Ruby Ridge Documentary
- Thread starter Zedicus
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Kodiaz
member
Disgusting all the feds that were there should be hung. Rachel Weaver is cute. I couldn't finish watching it, this crap pisses me off.
Ditto to both of this. I personally don't remember it real time as I'm only 19, but I've heard of it. In fact Randy Weaver actually stayed with a friend here (NC).
Rachel Weaver seems to be an extremely smart, attractive well polished and mature sounding young lady. I pity her and her family. Anyone know what she's doing and what Randy's doing now?
Bummer
Kodiaz
member
Wow big oops. Did the .gov even get a conviction??
Weaver only served a few months in prison. They only got him on failure to appear, and most of the sentence was knocked off for time served.
While I still maintain that Weaver is a nutball, being different is not a justification for what happened to him. I find his ties to white supremacists reprehensible, but being a jackass is not a crime.
While I still maintain that Weaver is a nutball, being different is not a justification for what happened to him. I find his ties to white supremacists reprehensible, but being a jackass is not a crime.
Sindawe
Member
What ties would that be? IIRC, the Weavers were white SEPERATISTS, not supremacists. They did not wish to live around blacks, asians, latinos and the corrupting influence of our current secular and materialistic culture. So they went to live in the woods apart from all that.
odysseus
Member
Pretty good 1-hour snap doc of the Weavers. I was very impressed with Rachel Weaver, she shows an emotional maturity well beyond her years.
For me what is the undisputable fact of this and the siege at Waco, is how easily our press, media outlets, and common people are fooled at what the truth is and real issues - and that the Fed in these examples new this and have been caught out right lying to the public. It is a sad, sad tragic story and people do need to wake up to the fact that the press in the US and the lowering of the denominator in critical thinking of the people is getting worse, not better.
Now to this statement here:
I am going to try to question this correctly. Are you saying that living around "blacks, asians, and latinos" is equal with a "corrupting influence" of a secular and materialistic culture? For the way you wrote this sentence would seem to think you are editorialising that, and maybe stating a personal opinion?
Anyway, it's no doubt that Weaver was not a neo-Nazi, but his association with them will always be a dark shadow around him and was what the government tried to use against him. I saw that they made that connection of Weaver being a "perfect" insider for thier own investigative designs which blew up in their face. Really upsetting stuff there.
For me what is the undisputable fact of this and the siege at Waco, is how easily our press, media outlets, and common people are fooled at what the truth is and real issues - and that the Fed in these examples new this and have been caught out right lying to the public. It is a sad, sad tragic story and people do need to wake up to the fact that the press in the US and the lowering of the denominator in critical thinking of the people is getting worse, not better.
Now to this statement here:
Sindawe said:
I am going to try to question this correctly. Are you saying that living around "blacks, asians, and latinos" is equal with a "corrupting influence" of a secular and materialistic culture? For the way you wrote this sentence would seem to think you are editorialising that, and maybe stating a personal opinion?
Anyway, it's no doubt that Weaver was not a neo-Nazi, but his association with them will always be a dark shadow around him and was what the government tried to use against him. I saw that they made that connection of Weaver being a "perfect" insider for thier own investigative designs which blew up in their face. Really upsetting stuff there.
Henry Bowman
Senior Member
I don't think that's what he meant. But even if that was what Randy Weaver thought, what's wrong with peacefully going off to live in the sticks so that it's no longer an issue?
The extent of his "association" with them was to attend one meeting at the government's request and then refusing to go back because he didn't agree with them.
odysseus
Member
Nothing wrong with that. I might disagree with racist attitudes and find them 99% misguided, but you are free to live in it (it's your loss) just so long as you keep to yourself too and don't tell me I can't be a neighbor because I am not white or dark enough as you.
I am just calling someone out a bit more to have them define what they said which seems ambigious.
Negative. You didn't watch the video? Weaver states himself, and his daughter, that he went there several times on his own with his family to attend meetings there and family events with his kids. He didn't agree with their ideology, but he befriended them. That's why he was a target by the Feds which they then turned into an epic disaster, lying to everyone about it. Let's keep the facts straight.
WayneConrad
Member
Very good film, nicely done. The editor does a great job of letting the people speak for themselves without trying to get me to agree or disagree. "Show me, don't tell me" is the mantra of good storytelling, and I think the editor of this film did well in that regard.
