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S&W 360PD w/.357 - wow!

Discussion in 'Handguns: Revolvers' started by ilmonster, Feb 13, 2011.

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  1. ilmonster

    ilmonster Member

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    Well, I was at the range today and the guy next to me had a Smith 360PD he was shooting. We began talking, and he offered the 360 for me to shoot. Now I have a 4 5/8" Ruger SuperBlackhawk in .44mag, have shot an airweight with .38+P, .45 +P etc. .44 Mag is not a joy to shoot, but it never hurts.

    Back to the range...I loaded two of my .38 spcl reloads in the Smith and one of my neighbors .357 rounds. My two rounds from an 11 oz. revolver were perfectly pleasant to shoot. When I lit off the .357 from the 11 oz. snubby, holy god! I thought I genuinely might have broken a bone in my hand. That was the first (and will be the only) round I've ever touched off that actually hurt to shoot. Now I understand why all the gunwriters write that one does not need to shoot .357's from a scandium revolver. I'll stick to a 642 with +P's if I ever am able to carry (I live in WI, hopefully soon to have CCW).
     
  2. NMGonzo

    NMGonzo Member

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    My sp101 does not hurt
     
  3. ilmonster

    ilmonster Member

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    Your SP-101 is indeed a delight to shoot. Then again, it weighs around 23 oz. as compared to 11 oz. for the 360. Enjoy your SP!
     
  4. TraditionalCatholic

    TraditionalCatholic Member

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    I just shot a Smith and Lesson 340pd yesterday. I was shooting .357 Magnum 158gr loads and you could definitely feel the recoil, but I don't think that it really hurt
     
  5. 357_

    357_ Member

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    my dad can beat up your dad ...

    Recoil is subjective. Yes, the snubs pack a whallop. I honestly think my sp-101 is the best balance of power-size-weight. It is a LOT of fun to shoot, but not painful.

    Personally, I like when everybody shooting around me stops and looks. Full power .357's and a snub will get you that a lot.
     
  6. NMGonzo

    NMGonzo Member

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    I never broke a bone in my hand and I am not planning to change that shooting a 340 pd :p
     
  7. MCgunner

    MCgunner Member

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    Those that like 12 ounce .357s can keep 'em. All I have to say. I do NOT want one. My pocket 9 carries 11 rounds (13 with the 12 round mags), is 14 ounces, is smaller than a J frame, hits where I point it, always goes bang, and puts a 115 JHP +P out at 1263 fps. Far less muzzle flash and goings on than .357 in such a light gun.

    My fav .357 carry is an SP101. I like the 3" version, too. .357s are belt guns for ME. YMMV If so, good on ya. :cool: I guess I just don't see the reason for the 360...nor can I handle the things without developing a flinch from hell. I'm a wuss. :D
     
  8. ilmonster

    ilmonster Member

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    I too like pocket auto's. I've shot a friends Kahr P7, and at 17 oz.'s empty was a joy to shoot (as is my M&P, Glock, etc.). I guess a 642/442 would be the lightest revolver I would shoot and carry.
     
  9. halfmoonclip

    halfmoonclip Member

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    I've got a 340 SC with the titanium cylinder. Thirty eights aren't too bad, tho' magnums are distracting to shoot. It is truly a delight to carry a lot, but not shoot very much.
    The smooth Secret Service grips are a huge help for recoil.
    Moon
     
  10. fastbolt

    fastbolt Member

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    I grew up learning to shoot using Ruger Blackhawks. Most of the heavier caliber loads I used in the big bore models were from the Ruger-Only part of the reloading manuals. ;) I thought that a fun afternoon was shooting several hundred rounds of stout handloads. I found shooting heavy Magnum .357's through a medium framed revolver a truly enjoyable pastime.

    I tend to dislike shooting the Sc/Ti J Magnums with full power Magnum ammunition, myself, though.

    I've done so to see what it was like, of course, and then to demonstrate that proper skills and techniques can be used to make fast & accurate hits on targets even with the heavier recoiling J Magnum Airlites. Fast & accurate doubles & triples out to 10 yards can be done, but it isn't what I'd consider pleasant. The palm of the hand does absorb some punishment, and the trigger finger gets walloped by the trigger guard.

    I carry +P loads in my Airweight J's rated for +P loads, as well as in my M&P 340 (chambered in .357 Magnum). I've used Magnum loads for occasional practice and quals in the M&P, but I mostly use standard and +P loads for training & practice and I prefer to carry +P's.

