Rifles of Algerian War 1954-62

[Officers'Wife]

The 1st World War was a horrible meat grinder for all nationalities. In the end there were no victors, only a treaty of peace that was resented so much it's terms were broken a decade later. In the end, it matters not whether French or American won the Marne. All that matters is the offensive was stopped.

 

[Ohio Gun Guy]

Actually, It may have been the Germans who stopped the Germans......

I had 1 Great Grandfather and 1 Great Great Uncle in WW1 and they were both German immigrants (Within a few generations). One side of the family still spoke German at home. My Original point was only meant to say that when I read & watch history shows about WW1; I am amazed at the casualty rates. I think to myself, could you / would you do that? And I dont think the mutiny of the French was out of Cowardice, but out of common sense. How many thousands of men needed to die in a heap infront of a German Maxim machine gun to figure out, the stradegy wasnt working? Now I think the French Army had its back broken, and the British and Americans kept the Germans at bay (As well as the Germans not capitalizing on the situation). However, they dug deep and got back in it. We (The U.S.) didnt win it on our own, but I do believe we were the difference.

 

[barman]

Back on the topic, here are two pictures of armed Fellaghas, I can identify a MAT-49 sub-machine gun in the middle of the first picture.

 

[DawgsFan_07]

To some of the above posters debating the French vs. American performance in WW1:

Yes, I do believe the US made A difference that bought victory such as it was, in that war. However, you could say the same for the British Army, or some French units.

For those who would accuse the French nation of cowardice due to widespread mutinying, desertion, and low morale when we arrived, may I simply point out that the French Army had been fighting in some of the most terrible conditions for three years and taken horrible casualities.

The British, American, and German armies all suffered similar problems after several years of fighting in every extended war e.g. the US Civil War, WW2, Vietnam, etc etc.

For myself, I cannot disparage the courage of men who broke after years of trench warfare when I was not there and have yet to see combat myself.

 

[The Annoyed Man]

I can't speak to the weapons, but I and my family were directly affected by this war in several ways...

• We were living in Paris, France in 1960, and the OAS blew up a bomb in an apartment building two doors down from the school I attended - during school hours. I can still remember the sound of the explosion. It blew a significant chunk out of the marble floor in the portico of the building, and I remember being fascinated by the small crater, which I walked past on my way home that day. I was 8 years old.
  
• My mother, who is French, was born and raised in Algiers, Algeria. The hall of records where her birth and citizenship information was recorded was destroyed during fighting in the war, and her records were lost. When we left to return to the U.S. in 1961, we had to leave my mother behind. She couldn't reenter the U.S. because her visa could not be verified due to the loss of her birth records. It was one of the most wrenching experiences of my life to that point. My father, brothers and I came home by ship (the SS France's maiden voyage to New York Harbor), and my mother was able to fly home a couple of weeks later.
  
• My maternal grandfather was a fairly prestigious professor of Anatomy and Physiology at a local medical school in Algiers. A library which bore his name was destroyed in the fighting. He never forgave them for it.
  
• The movie, "Day of the Jackal," dramatizes an actual assassination plot against Charles DeGaule fomented by the OAS. Many years later, one of the actual conspirators bought a small gas station/auto repair shop in Pasadena, California, where I lived at the time.

Small world, isn't it?

 

[Earthjade]

My father was a paratrooper during that war.
He served under Colonel Bigeard's 3rd R.P.C from 1956 to 1960. Along with the Legion, the paras were the sharp edge of the French military efforts there. He took part in a few paradrops and dozens of helicopter insertions when A.L.N troops were spotted out in the bled.

As far as French weapons were concerned, his unit carried mainly two - the MAT-49 sub-machine gun and the MAS-49 rifle. Some other paras (like lieutenants) had the US Garand with the foldable stock, but these were not common. In the scrub fighting that took place often, my father said he preferred the MAT-49.

In terms of the A.L.N weapons, they used whatever they could get their hands on, which included captured French weapons. Also, there were a lot of shotguns and sporting rifles. Military rifles included German Kars from Czechslovakia and a few Lee-Enfields that Nasser gave to them after the UK pulled out of the Suez in 1956. In the first few months of his service, my father was wounded by four .45 bullets...he was shot with an American Thompson. Whether this was from an overseas arms deals or was part of a cache hidden away since WW2 (Operation Torch) he doesn't know. Not that much in the way of Soviet equipment, as the relationship between the F.L.N and the USSR was cool at best.

He also told me from time to time the A.L.N had MG-42s in the field. The sound of the MG-42 put a sense of dread into the paras...if you were hit by that, it's likely you would have been hit by 3-4 bullets and not just one. Not sure where the MG-42s were obtained from. They may have been from Tunisia (abandoned by the Germans in 1943) or they could have been from the eastern bloc. I know that some Eastern nations made knock offs of the MG-42 (usually with a slightly lower R.O.F).