Sindawe
Member
Odysseus: I'm not saying that at all. I paraphrased what I understand to be the Weaver's motivation for living on Caribou Ridge. That they did not wish to live among those who are not caucasian. Nor did they wish to live among what they perceived to be the corrupting influence of our secular, material property driven culture. Here the word "and" serves as a conjunction between the two statements. Did you never watch School House Rock? Or was that before your time? No editorialization, and certainly not a personal opinion.
Carl N. Brown
Member
Wow big oops. Did the .gov even get a conviction??
There were ten charges against Weaver at his trial, which was
eclipsed in the news by the same federal bunch going haywire
at Waco April 1993.
Two charges were thrown out of court by the judge, based on
the prosecution witnesses' testimony.
Of the eight remaining charges, the jury acquitted Weaver on six
charges, again based on only prosecution evidence, since the
defense lawyers rested, saying the government had not proven
a case.
At sentencing, the judge noted that "crimes on pretrial release" would
have required a conviction on one or more of the eight charges
dismissed or acquitted, and the judge set aside that conviction
by the jury.
Weaver was sentenced only on failure to appear in court on
any of the dates given him: 19 Feb, 20 Feb or 20 March 1991.
(Last date he was given 20 March was allegedly a typo; a bench
warrant was issued for his arrest on 20 FEB since he did not show
on that date but he could have shown up in court on 20 Mar with
the Pre-Trial Services letter with the bad date with no problem.)
There were ten charges against Weaver at his trial, which was
eclipsed in the news by the same federal bunch going haywire
at Waco April 1993.
Two charges were thrown out of court by the judge, based on
the prosecution witnesses' testimony.
Of the eight remaining charges, the jury acquitted Weaver on six
charges, again based on only prosecution evidence, since the
defense lawyers rested, saying the government had not proven
a case.
At sentencing, the judge noted that "crimes on pretrial release" would
have required a conviction on one or more of the eight charges
dismissed or acquitted, and the judge set aside that conviction
by the jury.
Weaver was sentenced only on failure to appear in court on
any of the dates given him: 19 Feb, 20 Feb or 20 March 1991.
(Last date he was given 20 March was allegedly a typo; a bench
warrant was issued for his arrest on 20 FEB since he did not show
on that date but he could have shown up in court on 20 Mar with
the Pre-Trial Services letter with the bad date with no problem.)
Kodiaz
member
Wow that just made me nauseous. Guy loses his son and wife over this garbage. And none of the thugs that perpetrated this travesty gets a minute in jail. Man this makes me sick.
Al Norris
Member
It wasn't even about the piece of metal.
It was about failure to pay a $200 tax. Remember that, if you ever decide to improvise your 1040! Failure to pay taxes could cost you your life!
It was about failure to pay a $200 tax. Remember that, if you ever decide to improvise your 1040! Failure to pay taxes could cost you your life!
Don't Tread On Me
Member
These Brits who produced the program are extremely biased. If you can look past their BULL, then you can focus on the facts and events.
BTW, Rachel (the daughter?) is awesome. She likes .45/70's.
There's nothing better than seeing a pretty girl shoot a rifle.
BTW, Rachel (the daughter?) is awesome. She likes .45/70's.
There's nothing better than seeing a pretty girl shoot a rifle.
Husker1911
Member
Methinks Rachel might found a worthy audience. You go, girl.
gunsmith
member
Some parts of that movie
Made me very, very sad.
I disagree with Randy's statement "some Jews are better then others"
I felt like crying when I saw how sad his daughter was, and I agree with
him when he said "they came looking for trouble and they found it"
What the hell is this fixation on the Jews? Looking at the faces of the guys
who shot his wife and kids I can't tell what their racial background is.
Is Lon Horiuchi Jewish?
Some how he doesn't look very Jewish to me
Made me very, very sad.
I disagree with Randy's statement "some Jews are better then others"
I felt like crying when I saw how sad his daughter was, and I agree with
him when he said "they came looking for trouble and they found it"
What the hell is this fixation on the Jews? Looking at the faces of the guys
who shot his wife and kids I can't tell what their racial background is.
Is Lon Horiuchi Jewish?
Some how he doesn't look very Jewish to me
Don't Tread On Me
Member
What is this fascination with Lon Horiuchi? Sure he was the JBT trigger puller and a murderer, but he alone did not cause this. A whole system is at fault here. Lon Horiuchi, while guilty of murder and should be sentenced to death, is just one man out of hundreds (perhaps thousands) who are just as guilty. Lon Horiuchi couldn't have done what he did if there wasn't someone who made the decision to lay seige. He couldn't do it if the FBI, DEA and all the other acronym thug agencies didn't make it a mission to condemn or kill the Weavers. Everyone that was there, including the thugs in BDU's at the road block are just as guilty as Lon Horiuchi. Period.
