Quantcast
  1. This site uses cookies. By continuing to use this site, you are agreeing to our use of cookies. Learn More.

Red Dot on an AK: What's the best way?

Discussion in 'Rifle Country' started by Nightcrawler, Oct 1, 2006.

Thread Status:
Not open for further replies.
  1. Nightcrawler

    Nightcrawler Member

    Joined:
    Dec 24, 2002
    Messages:
    6,950
    Location:
    Utah, inside the Terraformed Zone
    What's the best way to mount a red dot sight, like an Aimpoint, on a Kalashnikov clone?

    There are some mounts from TANTAL that I think would work well.

    [​IMG]

    I wonder if this is offset to the left like most AK optics are? If so, it's no good for me. I'm a lefty.

    Or you can use an ULTIMAK mount.

    maadiarg.jpg

    What else?

    I wonder. If you used a ghost-ring rear sight, mounted on the dust cover, such as the ones available from Tromix and Krebs, if you couldn't attach a little bit of Picatinny rail to the old sight base. It'd be perfect for mounting an Aimpoint Comp or an Eotech.

    I think that with any of these solutions you'd need a cheek pad for proper cheek weld. Cheek weld isn't important with a red dot/collimating sight, but I do prefer to have a solid cheek weld.
     
  2. MrTuffPaws

    MrTuffPaws Member

    Joined:
    Oct 7, 2004
    Messages:
    1,511
    Location:
    Az
    Something mounted to the gas tube should be fine. Receiver covers are unstable
     
  3. beerslurpy

    beerslurpy member

    Joined:
    Nov 8, 2004
    Messages:
    4,438
    Location:
    Spring Hill, Florida
    That isnt a dust cover. It is mounted on the side and arches over the receiver.
     
  4. TIMC

    TIMC Member

    Joined:
    Feb 16, 2003
    Messages:
    2,807
    Location:
    Texas
    I prefer the Ultimak mount, the most stable mount I have seen for the AK. The one thing I did find was a cheek piece was needed for a good cheek weld. I have instant sight alignment as soon as my cheek hits the stock.
    SAR1withlaser.jpg
     
  5. aka108

    aka108 Member

    Joined:
    Aug 26, 2006
    Messages:
    1,988
    Location:
    Tallahassee, FL
    Contact a company in SLC, UT named ANVS. Toll free is 1-800-561-2345.
    They have a AK to Weaver mount in low or high profile that puts you scope over the bore centerline. Cost is around 50 bucks. If you get one, take out the screws and add loctite or similar.
     
  6. MyRoad

    MyRoad Member

    Joined:
    Aug 13, 2003
    Messages:
    620
    Location:
    Oregon
    I have mine on one of those "Made in Belaris" side rail scope mounts. I like it because it allows me to use the iron sights without removing it (you never know when batteries will fail). I find the extra height works well; with the rifle shouldered all I need to do is tip my head slightly and the sight is accessible. With my head fairly upright, it is a more natural position for moving or walking.
    [​IMG]
     
  7. Coronach

    Coronach Moderator Emeritus

    Joined:
    Dec 20, 2002
    Messages:
    11,109
    1. Dustcover mount.
    Pro: Puts it back close to the eye, reasonably low.
    Con: Probably stable while attached, but it won't rezero well if you take it off and reattach.

    2. Siderail mount
    Pro: Cheap, easy, QD with good rezeroing, authenticity: In Soviet Russia, siderail mounts you.
    Con: I have yet to see one that is not offset to the left (some are worse than others), and they sit up pretty high (some higher than others). If you like your cheekweld, you might need a cheekpiece.

    3. Ultimak
    Pro: About as low as you can get. Rock solid.
    Con: Not the cheapest option. Forces you to use the red dot in a scout-like configuration (not really a bad thing, but it might not be your preference).

    I have a PK-AS on a siderail mount, and the only thing annoying about the scope is that it sits waaaaaay left. I have a weaver-rail sidemount as well, and the only thing wrong with that is that it sits a little high. I do not have an Ultimak, but I have played with them.

    If I was going to mount a red dot on an AK again, Ultimak is the way I would go.

