Remingtons Offical response.
- Thread starter richie
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Lawyer doublespeak.
Nor is it a statement that they are safe. Any lawyer will tell a defendant to shut up and NEVER admit guilt. This is SOP in any legal matter.
All recall's are voluntary and not everyone chooses to participate. They can call it anything they want, if you have a rifle with the flawed trigger design you will be able to have it replaced. Essentially every bolt rifle made by Remington since 1946 except the 788. This is exactly the same tactic Remington used in 1982 when they had the voluntary recall to have the safety replaced with one that would allow the bolt to be opened without moving it to the "fire" position. Once again, part of a court ordered settlement from one of the 75+ lawsuits against them.
I can deal with a company making a defective product. It is the lies and coverup that are wearing thin.
Nor is it a statement that they are safe. Any lawyer will tell a defendant to shut up and NEVER admit guilt. This is SOP in any legal matter.
All recall's are voluntary and not everyone chooses to participate. They can call it anything they want, if you have a rifle with the flawed trigger design you will be able to have it replaced. Essentially every bolt rifle made by Remington since 1946 except the 788. This is exactly the same tactic Remington used in 1982 when they had the voluntary recall to have the safety replaced with one that would allow the bolt to be opened without moving it to the "fire" position. Once again, part of a court ordered settlement from one of the 75+ lawsuits against them.
I can deal with a company making a defective product. It is the lies and coverup that are wearing thin.
DM~
Member
I rather like the triggers on my 700's, they won't be seeing ANY of mine!
DM
DM
stiab
Member
- Joined
- Dec 9, 2007
- Messages
- 638
Here's another part of their reply:
"Further, and contrary to CNBC’s story, it is undisputed that the Remington Model 700 is the best-selling American-made, bolt-action rifle of all time. The Model 700 has also been and continues to be the tactical sniper rifle of choice for the U.S. armed forces and special operators and is widely used by state and federal law enforcement agencies."
That's all true of course, but irrelevant to the trigger safety issue and their failure to fix it decades ago.
"Further, and contrary to CNBC’s story, it is undisputed that the Remington Model 700 is the best-selling American-made, bolt-action rifle of all time. The Model 700 has also been and continues to be the tactical sniper rifle of choice for the U.S. armed forces and special operators and is widely used by state and federal law enforcement agencies."
That's all true of course, but irrelevant to the trigger safety issue and their failure to fix it decades ago.
There "failure" to fix it decades ago was based on the consumer public having an attitude to accept their responsibility rather than pawn it off onto the maker.
We are talking about a design that required being clean. The designer eliminated the offending part that caused the trigger to release because the user let it get dirty due to negligence.
Management balanced their decision on the public knowing not to let triggers get dirty. Now we are in a different time. The shooters of today who prefer traditional guns are a different sort. Take out the tactical users, and what is left of the market are "consumers." It's not the same guys who bought firearms 30 years ago, it's a new generation raised on entitlement.
If you feel that you are entitled to a new free trigger because you won't clean it, then Remington is happy to oblige. Now, think about that - it's going to be the liability proof trigger of today, not the light adjustable precision trigger of yesteryear.
Be careful what you ask for.
We are talking about a design that required being clean. The designer eliminated the offending part that caused the trigger to release because the user let it get dirty due to negligence.
Management balanced their decision on the public knowing not to let triggers get dirty. Now we are in a different time. The shooters of today who prefer traditional guns are a different sort. Take out the tactical users, and what is left of the market are "consumers." It's not the same guys who bought firearms 30 years ago, it's a new generation raised on entitlement.
If you feel that you are entitled to a new free trigger because you won't clean it, then Remington is happy to oblige. Now, think about that - it's going to be the liability proof trigger of today, not the light adjustable precision trigger of yesteryear.
Be careful what you ask for.
MCgunner
Member
+1! If they were THAT unsafe (my grandpa bought my 722 in the late 50s) they'd have killed me by now, well, except that I'm always muzzle aware. I got all paranoid last night and pulled the stocks off the 722 and the model 7 to inspect, clean and rust free. the 7 is a stainless model. I TRIED to make 'em fire (unloaded of course) by pulling hard on the triggers and then turning the safeties off, no go. Both were set by a very good gunsmith to 3 lbs. Didn't trust myself with the job. Everything's enclosed on 'em. The Savage is all open and I set it myself. The safety adjustment is critical to get right after you take the slack out of the trigger to make it creep free. I could see someone messing that up, but other than that, I think they're sound, just keep 'em well maintained/cleaned.
MachIVshooter
Member
+2.
It is unfortunate that Remington has to suffer for a bunch of idiots who either don't clean their guns or screwed with sear engagement when they shouldn't have, but big green probably knows that a great many of us who understand the Walker trigger and know how to set one properly have no intention of exchanging it for a lawyer proof mechanism.
loose noose
Member
Nor will they see any of mine! Muzzle awareness is the main objective too often forgotten in this day and age.
I have personally seen a clean unaltered 700 fire when the safety was taken off while the shooters finger was indexed along the stock. Does it happen all the time? No. By does it happen? Yes.
MCgunner
Member
I can't seem to make it happen to mine, try as I might.
DM~
Member
"IF" that's true, then it was improperly adjusted right from the factory...