**************
I don't like the video. That annoying narrator bombards us with his (the show's) stupid NWO conspiracy theory junk. The idea of this program is to portray the subjects as nutjobs, not to do a documentary on government abuse.
You can tell from his tone that they are sympathetic to the government, and judgemental of those who have *legitimate* claims against the government.
The neo-nazi stuff is perhaps the biggest RED HERRING ever. Being a neo-nazi is not a crime, and it is being thrown around as if it is a significant part of the story. It is not.
Only the events between Randy Weaver and the Government are relevant. And those events clearly show the government in the wrong. Mixing in the neo-nazi stuff into the Ruby Ridge story is just like mixing in religion to what happened at Waco. When Randy's wife got shot, it wasn't about neo-nazis. When the children at Mt Carmel burned to death, it wasn't about religion.
**************
I don't like the video. That annoying narrator bombards us with his (the show's) stupid NWO conspiracy theory junk. The idea of this program is to portray the subjects as nutjobs, not to do a documentary on government abuse.
You can tell from his tone that they are sympathetic to the government, and judgemental of those who have *legitimate* claims against the government.
The neo-nazi stuff is perhaps the biggest RED HERRING ever. Being a neo-nazi is not a crime, and it is being thrown around as if it is a significant part of the story. It is not.
Only the events between Randy Weaver and the Government are relevant. And those events clearly show the government in the wrong. Mixing in the neo-nazi stuff into the Ruby Ridge story is just like mixing in religion to what happened at Waco. When Randy's wife got shot, it wasn't about neo-nazis. When the children at Mt Carmel burned to death, it wasn't about religion.
gunsmith
member
I was just sayin
the "racial" make up of the people who shot his family up
and made the decsision to treat his poor family that way
are probably of the same racial heritage as Weaver and the
maryann nations...and Lon is one of the most famous and
he sure doesn't look Jewish to me, thats all.
After MyLai most soldiers were taught they have no duty to obey a unlawfull order, I was in Basic in the 1970's when it was fresh and they told us not
to commit atrocities.
If I was at that siege I would have quit then and there.
Oh btw DTOM the nazi thing is a red herring but it's one that the film makers made it hard to ignore and Randy didn't help with the some Jews are better then others crack...
the "racial" make up of the people who shot his family up
and made the decsision to treat his poor family that way
are probably of the same racial heritage as Weaver and the
maryann nations...and Lon is one of the most famous and
he sure doesn't look Jewish to me, thats all.
After MyLai most soldiers were taught they have no duty to obey a unlawfull order, I was in Basic in the 1970's when it was fresh and they told us not
to commit atrocities.
If I was at that siege I would have quit then and there.
Oh btw DTOM the nazi thing is a red herring but it's one that the film makers made it hard to ignore and Randy didn't help with the some Jews are better then others crack...
Husker1911
Member
"Don't Tread On Me", someone pulled the trigger on a civilian.................................................................someone had to take personal responsibility. Someone was a monster.....................
Rereading your post, quite honestly, I don't disagree with you. Who/What is to blame here? Overzealous government/LEO agents.
How many of you "hometown" LEOs have shaven heads? And this helps your cause how? Don't you realize how this looks to the general public? Are you going to pull "safety concerns" with me?
Are there home invasion assaults by criminals in your precinct? Can't you understand how this plays into the fears of a common home owner? Don't you care?
The drug war doesn't warrant these "no'knock" warrants, no way, no shape, no form. Nor does a tax stamp.............................................
The Gestapo didn't ask for many societal concerns, either. Citizens should sleep soundly in their beds at night. Without the fear of masked government agents, "helping" them.
Rereading your post, quite honestly, I don't disagree with you. Who/What is to blame here? Overzealous government/LEO agents.
How many of you "hometown" LEOs have shaven heads? And this helps your cause how? Don't you realize how this looks to the general public? Are you going to pull "safety concerns" with me?
Are there home invasion assaults by criminals in your precinct? Can't you understand how this plays into the fears of a common home owner? Don't you care?
The drug war doesn't warrant these "no'knock" warrants, no way, no shape, no form. Nor does a tax stamp.............................................
The Gestapo didn't ask for many societal concerns, either. Citizens should sleep soundly in their beds at night. Without the fear of masked government agents, "helping" them.
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