Discussion in 'Handloading and Reloading' started by mudslinging79, Jul 1, 2008.
looking for load data for rocksalt loads for a 12 guage 2 1/2 or 3" shell.
Don't know your intent, sir, but check the box o' truth website. He has shown it to be a waste of time, effort and energy (not to mention $$) in making rock salt loads. They do nothing, balistically speaking, after only a couple feet from the barrel.
Besides they rust your gun.
What is the proper sequence of shots with rock salt rounds and frozen meat rounds in order to make meat jerky?
I did read about some one in a outdoors mag that was making and selling shot shells loaded with pepper corns for grouse and like wize.
can kill and flavour your game at the same time.
have a guy at work who reloads and was looking for something that could be had cheaper than blanks for a warning shot.
I cant see why that would not work for him.
If you are justified in shooting at someone there is no reason for a "warning shot."
Pike Hunter, it's called Season Shot, and can found at www.seasonshot.com
VERY bad idea!
Rock-salt would have plenty of power to blind someone, or even kill them at close range. Remember the kung-fu guy, Brandon Lee, who was killed with a blank on the movie set!
Shooting blanks or rock-salt loads is the same exact thing as firing real ammo in the eyes of the law.
If the BG deserves to be shot at all, just do it and get it over with!
All the legal ramifications will be exactly the same, whether you are using rock-salt or 00 Buck.
oo buck would be a little too much round here, but #6 would do wonders. figure the rocksalt would give the meth monkeys something to think about if they are so inclined to try and liberate belongings not their own again. killing would be the last resort for me to do.
I would definately seek the advice of the person who would be defending you in court. Any attorney worth a crap will tell you to use FACTORY ammo for any self defence purpose. If handloaded ammo is used, the prosecuter will try to make it look as if you loaded the rounds with the intent to kill, not the intent to defend. Also, handloads is a great leverage point in civil trials.
Warning shots work, in theory. But, what happens if you pull the trigger, and the bad guy figures out that nothing happened? Or worse, you wound a guy who is hopped up on meth, with salt. Now you got a big, doped up, off guy looking to do you in. Forget the warning shot. 00 buck right from the start.
00 buck, really, i figured a lot of smaller shot, size 6, would be more devastating as well as safer for possible overpenetration regarding the neighbors.
If you are shooting at them with ANY firearm you have made taken a course of action that may result in death.
Even blanks at close range can kill.
Depending on what state you are in and the circumstances YOU may be prosecuted for shooting over property.
Most states ONLY allow you to shoot someone if you are in fear of your life or grave bodily injury.
Close, but not quite. He actually was shot - a squib round got stuck in the barrel, and the armorer didn't notice it (idiot). The next day, they loaded up for another take, and a blank provided enough power to send the bullet into Brandon.
Anyway - back on topic - Mudslinger - I URGE you to listen to the folks who have already commented on the idea of using rock salt as a "warning shot". It is a terrible idea, for the stated reasons. If you have to shoot someone, you better be using actual ammunition, unless you like spending tons of cash defending yourself in court for maiming some poor, down-trodden drug addict who was just trying to get some cash for some food (or whatever lame excuse they decide to peddle to the jury).
My dad used the rock salt loads to scare off dogs when our dog was in heat.
Didn't work for long. ROFL.
He just emptied factory loads of bird shot and filled them up with the rock salt.
Just use a lightfield slug!! They WON'T get away!
mudslinger, check your state laws as in some states reloading/using rock salt loads is illegal.
When I was attending the University of Kentucky back around 1981, a frat rat got shot with a rock salt load by a neighbor. Seems the ol' boy had gotten sick of them "watering his bushes" during their parties.
So he popped one of 'em in the butt/thighs... Pattern had spread to about 18", and caused enough of a problem that the frat rat couldn't walk for a while.
He went to jail.
The guys that rode in the cabooses on the C&EI rail road were armed with shotguns loaded with rock salt...at least thats what mom told me when I was a kid. The fear of getting a butt load of salt kept me away from the tracks!
The birdshot for self defense thing has been done to death. Bird shot is for little birds. Anything less than #1 buckshot is either gambling with your life (non-ideal ammo for a justified shooting) or asking to spend lots of time in a non-voluntary government resort (your life wasn't really in danger).
Lots of people have this idea that they should use birdshot or rock salt in a shotgun for warning/less lethal purposes. This is an extension of the "force continuum" concept. The problem legally is that that once you are past the threshold for potentially lethal force, using wounding/maiming force shows both a desire to hurt rather than stop an opponent (may not be true, but that's what the lawyers will argue), and a lack of a real threat (why the hell didn't you shoot to STOP if he was really such a threat?). If you truly *have* to shoot, shoot to stop the threat, not piss it off or scare it. Otherwise keep your finger off the trigger.
As for why birdshot is undesireable for technical reasons as opposed to legal ones, take a couple of gallon jugs of water out to an outdoor range, and set them up on a table or other torso-high stand, laying them four deep. In order to have sufficient penetration to reach vital organs and rapidly STOP a determined attacker, you need to penetrate completely through at least three, preferably four jugs. Anything less than that isn't going to penetrate to the vitals of a 300lb drunk fatso/rapist/burglar/thug/drug dealer/etc except under optimal conditions. You have to plan on shooting through thick clothing, maybe a half-battered down bedroom door, his arm, and through into the vitals. The FBI figures that as about 12-16" worth of ballistic gel, which we approximate as 18-24" of water.
Figure a jug is 6". I'm betting that most, if not all of your shot will only penetrate the first jug, and fail to reach the second, unless you are within arms reach of the target. I have done this with #6 shot, and failed to penetrate to the second jug. Take a relatively wimpy gun like a .380 or a light target load for a .38 special. Hell, even a .22lr. Any of them will punch right through at least three jugs, probably all four. I've done this test with a .38 using both standard pressure and +p, FMJ and hollowpoint. To have enough penetration for stopping a perpetrator, you're going to have enough penetration to exit your home and punch through at least one of your neighbor's walls across the street. There has been no satisfactory solution to this problem since firearms were invented except for making sure that your shots don't miss.
FWIW - When I was a lad, my dad had a shotshell loader. Instead of a load of shot, I'd just pack them full of toilet paper with the press, and crimp 'em shut. Made great blanks, and a big cloud of shredded paper. Not saying I'd recommend that, mind you.
Kid next door had a pet duck, a white one. Kid across the street had a double-barrel 20 guage. We loaded up some TP blanks.
I baited Robert into his back yard near the duck pen, and then Brad came running into the yard with the shotgun, hollered "yee haw, duck season!", and BLAM, BLAM!
The paper flew, and Robert just KNEW it was duck feathers! He may have even soiled himself. Cruel, yes. Today, we'd go to jail. But hey, it was the 60's and we were stupid kids.
No ducks were harmed in the making of this film.
Everyone has already pointed out the legal aspects of your idea so I’ll try another route. What if you find yourself in a situation that requires more than a warning shot yet that’s what you’ve got in the chamber. More gun than needed is OK. Less than needed, you don’t go to court you go into the dirt.
Cant talk about the technical aspects as there are some very serious loaders posting here......................but I can attest back to 67 when Ole man Tucker let fly with some rock salt out of his twice barrell at me and a friend..........From that day forward we were really really respectful to MR. Tucker...........and I still got the scars on the left buttocks to prove it.............Pictures available upon request
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