice

    As I understood it, the Singer 1911s were produced as sort of a pilot program, to see if any manufacturer could produce weapons if given the equipment to do it with. This was in 1941, and Singer produced the 500 pistols by early 1942. The equipment was then taken out and sent to the Ithaca Gun Co. for further production. Singer 1911A1s were the only pistols to have an S prefix with the serial number.
     
  13. bannockburn

    bannockburn Member

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    gunman42782

    Apparently NAACO never ran a complete production run of the 1911s; it really was more like the Singer experiment, sort of like a prototype run. It is believed that the whole series was definitely less than 100, making these the rarest of 1911s.

    BlindJustice

    Some numbers that you requested; not real sure as to their accuracy:
    Colt-478,000+
    Ithaca-381,500+
    Remington-Rand-1,082,000+
    Singer-500
    United Switch and Signal-50,000
    Norwegian-300 Colt M1911 for trials
    -33,000 M1914 produced by Kongsberg Vapenfabrik (via FN)
     
    Last edited: Jan 5, 2008
  14. CryingWolf

    CryingWolf Member

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    Singer was awarded educational order No. W-ORD-396 for the manufacture of 500 M1911A1 cal. .45 pistols on April 17, 1940. The contract was to be completed by May 1, 1942. All 500 pistols of the order were posted in Ordinance procurement records by December 1941. They were then shipped to Springfield Armory and distributed mostly to Army Air Corps.
     
  15. CryingWolf

    CryingWolf Member

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    North American Arms: S/N 1 to 100 & S/N's 111, 222, 333, 444, 555 = July 1, 1918 to Dec. 4, 1918. They are very rare and rank in value with Singer models. (None of these were reported shipped to any branch of the military but about 100 regular models and about 5 presentation models were manufactured in Quebec, Canada by the North American Arms Company, Ltd.)
     
  16. CryingWolf

    CryingWolf Member

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    More info on the government contracts;

     
  17. Noxx

    Noxx Member

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    Bannock the US&S count is 50,000. I had the good fortune to get my hands on a nice example last year.
     
  18. NAA.45

    NAA.45 Member

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    North American Arms .45

    Very interresting posts.In the 1999 July/August American Handgunner issue there was an article called "Gimme the money,or maby buy my gun".It was recalling the 1990 story about Danny Simpson of Ottawa Canada. He is the guy that did the bank heist...with a North American Arms .45 pistol. For some reason, I remembered this story and I got one in 2000. This prototype was chrome plated sometime in the 60's.If someone had information regarding pistol the "de-chroming"procedure, I would appreciate greatly. NAA.45, Québec, Canada.
     
  19. NAA.45

    NAA.45 Member

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    North American Arms .45

    ...you can email me direct ve2psq@amsat.org Regards.
     
  20. 2RCO

    2RCO Member

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    Dechroming is fairly uncompicated. It's basically changing the polarity around on a a chroming rig. Caswell plating sells some amateur use stuff.

    By the way if anyone has an original example for sale contact me I know of Singers that have brought over $50k in private sales. I would think one of these might be worth a bit more than the OP's assertion if properly marketed.
     
  21. DMK

    DMK Member

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    the 500 or so Singers were actually issued weren't they? If I understand correctly, NAAs were not bought by the US government (or at least not acquired). I guess NAA sold them commercially?
     
  22. NAA.45

    NAA.45 Member

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    Naa.45

    In 1918 WW1 ended and the NAA pistols did not cross the border.The prototypes or pre-production pistols (approx. 100) were not delivered to the U.S Gov.for whom they were intended .The contract was cancelled. It would be interresting to know how many of these "toolrom pistols" are still in circulation today. From what I know, here in Québec where they were made, mine excluded, I have heard of only 2 other NAAs that have been acquired by Americans. Being by definition non-military would make it more simple.
     
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