 

[lionking]

you may find some here

http://images.google.com/images?q=algerian&q=source:life&safe=active

 

[Algeria]

Helping a Friend at Work - Urgent!

Hi everyone,

I am new to this but I am trying to help a friend at work. She is a French citizen and her father left for the Algerian conflict to never return. She has not met him yet and her mother already passed away. Any tips as to where to go find military records for those who served there? He was an officer during that time.

Best regards,

Luis

 

[CornCod]

Luis,

My first attempt would be the French Consulate in New York or the Consulate in the nearest big city where you live. They might be able to point you in the right direction.

French Consulate of NY
934 Fifth avenue
New York
USA
NY 10021

 

[akodo]

I know it was "Thread Drift" but Vern's history was wonderful.

Not to step on any toes let me say that there is critical and important.

If you are stringing 5 different 12 foot lengths of rope together to span a gap a little over 50 feet, and one rope breaks, you are screwed. If a guy comes by with a new, very strong 20 foot length of rope, he is critical in the success...but the other ropes are important too.

Same can be said of getting Diptheria to snowlocked Nome, Alaska along the Iditarod trail (and the well known race founded on this historical event, even if the race now overshadows history)

Of course, the serum was moved by train from Seattle to Fairbanks before the harrowing dogsled relay...and without that railway track the serum would never have arrived...yet still it is the dogsled relay that was critical to the juncture,

The fresh US troops with fire in their belly were the critical ingredient thrown into the conflict that changed it from a loss to a victory...but the fresh US troops in a vaccuum would no more have succeeded in winning that the dogsledders of the Iditarod would have succeeded had the medicine not been at Fairbank for them to sled off with.

 

[cane]

Just to clarify your statement about how the diptheria vaccine got to Nome.

Remembering the devastating effects of the influenza epidemic of 1918-1919, when diptheria was suspected in Nome during the winter of 1925 the community requested that serum to combat the disease be sent to them as quickly as possible. In response, serum was rushed to the people of Nome from Seattle. A ship carried the serum from Seattle to Seward, where it was carried by the Alaska Railroad to Nenana, then by dog teams to Nome. Twenty individuals transported the serum the 674 miles between Nenana and Nome in 127 1/2 hours.

 

[strangelittleman]

I know it was "Thread Drift" but Vern's history was wonderful.

Not to step on any toes let me say that there is critical and important.

If you are stringing 5 different 12 foot lengths of rope together to span a gap a little over 50 feet, and one rope breaks, you are screwed. If a guy comes by with a new, very strong 20 foot length of rope, he is critical in the success...but the other ropes are important too.

Same can be said of getting Diptheria to snowlocked Nome, Alaska along the Iditarod trail (and the well known race founded on this historical event, even if the race now overshadows history)

Of course, the serum was moved by train from Seattle to Fairbanks before the harrowing dogsled relay...and without that railway track the serum would never have arrived...yet still it is the dogsled relay that was critical to the juncture,

The fresh US troops with fire in their belly were the critical ingredient thrown into the conflict that changed it from a loss to a victory...but the fresh US troops in a vaccuum would no more have succeeded in winning that the dogsledders of the Iditarod would have succeeded had the medicine not been at Fairbank for them to sled off with.

Dude, what in the wide world of sports does this have to do with the Algerian War? Drop the needle & cooking spoon and step away from the keyboard.

 

[RedLion]

Wow, and I thought I was bad at thread drifting.....I just came here to look at some cool pictures, learn some cool facts, ect.

Seriously! The allies won WWI, really. If you want to decide who won it more or better... well you can settle that however you want, but it really doesn't have much to do with Algeria.

 

[paintballdude902]

from all i ahve read about the conflict it was pretty rag tag all around; by that i mean there were a number of command issues, supply was hard to main tain since ther was a large assortment of weapons in many many different calibers

to everyone who wants to talk trash about the french sure they got there tails handed to them on many occasions but many other countries did too like the brit even the great usa. my self im polish my grandfather walked out of poland in 1939 to meet up with the french troop served with them untill dunkirk where we joined a british unit (lucky him) got out on the very very last boat out he finished out the war with a pretty rag tag group made of french, polish, brits, and us troops. they marched from africa up italy and all around europe even did some time in the middle east at some point during the war cant really tell when all we have are some un dated letters to his uncle (General izydore modelski polish general from wwI to wwII until he defected from poland when the soviets took control)

we all like to say our country won the war but we didnt the us did win either one the allies did the war would ahve been lost if it wasnt for the us but if it was just he us we probably would ahve lost too since we were fighting 2 enemies on 2 halves of the earth