Quantcast
  1. This site uses cookies. By continuing to use this site, you are agreeing to our use of cookies. Learn More.

Return of the Wondernine

Discussion in 'Handguns: Autoloaders' started by Bartholomew Roberts, Mar 22, 2004.

Thread Status:
Not open for further replies.
  1. Bartholomew Roberts

    Bartholomew Roberts Moderator Emeritus

    Joined:
    Dec 26, 2002
    Messages:
    14,613
    Location:
    Texas
    September 14, 2004 - Everybody has done their part to contact their Congressman, write letters to the newspapers and educate their friends and family on the subject and the ban sunsets.

    Now that you are no longer limited to having just ten rounds in the magazine, will there still be a desire to have those rounds be as big as possible? Will the wondernine make a comeback if 17rd mags no longer cost 1/5 of the price of the gun?

    Personally, I'd love to see Kimber introduce a 9mm version of their BP Ten II with IPSC-style magazines. Since it uses a polymer frame, the gun already has a thin, Hi-Power like feel despite being a double-stack .45. It has the famed 1911 trigger and the extra inch of sight radius and slim slide are nice as well. If they could make it in 9mm with the durability and reliability their Marine Corps and LAPD offering have shown, that would be quite a pistol.
     
  2. Trebor

    Trebor Member

    Joined:
    Feb 15, 2003
    Messages:
    4,817
    I don't think we'll see the return of the wondernine. The "classic" wondernine was a full-size service pistol. The market trend now is for smaller, more easily concealed pistols since right to carry legislation has swept the nation. That, combined with the increasing popularity of the .40 S&W round, means that the market has changed out from underneath the wondernine.

    I think the market share of mid-size pistols that hold the legally mandated 10 rounds will grow even faster when 12 or 13 rounds mags become available. Remember, for some of these guns there have NEVER been any legal pre-ban mags available because the guns themselves didn't come into existence until after the ban. The 9mm versions will hold 13 to 15 rounds and the .40 guns will hold between 10 and 13.
     
  3. 1911Tuner

    1911Tuner Moderator Emeritus

    Joined:
    May 22, 2003
    Messages:
    18,550
    Location:
    Lexington,North Carolina...or thereabouts
    Wondernine's Return?

    I hope so! I loved the Wondernines when they were all the rage. They
    kept the price of 1911s down...Keepin' my fingers crossed.:p

    Cheers!

    Tuner
     
  4. Jim PHL

    Jim PHL Member

    Joined:
    Mar 18, 2004
    Messages:
    704
    Location:
    Philadelphia, PA
    There will be some, I'm sure who will want to carry 18 rounds of 9mm or 15 .40's. More power to them. I agree with Trebor. I think the current crop of carry guns made to pack 10+1 will carry on in popularity because most of them are well made and fit the bill for a CCW. I think I will stick with a 1911 style .45 even if the high-cap ban is lifted. I've come to like the .45 and have always preferred single-stack mags due to the slimmer grip.
     
  5. 1911Tuner

    1911Tuner Moderator Emeritus

    Joined:
    May 22, 2003
    Messages:
    18,550
    Location:
    Lexington,North Carolina...or thereabouts
    SingleStack

    Jim said:

    I think I will stick with a 1911 style .45 even if the high-cap ban is lifted. I've come to like the .45 and have always preferred single-stack mags due to the slimmer grip.

    Howdy Jim, and welcome the THR! Good choice on that 1911 thing.:cool:
     
  6. happyguy

    happyguy Member

    Joined:
    Jun 11, 2003
    Messages:
    155
    When it susnsets I'll probably buy a 12 rounder for my USP .45f and keep it in the gun. I doubt that I'll buy a wonder nine or more than one mag for the USP.

    Regards,
    Happyguy:D
     
  7. agtman

    agtman Member

    Joined:
    Dec 31, 2002
    Messages:
    1,630
    Location:
    midwest
    Well, the cops carrying Wondernines "back in the day" often wondered whether 15-minimeter rounds would be enough. A number of them I knew begged, borrowed, scrimped and saved to get their hands on a 645, (later the 4506), a 10mm, or settled for carrying a back-up snubby loaded with .357 mag HPs. Trust me, the era of the Wondernines wasn't all that wonderful. :rolleyes:

    That said, however, Trebor's point is a good one regarding the likely market for pistols suitable for civilian CCW after the hi-cap ban expires.

    The demise of the full-size, all-steel 15-rd 9mm pistol was virtually guaranteed by the rise of the lighter polymer-frame guns having equal or greater mag capacity, then the 1994 hi-cap ban/10-rd mag limit, and then the wave of "Shall-Issue" CCW laws that swept the country in the 1990s. All of these events more or less worked together. Smaller, lighter and more concealable pistols became the order of the day - and still are.

