Rise of the 380? Which is best?

[CrankyOldGuy]

-1 for the Bersa.
I owned one (A .380 thuder DLX), purchased new in box, and it was the most unreliable pistol I've ever touched. Factory servicing made it worse, it came back with the magazine falling out and the spring broken. YMMV, but in my personal experience Bersa is a bottom quality product.

 

[PX15]

Badger:

Help me out here please.

I THOUGHT 9X19 was plain old 9mm.....?

Could be wrong, but I don't mind learning if I am.

Thanks!

Jesse

 

[CrankyOldGuy]

Unfortunately there are a few different designations for "plain old 9mm".

But, yes, most people mean 9x19 when they say "9mm".

Better safe than sorry, however. There are a bewildering array of 9mm's out there.

 

[Badger Arms]

I THOUGHT 9X19 was plain old 9mm.....?

Could be wrong, but I don't mind learning if I am.

Well, yes, it's plain old 9mm. Herein lies the confusion. 9x19mm Luger/Parabellum/NATO is a high-pressure round with a .355" bullet. But 9x17mm (.380 ACP) also has the same bullet diameter and is a lower pressure round suitable for blowback pistols. It gets worse. 9x18mm is not the same 9mm as Luger developed. It's something like .365" in diameter. Even more confusing, the .380 Revolver cartridge is also not a real (9x19mm/.38 Spl/.357 Magnum) 9mm. Back to "true" 9mm's. There are dozens of other 9mm calibers out there to include:

9x18mm Ultra
9x17mm Browning Short
9x18mm Police
9mm Glisenti
9x19mm Parabellum
.357 SIG
9mm Browning Long
9x21mm IMI
9x23mm Steyr
9mm Bergman/Bergman-Bayard
9mm Mauser Pistol
9mm Winchester Magnum
.356 TSW (Team Smith & Wesson)
.38 Auto
.38 Super
9x18mm Makarov
9.8 mm Auto Colt
9mm Federal
9 mm Japanese
.38 Short Colt
.38 Long Colt
.38 S&W Special
.357 S&W Magnum
.357 Rem Max

Confused yet?

 

[distra]

I too am having trouble understanding why the 380 is coming back. I had a BDA for a couple years and traded it off. I've not looked back since. With sub-compact "real" 9mm pistols available, I certainly don't understand why anyone would want a 380. I've shot the LCP and it's ok, but just ok. I didn't like the trigger very much. Anyway, maybe some can shed some light on the recent 380 fascination.

 

[UnTainted]

Another vote for the 9mm, unless you really really want a 380 or a really really want a small pocket pistol (because "large" pocket pistols do exist, such as a Kahr - some claim they are fine in pockets, some say they are to big; it's probably up to you). At that point, get both, and still enjoy 9mm +P with the 380 as backup. Or better yet get a small 40 (to some). The 380 recoilwise is different in my 232sl (which I adore, and trust my life to, though it's a 380, but i don't carry it too often anymore with the smallish "big" pocket gun MK9 9mm I use) and more so felt than the 9mm 115 st.pressure rounds out of my similar weight MK9.

I keep buffalo bore's lead fp cast 380 load in my 232sl.

 

[Malodorousroadkill]

Its easy to make inexpensive handguns for .380. Its at the minimum mark for defensive power. Its short. The recoil isn't severe in a small gun either. Imagine if they made the Keltec p11 in .380. It would be pretty popular.

 

[earlthegoat2]

The only 380 I might ever want is one that is not in vogue right now. The Browning BDA/Beretta Cheetah.
A high capacity 380?
Where did we all go wrong?
Its like they were doing it all wrong back then.

About the pocket 380s out there: I call them mouseguns. Though I appreciate them for what they are I look at them as a too convenient solution for a very complicatied problem. They are very easy to CC and that is good. Naturally I have one, an NAA Guardian. Love the feel of steel. I would call the 380 anemic at best but there have been plenty out there who have defended themselves with 22s. I honestly only think they are good for the summer months when the manstoppers dont conceal as well.

 

[ArmedBear]

The .380 is an ideal way to harass an attacker.

Or maybe people just got confused when the phrase "less-than-lethal" came into vogue, to describe various self-defense tools, and bought .380s.

 

[marcodo]

Just from a personal point of view...

I now carry my LCP in my front pocket to places I otherwise was going unarmed because my regular carry gun would not fit dressing issues.

I am willing to give up some on caliber in order to get it small enough to carry...otherwise it would not have come for the ride.

It was a a good choice for a $300ish priced gun. If it came in 9 mm I would have taken it.

 

[shield20]

I think the SIG P238 would make a good pocket .380., but like most PPKs/SIG P232 etc they aren't really much smaller then say a 9mm P99c. Thinner yes, but overall? Not much diff.

Now I see these tiny superlight .380s like the Ruger LCP and I wonder how they are to shoot. My PPK/S wasn't bad at all, but it was like 22.5 ozs, while a LCP is only 9.5 oz! Ouch!

