Reloading .45-70 Gov't

[Ireload2]

My comment was solely referring to the human discomfort of shooting any reasonable load with those powders in a Contender. A friend of mine had to try that in his Contender and predictably got rid of his 45-70 barrel.

I'm aware of the frame stretching issue with Contenders and the .45-70, so I've been keeping close to the starting loads. My Sierra and Hornady books even have dedicated handgun loads listed, with Hornady noting they got best results from H322.

I also get a kick out of the comments in the Hornady book about "severe recoil and wear and tear on both the shooter and the firearm..." (and I'll wholeheartedly agree with their assessment).

The other thing I find interesting is in the Sierra book. The description in the pistol section states "Loads reduced below these are not recommended". But when I turn to the Trapdoor loads in the same book, every powder listed has a lower starting point than the "do not reduce below" pistol loads.

 

[Keyfer 55]

I've had a NEF 4570 for 20 yrs. Love it.
I have always reloaded my own ammo.
I've got a Lyman 4 die set and cast w/w 500 gr. rnfp gas check, IMR 4198 ,1250 to 1300 fps. I hunt
Mostly hogs at that velocity never recovered a bullet yet .

 

[GarrettJ]

My comment was solely referring to the human discomfort of shooting any reasonable load with those powders in a Contender.

Well, I can't disagree with you there.

 

[Walkalong]

Yea, some folks like recoil more than others.

It would likely be over my threshold of 'fun" as well.

Good news is as handloaders we can load from mild to wild. My Ruger rifle in .458 WM is like shooting a pop gun with a load of Trailboss, about like a .45-70 with A 5744, and of course it gets more interesting with full loads.

I almost bought a handi rifle in .45-70 years ago.

I am using a Lyman EZ Trim (Actually bought the pistol one) trimmer with a home made mandrel for trimming.

 

[JimA]

Starline brass has worked for me so far, so I'll get more of that. I still have no case trimmer, and it seems like most of you don't think trimming is a big deal. I suppose it won't be.... until/unless it is. I'll see how the brass is when I get it.

So now I'm on to primers, powder, and bullets. I suppose bullets should be first. I think I might try to find a coated 350gr. I know some of you have recommended slugging the barrel, but I don't know how to go about that. The rifle is not a Marlin, it's a Henry H010, with an 18.5" barrel. But it seems from what I can gather looking around on the web that people are finding their guns to be a 0.457" bore diameter. So I might just try something with a medium BHN and see how it goes.

I have a Henry 45-70 and it shoots fine with traditionally lubed .458 cast bullets. I started powder coating my cast bullets a couple of years ago and size them to .458 also. I'm not going back to regular lube. The coated bullets shoot very clean and don't smoke. They are also nicer to handle when reloading.

 

[Riomouse911]

My 1895G came with the ported barrel, but the brick-hard recoil pad probably makes any recoil reduction from the ports a push.

I also use 4198 and 3031, and bullets from 300-405 in both cast and jacketed styles. I like Dillon case lube, W-W cases and WLR primers; I’ve found this combo to work for me. My dies are Lee, and I’ve probably loaded 2k with them over the years with no issues whatsoever.

The .45/70 is as much fun as any pistol cartridge to load, and even more fun to shoot.

Congrats on joining the .45/70 fraternity, and stay safe!

 

[RecoilRob]

Several years ago a friend of a friend bought a lightly used 1895 that came with two empty boxes of Remington 405's which were all that had been put through the gun before the owner decided that it wasn't for him and sold it. New owner wanted 'maximum loads' and when I talked to him a bit it was obvious he really didn't know what he had or what he was actually asking for....so I convinced him to let me load a 'sampler' starting mild and working up to the heavy stuff. I wasn't there when he tried them but was told he went straight for the 425 cast heavies over 47grains of RL-7...which is STOUT and max for lever Marlins. He fired exactly ONE...then handed the rifle to others to use up the rest and promptly sold it afterwards. Not exactly sure what he was thinking...but as others have said the 45-70 doesn't need to be hot-rodded to work on any critter you might want to take, and the 405's at Trapdoor levels are exceedingly pleasant to shoot IMHO.

 

[Riomouse911]

Ya, despite the rainbow trajectory with the slower loads, the old 405 LFN at just above Springfield speeds will probably push clean through just about anything hunted in the US. The majority of my loads are of this vintage, but I'll toss together a few 405 gr JFP stouties just to let folks feel the boom.

The "near .458 level" loadings are somewhat miserable in the smaller 1895G... it's like shooting a 3" 12 gauge slug through a 18" 870. Lotsa WOW!!, but IMHO they're not a lot of fun after two or three.

 

[Charlie98]

My previous experience loading and shooting .45-70 was with a Browning 1886 SRC... just a beautiful rifle and fun to shoot. Back then, I only shot jacketed, usually the 300grn Sierra over RL7, IMR4895, or H322... and that age I don't really recall them being that stout.