    If the ban sets as scheduled, hicap mags will no doubt be produced again, but for existing platforms, not whole new guns.

    Probably the initial run of "hi-cap" mags will be for a company's big bore pistols (.40/45/10mm), offering a 3-5 round increase in capacity for existing models.
     
  8. NMGlocker

    NMGlocker Member

    Joined:
    Nov 28, 2003
    Messages:
    115
    Then the smart ones realized that it wasn't the bullet that was the deciding factor, but the shooter. The others come onto the internet and brag about their "magic death ray bullets".
     
  9. Sean Smith

    Sean Smith Member

    Joined:
    Dec 28, 2002
    Messages:
    4,922
    Or make personal attacks based on caliber preference? :rolleyes:
     
  10. Tamara

    Tamara Senior Member

    Joined:
    Dec 21, 2002
    Messages:
    9,325
    Location:
    Hoosieropolis
    I'll be sticking with single-stack 1911's, thanks.

    (Although I am planning to build a .38 Super or 9x25 Dillon 1911 on a double-stack STI frame just to make a political statement. :) )
     
  11. Kaxter

    Kaxter Member

    Joined:
    Feb 11, 2003
    Messages:
    188
    I am a huge 9mm fan and I will love being able to afford standard mags. I have a Beretta purchase in the works after my P228 gets here.
     
  12. Longbow

    Longbow Member

    Joined:
    Dec 29, 2002
    Messages:
    1,145
    Location:
    City by the big lake
    Me, I just want more 50 rd. 10/22 mags at pre-1994 price. I'll make a mini quad 50 (crank operated/gatling style) when the ban goes away. :) :) I can dream, can I??
     
  13. 10-Ring

    10-Ring Member

    Joined:
    Dec 24, 2002
    Messages:
    12,037
    Location:
    California
    Wondernines are/were/would be/ might be cool, but I don't see a resurrection any time soon...besides, I'm really learning to appreciate my 8 round Colt ;)
     
  14. 9x19

    9x19 member

    Joined:
    Dec 30, 2002
    Messages:
    912
    Location:
    Texas
    Yep,

    As sure as the sun rises, the sunset of the 94 AWB will give new life to the wundernine. In our more-is-always-better society, you can count on it. :D

    Add to that the cost of 9mm ammo, and the fact that many non-experts buy and shoot pistols for fun (and the .40 ain't always fun in a 9mm sized gun). The .40 made big gains in the LE market, but I'm betting 9mm still outsells it over the counter at most shops around the country.

    Sure there is a market for small CCW pistols, but its one that has been pursued all along.

    The hi-cap market has been stagnant, and I think many makers will jump in with both feet... hoping to get a bigger piece of the market share for range/duty/recreational hi-cap pistols.

    CHL holders are still just a small minority of pistol owners/shooters, from what I've seen in the local shop.
     
  15. stans

    stans Member

    Joined:
    Dec 27, 2002
    Messages:
    2,426
    Location:
    central Virginia
    I don't see a big resurgence in the high cap 9mm market either. The magazine capacity limit did not apply to law enforcement, so those that dumped the wondernine are not about to go back to it. People who CCW want something concealable and it can be hard to conceal a 14, 16 or 20 round magazine. I think CCW's will continue to carry smaller guns with magazine capacity of 10 rounds or less. Shot placement is far more critical than caliber or the number of rounds in the magazine.
     
  16. Black Snowman

    Black Snowman Member

    Joined:
    Sep 3, 2003
    Messages:
    3,507
    Location:
    Kansas City, KS
    I think what you'll see are more pistol caliber carbines and other "fun guns". I'd be willing to bet the CX4 Storm would gain some serious popularity if you could suddnly get 25 or 30 round magazines for them at reasonable prices. Guns like the Steyrs might increase in popularity since they will no longer be neutered but I don't think you'll see makers specificly seeking out the "hi-cap" market any more than they are now.
     
  17. MrAcheson

    MrAcheson Member

    Joined:
    Dec 26, 2002
    Messages:
    1,628
    Location:
    Newark, DE and APG, MD
    Yes the Wondernine will make a comeback after the sunset. People are going to start looking at the .45 and doing the math and realizing that 1 .45 is not worth 2 9mm in any quantifiable way, shape, or form. Maybe 1.5 9mm, but not 2. Likewise a hot .40 gives as good or better ballistics as a .45 with more capacity.

    A bit part of the reason small guns have been developed was concealed carry reforms. However another big reason is that developing 10+ capacity guns is pointless under the ban. The industry developed guns that can live up to their full potential as 10 rounders. Once the ban sunsets they will bring out bigger, higher capacity weapons again. Why not? People CCW Beretta 92s and they don't get much bigger than that.
     
