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Realistically what would you have done...

Discussion in 'General Gun Discussions' started by Joe7cri, Apr 26, 2006.

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  1. Joe7cri

    Joe7cri Member

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    Lately I've been thinking what I would have done if I lived in N.O. and the national guard came to confiscate my guns. I think I would have giving them a shot gun, .22 rifle, and 9mm. and hope they move on without finding the rest. Just curious what others would do?

    Please give it some thought before posting that they can take it from your cold dead hands!
     
  2. Declaration Day

    Declaration Day Member

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    Guns? I lost all of mine in a tragic, uh, boating accident. Yeah, that's it. Don't worry officer, no guns around here.
     
  3. cosine

    cosine Member

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    I don't think you'll get a lot of takers on this scenario... :uhoh:
     
  4. Alex45ACP

    Alex45ACP Member

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    Hm... well, I've thought about it...

    From my cold, dead hands.
     
  5. WayneConrad

    WayneConrad Member

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    What thought is needed? I'll give 'em all the bullets they want. No charge. They can have the guns as a bonus gift once all the bullets are gone.
     
  6. Joe7cri

    Joe7cri Member

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    I guess it's a debate between being killed in a shoot with police or die unarmed by the criminals who are trying to take your food:confused:
     
  7. Ryder

    Ryder Member

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    Smash my locked doors in? I'll make you famous. :D
     
  8. Low-Sci

    Low-Sci Member

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    Realistically, excellent question...

    I would have handed them over. Maybe I would've kept one hidden, but I wouldn't have shot at them.

    I have two cousins and one very good friend in the service. Which makes me realize that even if he's confiscating my weapons, there's probably a kid about my age underneath the armor and fatigues with cousins and a best buddy of his own , both of which want to see that poor bastard again someday.

    And when the whole mess is over, I'll get my guns back. They'll be returned to me. If I shoot that kid, I'm gonna die, because his buddies are gonna light me up like a dutch brothel, and they'd be right to. They came bearing me no ill will, threatening no violence, and for that I killed their friend? I hope to hell they'd shoot me.

    And when it really comes down to it, from a tactical standpoint, this is just like a theft shoot/no-shoot situation. An armed thief wants my TV? Take it. My golf clubs? Take em'. Just don't hurt me or mine.

    After all, what a sh*tty thing to kill a good man over.
     
  9. silicon wolverine

    silicon wolverine member

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    That depends on how you take problems with authority. Would you roll over and be a good sheeple or not? Me? i think id say go away, youre not taking them. IF you taek them by force ill retaliate. I dont know a single cop thats gonna bust youre door down when he knows you'll start slingin' lead.

    SW
     
  10. BullfrogKen

    BullfrogKen Moderator Emeritus

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    In New Orleans specifically?

    Realistically - Write them off on the flood damage policy, along with the rest of our belongings.

    Since the news coverage I saw suggested that those who didn't evacuate before the storm, got evacuated afterwards, there wasn't much to stop someone from coming in after I was gone to get them, anyway.
     
  11. Lupinus

    Lupinus Member

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    depends

    Family with me? I smile nod give over a gun or two sue them later and in the meantime protect my family with a gun I have stashed where happy police officer doesn't see it. I am of more use to my family alive then I am dead for making a stand.

    No family? Well I will likely be in one of them, but there will be a number of body bags corresponding to how much ammo I have and hot good a shot the people coming to confiscate are. If I don't have a family to worry about protecting my guns will indeed come only from my dead hands.

    This depends on the overall situation. If there is a nightly raiding party of armed thugs coming by my door I will fight regardless because we are likely to die without them anyway.
     
  12. Low-Sci

    Low-Sci Member

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    Its not about a problem with authority...

    My hangup isn't that its an authority figure. My hangup is from a tactical standpoint, the shoot solution seems like a miserable, terrible, exceedingly bad idea.

    Tell the cops that if they come back you'll start shooting? That won't make you any friends. You'll very quickly become the quintessential "barricaded maniac" and you'll be all over the news, and so will the footage of the firefight that you'll lose to the SWAT team or national guard. Maybe you were right to say they're not gonna take your guns. But you're dead now, and you shot at LEOs or Military who were only doing as they were ordered.

    After Katrina, confiscated weapons were court-ordered to be returned to their owners. So this would be at worst a momentary but severe breach of your second amendment rights. But if you decide to be a fanatic about it, that momentary breach will last the rest of your life.

    But of course maybe being dead and taking a few fascist pigs with you was worth it. A couple more grieving families to add to the already senseless tragedy. Good plan.
     
  13. WayneConrad

    WayneConrad Member

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    "They came bearing me no ill will, threatening no violence..."

    Aw, nuts. I didn't say I'd enjoy giving the nice kids all of my bullets. If someone takes my guns by force, they are threatening violence. If not now, then later, because they have removed my ability to defend myself.
     
  14. evan price

    evan price Member

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    Why the hell would the NG be taking guns anyway? Did this really happen? If so, what justification did they give for disarming the populous? If I lived in N.O. and had to face looters & thieves damn straight I would have my pistols on my hip and a 12-ga on my lap. Try and take them!
     
  15. Standing Wolf

    Standing Wolf Member in memoriam

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    I wouldn't have stayed in New Orleans in the proverbial "first place."
     
  16. Low-Sci

    Low-Sci Member

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    +1 Standing Wolf...

    I guess just being in a situation where this kind of decision has to be made means you've violated Rule 1 of SHTF procedure, which is always getting the hell outta dodge.
     
