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Roll crimp vs Lee FCD

Discussion in 'Handloading and Reloading' started by nyc71, Apr 3, 2011.

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  1. nyc71

    nyc71 Member

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    Sorry for my ignorance but what's the difference between the FCD & a rool crimp die? I own a FCD at the moment but would I get better results by use a roll crimp instead?
     
  2. 918v

    918v Member

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    A Lee FCD is a roll crimp die... or taper crimp depending on the application. What round are you reloading?
     
  3. Walkalong

    Walkalong Moderator

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    Yep. If you bought a FCD for the caliber you are reloading, it should have the correct crimp for it. What caliber? I would recommend a Redding Profile Crimp Die to roll crimp ammo using a roll crimp.
     
  4. 918v

    918v Member

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    I taper crimp everything. None of my rounds kick very much, so I don't need a roll crimp.
     
  5. eldon519

    eldon519 Member

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    The Lee FCD also re-sizes the brass a second-time as it crimps. This takes some of the importance off of case-neck conformity and case trimming. With a a normal roll crimp die, when applying a heavy crimp, it is very easy to buckle cases, especially if case length is not monitored carefully.
     
  6. Walkalong

    Walkalong Moderator

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    It doesn't "resize" again, it post sizes with a larger carbide insert. In theory it should only touch rounds bigger than SAMMI max diameter. (In theory) For rifles, no, case length is no big deal for the crimper, but for the pistol FCD case length is almost as critical as with a normal crimp die. It has a little play in the o-ring holding the crimp part still, so it has a little play which helps a tad. You still need cases to be close for best results. They are not magic, and cannot break the laws of physics. Yes, with a normal roll crimp die cases (IMHO and some disagree), need to be trimmed uniformly.

    What caliber nyc71?
     
  7. Rodentman

    Rodentman Member

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    I have often read that pistol (revolver?) cases needn't be trimmed. My .44 mag brass measured from 1.265 to 1.285. OK yeah mixed headstamps, various # of times fired. Obviously seating the bullets didn't result in correct cannelure location with respect to the case mouth. The crimping of course was all over the place too. So now I trim them although I have not found a trimmer that pleases me completely yet.
     
  8. Walkalong

    Walkalong Moderator

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    Tried a Forster? Or a Wilson?
     
  9. 918v

    918v Member

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    I like Lee.
     
  10. nyc71

    nyc71 Member

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    38 spl with/without callenure.
     
  11. 918v

    918v Member

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    Your FCD has a roll crimp built in.
     
  12. nyc71

    nyc71 Member

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    I already have a RCBS roll crimp, bought a FCD for separate crimping but all this it's so confusing. I keep reading that 38 spl needs roll crimp.
    Thanks for all the response.
     
  13. joneb

    joneb Member

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    When you fire a revolver the recoil pushes the gun back to the shooter, the remaining bullets in the cylinder are heavy and reluctant to move at the same rate as the revolver, so if there is not sufficient tension on the bullet by the case, the case will pull away from the bullet.

    I use what ever is necessary to keep the case from pulling from the bullet, I take a dial caliper with me when testing new loads to check for "bullet pull".
     
  14. ArchAngelCD

    ArchAngelCD Member

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    Like the others have said, revolver ammo uses a roll crimp and semi-auto ammo uses a taper crimp. My question is, what bullet are you using in the .38 Special that doesn't have a cannelure? Most, if not all bullets meant for use in a revolver will have a cannelure or crimp groove.
     
  15. joneb

    joneb Member

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    I have loaded Rainier plated .357 dia 140 and 158gr without a cannelure for 38spl and reduced 357 mag. I use a 9x19/38 cal Hornady taper crimp die for such loads.
     
  16. ArchAngelCD

    ArchAngelCD Member

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    Not you jibjab, the new guy... I was concerned he might be using the wrong bullet possible meant for reloading the 9mm so that the bullet would be the wrong diameter.
     
  17. nyc71

    nyc71 Member

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  18. ArchAngelCD

    ArchAngelCD Member

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    Those are great bullets and they do have a crimp groove. The Lee FCD will work fine for you, I use one all the time and I have never had it post-size any round that's gone through it. I like to crimp in a separate operation instead of crimping as I seat the bullet. Some people think it's a waste of time, I don't.

    Is your RCBS crimp die a stand along crimp die or does your RCBS seating die also apply a roll crimp? If it's stand alone you didn't need to buy another crimp die. (like the Lee die)
     
  19. nyc71

    nyc71 Member

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    It's the carbide roll crimp 3 die set.
     
  20. ArchAngelCD

    ArchAngelCD Member

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    Then you didn't need to buy the Lee FCD because you already have a stand alone crimping die.
     
  21. Walkalong

    Walkalong Moderator

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    Get a Redding or Lee taper crimp only die for those Raniers and taper crimp in a separate step. Works great.
     
  22. nyc71

    nyc71 Member

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    So am I doing more harm than good with this setup of RCBS roll crimp in station 4 & Lee FCD in 5?
     
  23. eldon519

    eldon519 Member

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    From Lee's website regarding pistol FCD:
    "A carbide sizer sizes the cartridge while it is being crimped so every round will positvely chamber freely with factory like dependability. The adjusting screw quickly and easily sets the desired amount of crimp. It is impossible to buckle the case as with a conventional bullet seating die. Trim length is not critical so this extra operation takes less time than it would if cases were trimmed and chamfered."

    I wouldn't say it's impossible to buckle a case with an FCD, but in general their claims are in line with my experience. It's a pretty simple concept, no physics-violation required for it to function as advertised.
     
  24. nyc71

    nyc71 Member

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    Thank you.
     
  25. eldon519

    eldon519 Member

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    nyc,

    Just saw your most recent post. I'd consider pulling the RCBS from station 4 and moving the FCD from 5 to 4. In my mind it is more of an either/or situation, though I suppose you can put it through two crimping operations as long as you aren't applying an excessively heavy crimp.

    I saw you mentioned you are shooting .38 Special. If you are making target loads in a full-size revolver such as a S&W K-frame or Ruger GP-100, you really wouldn't need much crimp at all, probably just enough to remove the case mouth bell. If you are shooting heavy recoiling rounds such as .38 Special +P and firing them in a J-frame, then you need to worry about making sure you are applying enough crimp to keep the bullets form pulling and tying up the cylinder. Heavy crimping wears out brass faster, so if you don't need it (defensive rounds, heavy recoiling rounds, magnum slow-powder rounds, etc), then I would error on the lighter side of the crimping spectrum.
     
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