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S&W M&P Roundcount and Notes

Discussion in 'Handguns: Autoloaders' started by Coronach, Jun 6, 2007.

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  1. Coronach

    Coronach Moderator Emeritus

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    M&P 40 Fullsize Roundcount and Malfunction History

    Total Rounds: 2592
    Total Malfunctions*: 5
    Reliability: 99.78%

    1080 rnds Blazer 180gr TMJ. Malfunctions: 4
    800 rnds Fiocchi 170gr FMJFN. Malfunctions: 1
    200 rnds Ultramax 180gr FMJ. Malfunctions: 0
    162 rnds Federal 180gr HST. Malfunctions: 0
    350 rnds Fiocchi 170gr FMJTC GUN DOES NOT FUNCTION WITH THIS AMMO*

    * See posts below

    M&P 40 Compact Roundcount and Malfunction History

    Total Rounds: 747
    Total Malfunctions: 8
    Reliability: 98.85%

    50 rnds Blazer 180gr TMJ. Malfunctions: 1
    200 rnds Ultramax 180gr FMJ. Malfunctions: 3
    420 rnds Blazer Brass 180gr FMJ. Malfunctions 4
    27 rnds Federal 180gr HST. Malfunctions: 0
    50 rnds Wolf 180gr FMJ GUN DOES NOT FUNCTION WITH THIS AMMO*

    I originally had this as a section of my sig file, but it got to be too unwieldy and limiting. Putting it here allows me to keep track of my rounds through these guns, and also allows others to see how well (or poorly) the M&P shoots. If you have any questions, ask away.

    The ammo tested is either what I have on hand, personally, or stuff issued by my PD (HST for duty, Blazer for training). If you have an ammo request, drop me a PM or post it. If you want to buy me ammo, hey...who am I to complain? ;) I'll take a sponsor!

    Mike

    Last updated 3/3/8
     
    Last edited: May 22, 2008
  2. Coronach

    Coronach Moderator Emeritus

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    Fullsize Malfunction Notes

    Blazer 180gr TMJ
    4 Malfunctions: 2 fail to fire (hard primers or light primer strikes), 2 failures to strip rounds from downloaded magazines (magazine issue?). All malfunctions occurred in first 500 rounds.

    Fiocchi 170gr FMJFN
    1 Malfunction: Hard primer or light primer strike (occurred around 600 rounds through the gun).

    Federal 180gr HST
    0 Malfunctions

    GUN DOES NOT FUNCTION WITH FIOCCHI 170GR FMJTC
    The gun will jam every other round with this ammo. It seems to be related to the profile of the bullet, which has a very sharp angle from the flat nose to the conical profile of the side of the bullet. I have put 350 rounds though the gun with this ammo, and it is very consistent; it just won't run. I did not include this in the malfunction tally simply because it was obvious that the ammo shape is the cause, and I was skewing the stats by trying to make the gun choke. No, it's not completely fair to just wipe out the malfunctions from the tally, but neither is it fair to include 100 malfunctions just because I'm stubborn. ;)

    The take home point from this is that truncated-cone style ammo probably won't run, so don't buy it! It's not just my gun, I gave some ammo to a few co-workers and their M&Ps choked on it, too. Caveat: if you buy Fiocchi ammo for your M&P, make sure it is FMJFN, not FMJTC. Specify before you buy (Sportsman's Guide sent me a mixed lot), because some places treat the two as interchangable.
     
  3. Coronach

    Coronach Moderator Emeritus

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    Compact Malfunction Notes

    Blazer Brass 180gr FMJ
    I experienced three malfunctions on my first range trip. Each of them was a case of the slide locking back on a magazine with one round remaining. Two of the malfunctions occurred with full-size magazines, which stick out significantly below the frame of the pistol and have a noticable amount of fore and aft play. This movement may or may not be bad, but at least one of the malfunctions happened when I was gripping the mag pretty firmly with my pinkie: this might have moved the magazine enough to trip the slide stop.

    While I don't find the reliability to be acceptable yet, I will note:

    1. If you have to have a malfunction, this would be the one to have. If it happens, you will eject the onboard mag and lose one round, or manually hit the slide release. Not ideal by any means, but a heck of a lot better than a double-feed.

    2. The magazines are really hard to load, and the movement of the followers seems funky and full of hitches. This mirrors my experience with the full-size gun...and after a few range trips they smoothed out.

    3. The full-size M&P also had a few issues with magazines on its first outing, that have not resurfaced since. Here's hoping the Compact does the same.

    Update 7/1/7: At rnd 250, the Compact got Dan Burwell's trigger job. What a great investment. Overtravel is gone, reset is positive, and any grittiness in the pull is eliminated. 100 rounds to check function, no problems.

    Update 7/17/7: 10 round magazine (E) locked back with one round in the mag, at about round 470. Almost every malfunction has been of this type.