I can't make ANY of mine do that, and I've NEVER seen a clean, properly adjusted 700 trigger do it either. AND I've had/used/and adjusted them since 1971 when I bought my first one. Over the years my hands have probable touched hundreds of them!
DM
Look, I never said that all of them do it. Just that I have seen it happen on a bone stock clean gun. While rare it does happen and Remington knows it. Heck I don't own a Remington, my Winchester has been more than fine for me. All I am saying that while rare, it can happen and they know it.
Well before the CNBC documentary, a Graybeard told me that in the early 50's, two hardware store new Rem 721's fired into the floorboards of a car, when the safeties were released.
On another forum a poster stated that a woman in El Paso had been killed, when an owner of a Rem 700 got home and unloaded his rifle in the driveway. The rifle discharged upon the release of the safety, the bullet went way up, and way down, killing the woman who apparently was outside on the lawn.
The reason these things have triggers is so you can control when it goes off. Accidental discharges due to defective trigger designs will kill people.
I will be calling Remington about the replacement of the trigger on my M700.
On another forum a poster stated that a woman in El Paso had been killed, when an owner of a Rem 700 got home and unloaded his rifle in the driveway. The rifle discharged upon the release of the safety, the bullet went way up, and way down, killing the woman who apparently was outside on the lawn.
The reason these things have triggers is so you can control when it goes off. Accidental discharges due to defective trigger designs will kill people.
I will be calling Remington about the replacement of the trigger on my M700.
wlewisiii
Member
Shrug. A company that wasn't worth much and is now owned by a profit over everything holding company? Thanks but my 700 will stay in my safe unused until I can afford a Timney for it.
MCgunner
Member
Well, I see no reason to spend money on a Timney trigger since I have no problem with my two Remingtons, one of 'em being near 60 years old and still safe even though the trigger has been adjusted to 3 lbs. I've spent most of my life with that 722, killed my first deer with it at age 11 in 1963. Killed my last one with it last year, 50 years after the first. It's a 1/2 MOA gun in .257 Roberts.
DM~
Member
Not too long ago, I read a couple post about a guy that had(s) a Wby. MarkV that fires when he took the safety off...
I'm thinking ALL MarkV's should be recalled!! PRONTO!
It proves that it's rare, but it DOES happen!
DM
I'm thinking ALL MarkV's should be recalled!! PRONTO!
It proves that it's rare, but it DOES happen!
DM
MCgunner
Member
I suppose if you're that paranoid over it, you could leave the safety off. What do the Glock guys say about the booger picker on the bang switch? Or, you could just raise the bolt about 1/2 way up for safety, lower the bolt back before the shot. Raise and jack the round out when you're done for the day. Forget the safety is even there. Hell, on my Model 7, it's hard to kick it off without a "CLICK!", anyway. 
Dr.Zubrato
Member
- Joined
- May 12, 2009
- Messages
- 400
Jeeze, some of you guys have too much ego invested in your guns..
Sure, blame the entitlement generation for a manufacturers faulty design in 1962. Although some could argue that was THE worst entitlement generation
With so much competition on the firearms market, and how hard everyone works these days for their dollars I would argue consumers SHOULD have a spine and demand someone respect their patronage and dollars with a product that AT BEST won't ventilate your floor or roof, and at worst kill someone on accident.
Not quite sure how someone can mess up a bolt action design..
I thought bolt actions were nailed down by the 1890's, but it seems Remington has an opposite midas touch.
Sure, blame the entitlement generation for a manufacturers faulty design in 1962. Although some could argue that was THE worst entitlement generation
With so much competition on the firearms market, and how hard everyone works these days for their dollars I would argue consumers SHOULD have a spine and demand someone respect their patronage and dollars with a product that AT BEST won't ventilate your floor or roof, and at worst kill someone on accident.
Not quite sure how someone can mess up a bolt action design..
I thought bolt actions were nailed down by the 1890's, but it seems Remington has an opposite midas touch.
MCgunner
Member
The only time I've ever known of a discharge when a safety was clicked off was on a Savage M340. I owned the gun, never modified anything, not sure the trigger was even adjustable as it was a cheap gun to begin with. Sold it to my Uncle and it happened to him about 5 years later. No one was hurt, thankfully. He sold the gun. Not sure if he sold it broken, or fixed it.
I KNOW that if an adjustable trigger is not properly adjusted, this can happen. This is why I had a good gunsmith set my Remmies, didn't attempt it myself. Everything is inclosed and I can't tell what's what with it, so figured it was money well spent. Didn't have the net back then or I could have googled a tutorial, but I'd still feel better about having a qualified gunsmith that's done it hundreds of times, take care of it.
I KNOW that if an adjustable trigger is not properly adjusted, this can happen. This is why I had a good gunsmith set my Remmies, didn't attempt it myself. Everything is inclosed and I can't tell what's what with it, so figured it was money well spent. Didn't have the net back then or I could have googled a tutorial, but I'd still feel better about having a qualified gunsmith that's done it hundreds of times, take care of it.
primalmu
Member
The real question is what will the cutoff date for buying new triggers be? At what specific years will be eligible for trigger reimbursement. I'm wondering if I should stroll over to Brownells and pick up a Timney trigger...
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