    I'd rather go back and resume conditioning and training for tamashiwara, abusing my hands on different types of makiwara, than consistently shoot Magnum loads in my M&P 340. :neener:

    I remember meeting one large, strapping young man one time who proudly proclaimed he'd fired several hundred Magnum loads through his 340PD, and that he only fired Magnum loads. He said he was eager to get a M&P 340 and exclusively shoot Magnum loads through it, as well. Good for him. More power to him. Better him than me. ;)

    Personally, I find my SP101 DAO to be a more pleasant platform for the use of Magnum loads.
     
  11. BlindJustice

    BlindJustice Member

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    Heck my MOdel 60 ..357 Mag 3" bbl. runs 25 oz empty and the same
    leng. Bbl. SP101 is a couple oz heavier . I llimit .357 mag in it to the
    occasional cylinder full. and then go back to .38 Special. HD/SD in it is
    .38 SPecial +P.

    Randall
     
  12. Prosser

    Prosser Member

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    I've got one as well. Depends on the .357 ammo. I can take Fioochi 148 grains at 1141 fps. There are other loads, Buffalobore that come to mind, a bunch of federal stuff, that was just plain painful, and unshootable.

    It's the speed of the recoil that kills, and, the little grips. Here are recoil calculations. Keep in mind that most of my big guns recoil in the 30-50 ft-lbs,
    and all are right around 30 fps. The light weight of the 360PD allows extremely high recoil velocity, and, this will really screw you up. Here are some loads I calculated prior to buying:

    360PD recoil figures:
    180 gr. L.F.N. -G.C. (1,400fps/M.E. 783 ft. lbs.)
    Recoil Energy of 41 foot pounds, and Recoil Velocity of 60 fps.

    158 gr. J.H.C. (1,475fps/M.E. 763 ft. lbs.)
    Recoil Energy of 37 foot pounds, and Recoil Velocity of 57 fps.

    125 gr. J.H.C. (1,700fps/M.E. 802 ft. lbs.)

    Recoil Energy of 35 foot pounds, and Recoil Velocity of 55 fps.

    148’s @ 1131 fps
    Recoil Energy of 13 foot pounds, and Recoil Velocity of 29 fps.

    12 oz last shot Fioochi load:

    Recoil Energy of 16 foot pounds, and Recoil Velocity of 38 fps.


    130@950
    Recoil Energy of 7 foot pounds, and Recoil Velocity of 21 fps.

    The last three listings are Fioochi, and, the bottom one is a .38 flat point
    load.

    Keep in mind a .44 is right around 20-25 ft lbs at 20-30 fps.

    That said, the scandiums are true pocket carry guns, that, without the lock, fit an important area. They give you the most punch possible in a pocket carry gun, with in addition to a bullet, you get the benefits of a flash bang grenade as well.:D
     
  13. ArchAngelCD

    ArchAngelCD Member

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    Of course not, it's a 26oz revolver. My 23oz S&W M640 doesn't hurt either but then again, we are talking about a 12oz .357 Magnum, not something twice that weight..

    I shot 3 rounds from a M340 and gave it back to the owner without shooting the other 2 rounds. I like recoil but that revolver felt like someone was smacking my palm with a 2X4. IMO the 15oz Airweight .38 Special +P is just fine for SD...
     
  14. ilmonster

    ilmonster Member

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    Prosser, you nailed it. I was shooting .357 125 gr. hollow points (actually, hollow point as after the first I was done). It's all about the speed and weight of the ejecta.

    My two 158 gr. LSWC, 900 fps .38 spcl. loads I shot out of the 360 before the .357 mag round were fine. That's my reload for my GP-100, which I could shoot all day from that gun (if I could afford that much ammo!).
     
  15. Prosser

    Prosser Member

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    I ran recoil numbers for a Model 60, that is double the weight of the 360PD. By doubling the weight, you cut the recoil SPEED down by half. This puts the really heavy loads at 30 fps recoil speed, and, this is liveable, if not pleasant. HUGE difference.

    So, comparing other .357's to the 360PD really doesn't work.

    By the way, the recoil speed on the first shot of the Fioochi ammo is 29 fps. It goes up to 38 fps on the last shot. Taking 4 rounds out of the gun increases recoil speed by 9 fps, or, nearly 33%. Pretty amazing physics
    when you get something that light.
     
  16. Garndawg

    Garndawg Member

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    Ah, all this is true. The 360PD (and it's brother the MP340, which I have) are not fun to shoot at the range.

    Which is not why I have one.