    Blazer 180gr TMJ

    One instance of the gun not going into battery, between round #350 and #400. I'm not sure if it hung up waaaaaaaay early on its trip to the chamber, or if the slide locked back on a not-empty magazine (I was in a hurry, as I was qualifying with the gun for OD/BUG carry). I just slingshot the slide and it went into battery without a hitch. The magazine used was a 10-rounder (D).

    Update 6/16/7: The magazines get a LOT easier to load after they sit loaded for two weeks. ;) Zero malfunctions.

    Ultramax 180gr FMJ

    I had two failures to extract using this ammo on its first outing. I don't know, yet, if this was the gun, the ammo, or my shooting grip (I was tinkering around with it), but I'll be keeping an eye on it.

    Update 8/21/7: Another failure to extract, using the Ultramax.

    Wolf Ammo

    Update 5/21/8: The gun comprehensively fails with Wolf. Failures to feed and extract.
     
    Last edited: May 22, 2008
  4. gudel

    gudel Member

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    I'd like to see pics of wear area of this pistol please
     
  5. Coronach

    Coronach Moderator Emeritus

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    Give me a few days, and I'll post 'em. Not much to show, really.

    Mike
     
  6. Autolycus

    Autolycus Member

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    Sounds like it is a hell of a pistol. How do you feel it compares to the other major makers such as Glock, Sig, HK, and Springfield's XD?
     
  7. Coronach

    Coronach Moderator Emeritus

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    I'd say "as good." Mechanical reliablity seems to be acceptable, but the only way to know for sure is to build up a track record. My PD torture tested the design, along with several others (Glock and Sig included). The M&P was fine. The Glock was fine. The Sig (forget which model) had trouble, though I'm not sure how much useful information you can really glean from such tests.

    I think that the major differences between the different guns you mention are ergonomics, trigger systems, and other things that are as much a matter of personal preference as they are anything else. I personally find the M&P to handle and shoot better than a Glock, or the service pistol offerings of H&K or Sig, but others will find the opposite to be true.

    I shot an XD45 the other day and I really like it. I'm not sure I like it better than the M&P, but it certainly is good. I have found that I really have come to hate DA/SA triggers (many of the Sigs & HKs), and the Glock trigger, even the after-market ones, is just so mediocre to me. The XD's trigger was pretty good, though.

    It's mostly personal preference.

    Mike
     
  8. mlandman

    mlandman Member

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    I took my NIB M&P9c to the range for the first time today. 275 rounds with 0 malfunctions. 250 Am Eagle 115 gr FMJ & 25 Golden Saber SD rounds. I fed 1 full size mag w/17 rounds in it. Fed all 17 fine. In the first loading I had to work to get all 12 in the 2 mags that came with the Compact. It was also very hard to lock the mag into the grip with all 12 loaded. The mag felt as if it was getting spring bound. The follower is not as secure as in the full-size mag. The first 2 -3 rounds do not really "want" to be inserted. By the end of the session I was able to load all 12 easier.
    The gun shoots better than I (no big shock there!)

    [​IMG]
     
  9. johndoe1027

    johndoe1027 Member

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    Hope you don't mind if I join in, if so, you can just delete my post. ;)

    1796 rounds through my 9mm compact with 2, count em 2, malfunctions.

    One FTRTB (by about .01") on round #5 after coming straight out of the new box with no field strip, locked the slide back, two drops of hoppes on the inside of the slide rails, little on the chamber and barrel tip, then fire! Can't count that according to most guys. Most wouldn't even mention it but I do.

    Then one FTE on about round #1300 with an Atlanta reload that are pretty crappy rounds really. I didn't get to see which brass it was on the floor but I'm 99.999% sure it was a bad case.

    Couldn't attach my round count spreadsheet, looks like 12 different kinds of ammo so far. I love it I love it I love it! Did I forget to tell you guys how I feel about the M&P guns? :D

    Also, shamless plug for the M&P forums in my sig. Good place for specific questions. :cool:

    WWB - Remington - Gold Dot - Gold Dot +P - Cor-Bon JHP - Independence - Atlanta - Golden Saber - Hornady TAP - Magtech - Blazer Alum
     
  10. Coronach

    Coronach Moderator Emeritus

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    yeah, feel free to join in. I'm just going to edit the first three posts with updated info as I get it.

    Mike
     
  11. nwilliams

    nwilliams Member

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    I've got you beat:neener:

    http://www.thehighroad.org/showthread.php?t=278485

    Since I posted this I've put another 500 rounds through it! Did 200 today at the range, still not a single problem!

    The gun has earned my respect again, but again knock-on-wood;)

    Just ordered another case of S&B, maybe I can make it last a little longer this time:rolleyes:
     
  12. Coronach

    Coronach Moderator Emeritus

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  13. ShooterMcGavin

    ShooterMcGavin Member

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    Here is my M&P experience...