    Mike
     
  8. Texfire

    Texfire Member

    Joined:
    Sep 22, 2005
    Messages:
    603
    Location:
    Austin, Texas
    I got the Ultimak because my Kalashnicopy doesn't have a siderail and because of the left offset problem you mentioned. Since it bolts to the barrel, it's a very solid mount for a long eye relief scope. If you want to cowitness with a red dot then be warned that the sight plane is very low access. I can cowitness with a 30mm BSA, but not with a 40mm red dot. I'm probably going to get the railed forend from Ultimak I'm so happy with the scope mount.

    Tex
     
  9. MechAg94

    MechAg94 Member

    Joined:
    Apr 17, 2005
    Messages:
    4,748
    The Tantal mount above is not offset to the left. It is pretty well centered. However, it does mount low and blocks the iron sights.
    There was some movement of the zero at 100 yards when removing and reinstalling, but it was still on paper. I was using a 1.5-5X Simmons scope to play around.
     
  10. Coronach

    Coronach Moderator Emeritus

    Joined:
    Dec 20, 2002
    Messages:
    11,109
    I have the Tantal mount. It is offset to the left, but only by a little.

    Mike
     
  11. MechAg94

    MechAg94 Member

    Joined:
    Apr 17, 2005
    Messages:
    4,748
    Okay, you might be right. I haven't used it in a while. I need to get an Aimpoint or something instead of a scope so it has some value in the dark.
     
  12. Crosshair

    Crosshair Member

    Joined:
    Mar 25, 2005
    Messages:
    1,985
    Location:
    Grand Forks, North Dakota
    Personaly I like the side rail. You can keep multiple optics for the rifle and swap them at will. One day you can have a red dot, another you can have a 6 power scope on it.
     
  13. Nightcrawler

    Nightcrawler Member

    Joined:
    Dec 24, 2002
    Messages:
    6,950
    Location:
    Utah, inside the Terraformed Zone
    Yeah, BUT....if everything is indeed offset to the left, then it's no good. I'm left handed, and even a little left-offset can really make the optic uncomfortable to use.

    If indeed I get around to buying one of Correia's .308 AKs, I'm probably just going to put an Aimpoint Comp C on it anyway.
     
  14. KadicDeshi

    KadicDeshi Member

    Joined:
    Apr 6, 2004
    Messages:
    220
    Location:
    Tulsa, OK
    If you mean the Saiga, you can forget the Ultimak. The .308 barrel is too large in diameter for the U-bolts used to secure the tube to the barrel.

    I'm sure you've already looked into it, but if you haven't, consider the Kobra red dots. I think that's what I'll be getting for my 16" .308 Saiga. Hopefully, I can order it fairly soon and maybe get it and Correia's 20 rd mags in around the same time. Talk about sittin' pretty...
    :cool:

    Barrett

    Edited to add: If someone happens to know how to overcome the barrel diameter problem for the Ultimak, please let us know. I'd love to have one on my .308.
     
  15. Nightcrawler

    Nightcrawler Member

    Joined:
    Dec 24, 2002
    Messages:
    6,950
    Location:
    Utah, inside the Terraformed Zone
    I think the Ultimak intended for the Vepr, which has a heavier barrel, might work.

    I've played with a Kobra sight, and...eh. They're okay.
     
  16. the naked prophet

    the naked prophet Member

    Joined:
    Feb 20, 2006
    Messages:
    1,237
    Location:
    MO
  17. Nightcrawler

    Nightcrawler Member

    Joined:
    Dec 24, 2002
    Messages:
    6,950
    Location:
    Utah, inside the Terraformed Zone
    On the Kontrary. I've examined the Kobras, as I've said, and...no thanks. For one, it sits WAY too high.
     
  18. AK103K

    AK103K Member

    Joined:
    Dec 27, 2002
    Messages:
    5,774
    The Ultimak is really the only way to go. Keeps everything low and up front, out of the way. Works well with either a Scout type or pistol scope, and even better with a good red dot. If you use the right mount/rings, you can pop one off and another on and back again, with no loss of zero. With some, you can also cowitness your iron sights. Even if it wont, if for some reason the optic takes a dump, its gone in a second with the flip of a lever.

    Most all the other mounts sit to high to shoot comfortably and/or naturally with. The Kobras are also big and in your face, and tend to block your field of view.