  17. Don't Tread On Me

    Don't Tread On Me Member

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    1] There's no fighting them unless there's a semi-organized effort (ie neighbors and others participating). You wouldn't want a confrontation infront a home or when they are expecting it. You'd want to organize, then ambush them on their confiscation route. Get them in the open with a massive hail of gunfire. Then run or evade. The longer range, the better. Think Lexington/Concord - but more guerilla style than even those battles.

    2] You don't have a choice as to whether or not you'd "give" them a particular gun.

    WAKE UP.

    You aren't giving squat - THEY'RE TAKING.

    You will be handcuffed infront of your home like a criminal while they ransack your home to find any arms that they can. The premise of the thread starter's post is that there's a cooperative nature to this. There is not. This is a forced confiscation. They are the master, you are the bitch. End of story.


    3] If you thought about fighting back without an organized plan, you'd lose, because the 2-3 cops who banged the doors down had an entire platoon of National Guardsmen with fully automatic weapons fresh from Iraq. If you shoot the cops, they NG on your street will shoot back and take you out with their freshly acquired urban combat skills. They will saturate you and your home with firepower. If you've seen raw footage of what our guys do in Iraq, trust me, you don't want to go up against that. At least the Iraqi's have full-autos, RPGs and 2ft thick solid concrete wall contruction virtually everywhere for cover. You have semi-autos, no explosives or rockets, and wooden or cinderblock homes, and worst of all - no experience. Good luck.


    Amazing, the cops are the badguys, but the brainwashed nationalists condemn any negative statement about the NG, despite their participation to guarantee the of authority of the police via physical presence of force which makes them 100% complicit in the crimes. As if anyone is impuning their Iraq service. It is the participation of *some* NG in the confiscations that makes them the enemies of freedom. Sorry, had to throw that in.


    Since all of these options look bleak. The best idea is to not keep all your eggs in one basket. Way before any disaster, one should hide rifles and ammo in different locations that will not be easily found by confiscators. Let them take what they can find, then later on it is your choice what to do - at least you'll be armed. You can dig up your arms, and use them for defense against looters and to stay low, of if a "movement" rises up, join them and get a little justice later on.
     
  18. Low-Sci

    Low-Sci Member

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    Not at all...

    I didn't mean to suggest that the NG was good and the cops were bad. Both are good, but they're doing a bad thing.

    But here's my real rub with a shooting solution: the weapons that were confiscated were ordered to be returned to the owners. So are we seriously going to mount an insurgency over what is a momentary, if extreme, lapse of judgement? Is it really worth killing a man to hang onto your weapon for another week instead of just, you know, leaving and taking the damn guns with you?
     
  19. c_yeager

    c_yeager Member

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    One look at me and a lot of people simply assume that I have a firearm of some kind. I have two guns that dont work for a damn that I would *LOVE* to get rid of. I would hand those over to assuage their jack booted desires and count myself lucky to be rid of them.
     
  20. oops!

    oops! Member

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    So, you're for the 2nd, as long as it doesn't mean actually standing up for it.
    Any wimp can right a check to the NRA.
     
  21. SilentStalker

    SilentStalker Member

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    Um, I guess that depends on why they were taking them in the first place. I mean isn't confiscating our guns without grounds against our constitutional rights? I do believe it is so they better have a damn good reason as to why they would want mine.
     
  22. Low-Sci

    Low-Sci Member

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    Uh, no...

    I'm for the 2nd amendment, but I also don't find it an unreasonable effort to find a way to avoid death and destruction where possible. These are bad things.

    Of course you need to stand up for your second amendment rights. However, that stand can and most definately should manifest itself in a peaceful way long before a violent road should be considered.

    If you find yourself in a Katrina-type disaster, you have lots of options. Your first and best bet is to leave the disaster area as quickly and safely as possible, thus avoiding a potential confiscation. Once you're out and yours are safe, raise pure hell about confiscations and don't stop until some action is taken.

    Second, if your gun will be confiscated, you have to personally evaluate the risk. If you resist with a deadly weapon, you're a dead man. Congratulations for fighting the good fight, its gotten you killed, and anyone who might have relied on you for protection is out of luck.

    If you're really spoiling for a fight, and a natural disaster strikes and you want to be part of the devastation, by all means load up that thar lever action and saddle up. John Wayne's got nothing on you except a couple pounds of brain, and you move faster without it.

    My point is there are better ways to protect your right to bear arms than by using them against other people, and the best way is to stay alive, protect who you need to protect, and then raise some hell about it.

    If nothing else, consider this: How will the media spin your death when you die trying to ambush a group of police or NG who were confiscating weapons? They're going to explain to the nation that you were a psychopath with a high-power weapon who lauched an assault on NG disaster relief personnel, and that spin is a terrible blow to the rest of the gun-owning nation.

    Use your head more, your itchy trigger finger less.
     
  23. WayneConrad

    WayneConrad Member

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    "John Wayne's got nothing on you except a couple pounds of brain, and you move faster without it."

    Easy, now. No need to be insulting.

    This is the prisoner's dilemma writ large. When each person optimizes for their own well being, the least favorable outcome is the result.
     
  24. Low-Sci

    Low-Sci Member

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    You're right...

    That comment was uncalled for and I apologize. It wasn't directed towards any person in particular, I just meant to use it to explain how the rationale of an aggressive response struck me.

    It just perturbs me that some people think that the only way to protect a freedom is to frag someone.
     
  25. WayneConrad

    WayneConrad Member

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    I understand, and your point is well taken. There are always choices.
     
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