    It's because it spends it life in my pocket, where I wouldn't carry something heavier (gun that you have being better than the gun you leave at home).

    I feed mine a diet of .38+p, but it's nice to have that .357 capability should ammo ever become rare.

    Now I just need to find my favorite .38+p load in a .357 case. Keep the cylinder fouling down...
     
  17. 243winxb

    243winxb Member

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    My S&W 337PD @ 10 oz. is a handful in 38+P. Not for the average person. I also though i broke my hand on the first shot. My M60 38spec. is much more forgiving. Shooting 44mag., max load, double action is much easier.
     
  18. royal barnes

    royal barnes Member

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    I have tried a number of .357 rounds in my M&P 340 and have found the Winchester 110 and the Remington Golden Saber 125 to be tolerable if not comfortable. Any of the Buffalo Bore rounds and the WW Silvertips are just too painful for followup shots for me.
     
  19. ClemY

    ClemY Member

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    The reason I got a 360 and 340 in .357 is because I intended to shoot .38 type stuff in them, but was happier to have a .38 stressed to take .357 pressures in case of a goof while reloading. My scandium .357s are much more painful to shoot with something approaching full power loads than my .500 S&Ws are.
     
  20. NMGonzo

    NMGonzo Member

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    I know, but I was bored.
     
  21. The Lone Haranguer

    The Lone Haranguer Member

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    An ultra light weight .357 Magnum revolver is one gun I will never buy. As the OP noted, it might be OK with .38 Special loads, but if magnums are painful to shoot and you won't use them, why bother with the Magnum chambering? Just get it in .38 Special. The Ruger SP101 is the only small-frame revolver I've seen that is remotely shootable with magnums, not surprising as it weighs over twice as much.
     
  22. 340PD

    340PD Member

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    What are you buying the gun for? Self defense? The hammerless revolver is a very concealable pocket gun. For me lighter is better and the .357 offers
    me versatility. Even two onces is a lot in a pair of dress slacks. If you are buying a range gun by all means get a all steel frame revolver. You will save wear on you and the gun. I have both and I very seldom shoot the 340PD. Hopefully I will never need it for it's intended purpose. Just my 2¢
     
  23. MCgunner

    MCgunner Member

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    Well, I don't find that a good ol' 642 is all that unbareable in my pocket. In fact, a gun of 19 ounces rides un-noticed all day. I have a Taurus 85SSUL, same deal at 17 ounces. One can save a LOT of money by just getting a .38 if that's what you intend to shoot in it, anyway, and if you think you might double charge a load, you can always use Trailboss. Of course, if you're rich and don't care about money and every ounce is a bonus, hell, go for it. It's your money. I just look at these things from a po boy in retirement perspective.
     
  24. JoelSteinbach

    JoelSteinbach Member

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    My 360PD went out of my pocket and into the safe about 3 months ago, THe last time I shot a cylander full of 158gr I realized that I would be better off with something heavier and a less powerful round, The new S&W 38special Bodyguard is just a dream.
     
  25. TexasBill

    TexasBill Member

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    I think the S&W 360 and the Ruger LCR .357 are examples of having the technology to make something but not the sense to ask if it's a good idea. They're painful to shoot and the muzzle flash will blind you at night; just perfect for those quick follow-up shots that everyone recommends.

    I believe in practicing with the ammo I carry and I also know that proficiency comes with practice. That means I won't carry a gun/cartridge combination that I won't shoot on a regular basis. Since I don't feel that I need to prove anything by abusing myself with a handgun, I don't bother with guns that are too light for their chamberings.

    I also am not concerned about the adequacy of a .38 Special at belly gun ranges. The .38 Special, in a good loading, has shown its worth for more than a century. That's what I carry in my M637 Airweight. If I am carrying the Model 60, I usually have +P ammo on board. After a session at the range, I clean out the cylinders with a brush and a Scotchbright pad to remove any residue (I will admit I should start reloading to use the correct length brass).

    As to weight and concealment, I figured out long ago that carrying a gun at all involves some compromises. My Airweight with five rounds of .38 Special tucks nicely inside a pocket of the jeans or cargo pants that are my normal attire. If I have to get dressy, a slim Walther automatic in a good holster does the trick. Since I work at home, my Model 60, as it is right now, rides in an OWB holster on my belt. I carried a N-frame Smith & Wesson for years; the Model 60's weight doesn't bother me.

    If the 360 floats your boat, that's fine. From what I hear, they're well-made and sturdy.
     
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