    M&P 40 Fullsize Roundcount and Malfunction History

    Total Rounds: 1850
    Total Malfunctions: 0
    Reliability: 100%

    Ammo used:
    WWB 165gr FMJ - 200
    Federal Hydra-shok 165gr - 30
    Blazer 180gr JHP - 30
    Double Tap 200gr WFN - 30
    HSM 180gr? FMJ reloads - 1560 (2 case failures)

    Notes: Straight out of the box, the M&P40 was not cleaned or lubed for the first 700 rounds. That included 200 WWB FMJ, 470 HSM FMJ reloads, and 30 Federal Hydra-shok. A couple drops of lube were added to the rails before the next 180 rounds (HSM reloads). At 880 rounds, the gun was stripped, cleaned, and lubed. It is now cleaned and lubed after every range session (usually 2-300 rounds). There has never been a malfunction of any type.
     
  14. MassMark

    MassMark Member

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    Coronach - Interesting thread! Thanks for sharing your findings on your M&P. I'm chomping at the bit to get a .45 M&P and threads like this are encouraging. I hope you don't mind a copycat when the time comes for my .45 M&P - seems like a good semi-formal way to keep folks informed.

    I do have a question: With all the ammo choices available, it seems you're somewhat limited in the rounds you're testing. Is there a reason for this? Just curious and thanks again....
     
  15. Dobe

    Dobe member

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    Yeah, thanks for the information. I have been thinking about an M&P for my wife. She wants the Glock, I want her to have the M&P...small hands.
     
  16. Coronach

    Coronach Moderator Emeritus

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    I tend to buy bulk. That explains the Fiocchi: I got 1k rounds of it, in a mixed shipment (FMJFN and the dreaded FMJTC) that I'm still burning through. I am issued Federal HST as a duty round, so I naturally want to make darned sure it runs in my gun. The Blazer is what we use in my department for training. So, once I'm dry on the Fiocchi, I'll buy whatever else I can get cheaply.

    I would strongly encourage you to invite her to shoot both and decide for herself. ;)

    Mike
     
  17. gudel

    gudel Member

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    interesting you mentioend that, my XD40 jams a lot with that ammo.
    This 170gr ammo works fine in G22 & HK P2000.
     
  18. Dobe

    Dobe member

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    Oh, I'm pretty sure she'll get what she wants. Both are good quality handguns.
     
  19. Coronach

    Coronach Moderator Emeritus

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    It's the bullet profile. It has to be. You can hear and feel the difference in the gun going into battery (when it does) between the FMJTC and every other type of ammo I have fired. Instead of the single CLACK you get from the slide cycling, with the FMJTC you get a KA-CLACK sound, and you can feel the hesitation as the cartridge rides forward, hits the feed ramp and then (hopefully) negotiates the turn into the chamber. Most FTFs from this ammo can be resolved by tapping the back of the slide with the palm of the support hand, as once the cartridge gets re-oriented, the recoil spring will push the slide into battery.

    It's infuriating, especially since I have about 300 rounds of it left. ;) It's not a total loss, though, since the ammo is perfectly good for accuracy work (single shots) and malfunction drills ( ;) ), and the brass is good brass. Still, I won't buy Fiocchi again unless I can verify that it is not Truncated Cone.

    Mike
     
  20. rugerfreak

    rugerfreak Member

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    Just 200 rounds through my full sized MP9---using 5 different magazines and 115gn WWB---No Issues At ALL.
     
  21. axeman_g

    axeman_g Member

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    435 rds through my M&P 9mm fullsize and not one hiccup.
    My issue seems to be POI ir 2 inches low at 10yds! I am going to insert the slightly uncomfortable (to me) large palm swell and see if the raises the POI.

    I am used to aiming front sight under target with ALL my other handguns. Maybe this one needs to be covered, which I am not comfortable with.

    I am going to try a heavier rds next time out also. All 435 rds have been 115gr ball ammo.
     
  22. gudel

    gudel Member

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    yeah the fiocchi 170gr has an odd shape bullet. but it's still a good ammo. fiocchi seems to fire hotter than the rest.
     
  23. rbernie
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    rbernie Member

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    It's the sharp shoulder on the nose - my M&Ps don't like the Ranier TC shape any better. A little more radius and they feed just fine.

    I have about 3000 rounds thru my M&P 9mm range gun so far, and dispite minimal maintenance (quick wipe down, basically) every thousand rounds or so it's never once failed me in any way. I shoot Blazer (aluminum) throught it almost exclusively.
     
  24. Coronach

    Coronach Moderator Emeritus

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    Concur. I think this is an important point to make known to buyers of the gun, and to people who get the gun and buy large lots of ammo.

    Personally, I don't think it is a horrible failing. I know now that the gun won't run with TC ammo. So, I won't buy TC ammo. Problem solved. I suppose if TEOTWAWKI happens and TSHTF when I'm stranded with my M&P in a warehouse full of TC ammo with marauding brain-eating zombies outside, I might regret my cavalier attitude. ;)

    Mike
     
  25. zahc

    zahc Member

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    I have probably 500 rounds through my 9c with no malfunctions and no attention paid to cleaning. This is about 80% WWB and the balance WWB JHP.

    The gun seems a bit reluctant to strip the first round from the magazine. It kind of goes foreward a bit, pauses, making you think it's going to stop but then it always chambers the round.
     
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