  18. LynnKCircle

    LynnKCircle Member

    Joined:
    Oct 30, 2003
    Messages:
    122
    Location:
    Houston, Texas
    CCW In A Big Gun

    I began by carrying a Taurus PT99 in an IWB holster (same physical shape as the Beretta 92). That worked as long as my weight was below 215 pounds. But as I got older and fatter, that 5" barrel began gouging my flab. For years I carried a Makarov because that was all I could afford. But then my wife encouraged me to get a Kimber CDP Pro.

    Carried in an IWB holster, I now believe the 1911-Officer style to be about the biggest gun to be carried comfortably all day long. Yes, there are smaller and higher capacity guns out there, but for my experience, at least, they are a lot more difficult to shoot fast and accurately.

    I still have the Taurus, mainly because I was never able to get what I believe it to be worth. It's a great house gun, but I do think it's pushing things a bit to carry it concealed -- although in a Fobus paddle holster covered by a shirt or jacket it's not bad at all.

    Just my two cents.

    Lynn Circle
     
  19. Boats

    Boats member

    Joined:
    Dec 29, 2002
    Messages:
    3,705
    Location:
    Oregon
    I'm going to get a couple of "assault pistols" (A CZ 85B and Walther P99 or SS XD-9 are in my sights) simply because large segments of the fedgov don't want me to own any. Enough likemindedness would spur a huge uptick in sales.
     
  20. 45auto

    45auto Member

    Joined:
    Dec 30, 2002
    Messages:
    1,241
    I would guess the wonderguns will increase sales, but I would think a large portion of someone's "gun-fund" money would go to the high cap mags. You can buy the "high cap" guns anytime, ban or not. The mag is the key.

    Buy them quick, since the "issues" will be addressed state by state.
     
  21. BrokenArrow

    BrokenArrow Member

    Joined:
    Feb 22, 2004
    Messages:
    199
    Location:
    Lost In Space
    Win LE ammo sales:

    40 S&W
    9x19
    45 ACP
    357SIG
    .38 Special

    The .357 Mag isn't even a blip on the screen anymore.

    So the 9x19 isn't doing as bad as some thought it was?

    Will it hold it's own, go up, continue to drop? Beats me.

    That's the USA/Canada. The 9x19 is still Numero Uno by far worldwide.

    I still like it best too. Even w just 10 rounds in a big gun.

    Most new guns designed after the ban were not designed around shorter/thinner 10 round mags. The USP? The Walther P99? The sig pro?

    Having "only" 10 rounds of 9 minimeter in a "full size" gun never bothered me as much as why I had only 10 rounds did. ;)
     
  22. Gunmeister

    Gunmeister Member

    Joined:
    Feb 15, 2004
    Messages:
    200
    Location:
    The Gunshine State==FL
    OK, I'm an old guy, been around almost 70 years, been playin with guns 50 or more years and guess what? I don't know what a "wondernine" is. Anybody got a picture? Educate me please.
     
  23. tiberius

    tiberius Member

    Joined:
    May 3, 2003
    Messages:
    1,125
    Location:
    UK temporarily
    Wondernine characteristics:

    9mm
    double stack magazine
    DA on first shot (or equivalent) - i.e. Glock 17 & HK P7M13 count IMHO

    term coined in the '80s I think. S&W model 59 was the first one.
     
  24. clipse

    clipse Member

    Joined:
    Sep 19, 2003
    Messages:
    1,215
    Location:
    missouri
    I always thought wondernines where 9mm handguns that held as many rounds as possible.

    Under that deffinition:

    My wondernines. :D


    First my CZ 75 P-01. 14rounds of 9mm in a compact gun. DA/SA
    [​IMG]

    Second, my CZ 75B 15 rounds 9mm. SA/DA.
    [​IMG]

    I suppose these would classify as wondernines.

    clipse
     
  25. Gunmeister

    Gunmeister Member

    Joined:
    Feb 15, 2004
    Messages:
    200
    Location:
    The Gunshine State==FL
    OK I get it now, I mistakenly thought a wondernine was a brand or model name for a specific pistol that I had never heard of.
    I have several "Wondernines" by that description. One of my prize 9mm pistols is a totally cherry blue S&W Model 39 with walnut checkered grips, although she isn't double stacked and won't hold 15+ rounds she is a thing of beauty and a "wondernine" to behold. Wish I had a digital camera so I could share her beauty with you, but I don't have one. Shucks, I wouldn't know how to work it if I did have one, I'm still stuck in the 50's
     
Thread Status:
Not open for further replies.

Share This Page