I ended up with a Beretta .32. Pocket size, yet at 16oz it is real easy shooting. Sure it gives up a bit ballistic-wise going to .32, but it will serve its purpose as I have it with me when anything bigger (p99c) just doesn't work out well.

 

[gmh1013]

I guess Bersa 380 is hit or miss...
I know of 2 people that have one and carry for their CWP and have had zero problems. As of yesterday I have put about 600 through mine and had stovepipe yesterday on CCI Blazer ammo.
Seems they either shoot well or not at all.
I wish that I would have kept my Browning BDA that I sold in 92...
I could kick myself in the ass for selling now

 

[Kleanbore]

So, what exactly is the cause of the rise of the 380?

This time around? The rise in the number of people carrying concealed.

The cartridge was introduced by FN about a century ago. At that time the most popular small handgun cartridge in the country was the .32 S&W. The introduction of self-loading pistols resulted a lot of sales for the .32 ACP and .380 ACP.

Believe it or not, police departments in this country often chose .32 S&W Long revolvers at the time. I have one my grandfather got from a policeman who was not at all pleased with its effectiveness.

In Europe, 7.65 automatics (.32 ACP) were widely used by the police. The French military even used them.

The .380 is more effective than the .32. The Beretta Model 1934 in .380 was a standard Italian military side-arm.

Colt autos in both .32 and .380 were issued to U. S. general officers until about thirty years ago.

I think the primary appeal was and probably is the flatness of the little auto pistols.

They're not for me. If I were to choose to carry one, I'd be darn sure to use the most effective personal defense cartridges available.

Of course, you won't see a French soldier or U. S. General carrying a 7.65MM pistol any more these days, either. Things have changed. Could be that the bad guys are worse today.

I've often wondered what might have happened had the French or Italians (or even the Russians, who used small caliber sidearms) had encountered the Moro tribesmen who gave our troops so much trouble in the Philippines. Perhaps nothing. The U. S. adopted the .45 ACP after that, but to my knowledge, only Norway and Argentina followed suit.

 

[Bobo]

I believe that one of the major reasons for the present popularity of the .380 is the recent increase of effectiveness of the round. Until recently the .380 round was considered by most to be marginal in effectiveness.

The recent introduction of more effective expanding rounds such as the Remington Golden Saber, then the Winchester Ranger, then the Cor-Bon DPX, and now the Hornady Critical Defense; and also higher velocity non-expanding and expanding rounds such as the Buffalo Bore and Double Tap has increased the effectiveness of the .380 round to a point where more people trust it as viable defensive round.

Bobo

 

[gwillys]

MR 380 w/BB JHP does the trick for me.

carrys like a wallet. 100% reliable

 

[WRGADog]

I own two 380's

Beretta 84F and Kahr P380. The Kahr is the easiest gun to conceal that I own and is accurate for a gun so small. The Beretta is a great looking gun, but frankly, I can carry either my Walther PPS 9mm or my Kahr PM9 easier than the 84F. So the 84F sits in the gun safe unused.

 

[USMC 1975]

My vote is for the Bersa 380 Thunder. What an awesome weapon. I have had no problems with mine and have shot a lot of ammo through it.

For $ 280 dollars you cannot go wrong. Rugged, reliable and accurate, they fit the bill very well for a budget conscious shooter. My shooting partner owns nothing but high end guns and he loves shooting my Bersa and has nothing but good things to say about it.

The only problem I see right now with 380's is the shortage of ammo. I have had a helluva time the last few months trying to find 380 loads. I amazingly located 2 boxes the other day but it took me months to find that.

Chris

 

[moooose102]

IMO, the reason the 380 has become so popular is because you can take it every where, even in minimum clothing. super concealable, unless all you are wearing is spandex.

 

[usp9]

IMO, the reason the 380 has become so popular is because you can take it every where, even in minimum clothing. super concealable, unless all you are wearing is spandex.

...even then, when you're as lumpy as I am these days.

 

[ccoorreeyy]

I've got a few 380's. I like pocket/mouse guns alot and if I had to put an order to the one's I have I guess this would go like this (today anyway)

1) Seecamp LWS-380
Rohrbaugh K380 would go here if I had one I would imagine
2) Desert Eagle Micro 380
3) Kahr P380
4) Ruger LCP
5) Walther PPK 380
6) Kel-Tec P3AT
7) NAA Guardian 380

 

[gmh1013]

Anybody fired the new Walther PK380 yet?
I sure would like to test fire one soon

 

[Maia007]

Some excellent commentary, PX 15....appreciate your observations on the Seecamp.

 

[357sigRog]

In my opinion it is the Bersa Thunder 380.

 

[IMTHDUKE]

I want to get a Seecamp 380....but for now I go in this order....

If I wanta go with class....I carry....

If I wanta go with German style...I go with...

If I need some more horsepower but about same size...
I go with...

 

[Buck Snort]

Check the ballistics of the .380 against the .357 mag. or 9mm, not to mention the .45 ACP, and you'll quickly conclude your life is worth much more that whatever you'd save buying the .380.