    With the low mounted forward sight, your field of view is open and the rifle shoulders and shoots like a gun with iron sights. You get basically the same cheek weld. Snap shots are very fast and easy, as are quick shots on multiple targets.
     
  19. rbernie
    • Contributing Member

    rbernie Member

    Joined:
    Jan 21, 2004
    Messages:
    20,681
    Location:
    Norra Texas
    I have the Tantal low mount shown above. It is offset to the left a bit on my Saiga, and is also not perfectly indexed parallel to the centerline of the bore. I'm not sure if it's the mount or the receiver, but the end result is I now have a Tantal mount that sits on the shelf collecting dust rather than being mounted on my rifle...

    The Ultimak was my next choice, but it supposedly doesn't work on the Saigas without a lot of effort due to the forearm differences between the Saiga and the AKMs.
     
    Last edited: Oct 1, 2006
  20. AK103K

    AK103K Member

    Joined:
    Dec 27, 2002
    Messages:
    5,774
    Is your Saiga one of the ones not converted? If so, I'd contact Ultimak and ask what you need to do. I'm pretty sure I've seen them in pics on those rifles in that configuration before. You may just need to modify the handguard a little.

    I have a Krebs Saiga conversion, and the standard mount popped right on.

    [​IMG]
     
  21. Nightcrawler

    Nightcrawler Member

    Joined:
    Dec 24, 2002
    Messages:
    6,950
    Location:
    Utah, inside the Terraformed Zone
    If I get the Saiga, it'll be a .308. I think the argument is that the .308 has a heavier barrel and therefore the regular Ultimak mount won't fit, regardless of handguards. That's why I suggested that a Vepr mount could work, since the Vepr also has a heavy barrel.
     
  22. rbernie
    • Contributing Member

    rbernie Member

    Joined:
    Jan 21, 2004
    Messages:
    20,681
    Location:
    Norra Texas
    They told me that I had two options - 'heavily modify' the stock forearm (their words, verbatim) or go with their ACR replacement railed forearm thingee that goes out the door for a cool $220, then add the Ultimak rail for another $100. Heck, at that point the rail system is worth $100 more than the bloody rifle. ;)

    I'm shooting with irons right now - it's what I can afford, evidently.
     
  23. KadicDeshi

    KadicDeshi Member

    Joined:
    Apr 6, 2004
    Messages:
    220
    Location:
    Tulsa, OK
    Somehow, I don't think that a simple handguard swap would solve the problems. According to one of the guys at the Saiga forum, the VEPR barrel is narrower at the trunion than the Saiga 308.

    http://forum.saiga-12.com/index.php?showtopic=11548&hl=

    So, even the VEPR model's barrel clamps will need to be modded in order to work. I have absolutely no clue to what extent we're talking here. But, I do know that you'd have to trim the handguards if remaining stock or, if taking the ACR2 route, modify that handguard's barrel clamps as well. ( It's been done. -> http://forum.saiga-12.com/index.php?showtopic=12203&hl= )

    I'm hoping someone will come up with an idea for modding or replacing the clamps on the Ultimak such that it is usable on the 308. Heck, if someone's got an idea that sounds plausible to me and I've got the available stuff to work on it, I'll take the plunge and order an Ultimak to try it out and let everyone know how it turns out.

    Anyone?

    Barrett
     
  24. clange

    clange Member

    Joined:
    Dec 27, 2002
    Messages:
    786
    I like the kobras. The only bad thing is they're a little high. They block the irons but it only takes about 1 second to get it off the rifle if you need to. I havent found that they block field of view, rather the opposite. Since you use them with both eyes open, having the sight closer to your eye makes it 'disappear' more than a scout mounted sight would I suspect.

    The ultimaks do look nice, the cost would be a lot more though.
     
  25. Nightcrawler

    Nightcrawler Member

    Joined:
    Dec 24, 2002
    Messages:
    6,950
    Location:
    Utah, inside the Terraformed Zone
    Kobras don't have 50,000 hours of battery life like the new Aimpoints do either.

    Well, crap. If I can't mount my sight of choice on there, that kind of deal-breaks the Saiga .308 for me.
     
Thread Status:
Not open for further replies.

Share This Page