When I recently picked up a nice Marlin 1895 LTD, I just reverted back to my old notes... and loaded mid-level 'modern lever' loads with a 350grn cast bullet, using IMR4895 and IMR4064. Wowser! I just don't remember the recoil being that severe! So, nowadays, I just load nice high-end trapdoor/low-end modern lever loads with fast powders like IMR's 4227, 4198, and 3031... and just have fun shooting it, not having the snot kicked out of me.

 

[someguy2800]

When I want to get kicked around I get my 444 marlin out, 320 grain hard cast at 2200 fps. For some reason its just never appealed to me in the guide gun. If I run across a cheap box of jacketed at a gun show mabey I'll try it one day.

 

[Varminterror]

To throw a little balance at this thread, my wife is 5’3” and 125lbs, she runs an Encore Pistol and a Marlin 1895 Guide Gun, and says the 1895’s recoil is “like butter.”

 

[flashhole]

Yeah, my 18 year old petite framed daughter mastered my Guide Gun pretty quickly with my handloads. They are mid-range loads with 340 grain cast bullets. She claims it as "her" deer gun.

 

[WrongHanded]

Well I haven't done any reloading yet. I got all my equipment and consumables but then I ran into a little snag. I'd been waiting for some factory ammo to be delivered by mail, so that I could test the new rifle before I started to run reloads. The order took longer than anticipated, so I bought some Hornady 325gr FTX to run through it and headed to the range.

After a few loads through the rifle - a Henry H010 - the magazine tube started to become hard to remove and re-insert. Before I'd finished the box of 20 rounds, it was immovable. I loaded the last 4 directly into the chamber. So now the gun is on its way for a warranty repair with only 20 rounds through it. I'm gonna be waiting a while before I get to try any of my own loads.

On the bright side, everything but the mag tube worked great. The recoil is more than I'd really expected, though I'm not sure exactly what I thought it would be. Somewhere around a Benelli Nova Tactical with 3" magnum rifled rifled slugs. It certainly felt like more than that, but not unmanagable. I knew I'd been shooting when I got home though, that's for sure!

 

[someguy2800]

Yeah, my 18 year old petite framed daughter mastered my Guide Gun pretty quickly with my handloads. They are mid-range loads with 340 grain cast bullets. She claims it as "her" deer gun.

I'm only shooting a 350 cast at 1250 FPS but my 10 year old nephew has a hoot shooting it. Its like a 20 gauge shotgun with trap loads, I would let anyone that can hold it up shoot it.

 

[JimA]

Well I haven't done any reloading yet. I got all my equipment and consumables but then I ran into a little snag. I'd been waiting for some factory ammo to be delivered by mail, so that I could test the new rifle before I started to run reloads. The order took longer than anticipated, so I bought some Hornady 325gr FTX to run through it and headed to the range.

After a few loads through the rifle - a Henry H010 - the magazine tube started to become hard to remove and re-insert. Before I'd finished the box of 20 rounds, it was immovable. I loaded the last 4 directly into the chamber. So now the gun is on its way for a warranty repair with only 20 rounds through it. I'm gonna be waiting a while before I get to try any of my own loads.

On the bright side, everything but the mag tube worked great. The recoil is more than I'd really expected, though I'm not sure exactly what I thought it would be. Somewhere around a Benelli Nova Tactical with 3" magnum rifled rifled slugs. It certainly felt like more than that, but not unmanagable. I knew I'd been shooting when I got home though, that's for sure!

That's a bummer about your magazine tube. I've never had anything like that happen with mine. I wonder if some grit got on the tube and scratched it going in and out. That soft tube plus a little lube to attract dirt seems like could cause a problem. I'm sure Henry will fix it OK for you but the wait to get it back will be a pain.

 

[Wis-Harpo]

To WrongHanded If you are going to use new Starline brass, run them in you tumbler awhile. The new brass is soo smooth, that they will squeek in the resizing die. My 45-70 is a Model 98 Siamese Mauser and weighs about 10 1/2 pounds. When I was younger ( 1983) full house 2200 fps loads were not that bad. Now I use IMR3031 at 1600 fps--- much nicer and more accurate.

 

[landag]

There are some really interesting .45-70 loads at www.4sigmabullets.com. They show Bullseye, Norma R-1, HiSkor 700X, and Trail Boss.

 

[GarrettJ]

Be advised I believe you are supposed to stick with trapdoor loads in contenders so that load may be a bit much in a contender. When I worked up to that load in my marlin the velocity did not really increase much from 15 to 19 grains, but the accuracy did increase slightly so I went with it. I think 15 was 1200 fps and 19 was 1250. 16 grains should be a safe and pleasant contender load according to hodgdon. Try it and let us know.

So I finally got around to playing with some Trailboss in the .45-70 Contender. I was running 300 gr. JHPs, with 15, 15.5, and 16 gr. of powder. Not a lot of difference in velocity from one load to the next. (1075, 1092, and 1117 fps averages). Accuracy was good and recoil was quite manageable.

I launched some of the HSM 405 gr. loads afterward, and the recoil with those was much less pleasant. The last time I shot some of those over the chronograph, they were pushing around 1175 fps. out of the 14" barrel. And I recall those not being as unpleasant as some of my other (1500 fps.) loads using H-322.