Sabots, Cast Bullets, and BH209

Discussion in 'Blackpowder' started by razorback2003, Mar 25, 2014.

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  1. razorback2003

    razorback2003 Member

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    Has anyone tried sabots, cast bullets, and blackhorn 209 in an inline 50 caliber muzzleloader that uses shotgun primers?

    I would like to order some sort of cast bullet from a cast bullet maker that will work in a shotgun sabot.
     
  2. Patocazador

    Patocazador Member

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    Most sabots are made for pistol-sized bullets. Using a hard cast-lead .44 or.45 semi-wadcutter in a sabot for a .50 caliber muzzleloader is commonplace.

    Lee makes a mold for a "key" slug but it doesn't go in a sabot. Again, shotgun sabot loads also usually use pistol bullets.
     
  3. rsrocket1

    rsrocket1 Member

    Joined:
    May 20, 2010
    Messages:
    1,667
    Location:
    Sacramento, CA
    Bullets:
    Lee TL452-230-TC
    Sabots:
    Yellow T/C .452-> .50cal
    FirstOuting_Bullets_zps4b65d937.jpg

    Primers:
    Winchester 209
    5A7B9297-5FFF-4442-8533-47F48D8E3133_zpsxlxdfci1.jpg

    Powder:
    Blackhorn 209
    Gun:
    CVA Optima Pro (old style with hex breech plug)


    Results at 50 yards (7/8" squares on target):
    Slide2_zpsde4d5cc1.jpg

    I've since bought a Lee 250g REAL 2 cavity mold and am developing loads with Alliant Black MZ. This powder has terrible metering properties and generates as much smoke as real black powder (shooting BH209 generates as much smoke as a .308 rifle). The ++ part of this combination is that each shot costs about 23 cents a shot compared to about $0.68/shot with the sabots/BH209.
    250gREAL_BlackMZ_zps59375bae.gif
     
    Last edited: Mar 26, 2014
  4. razorback2003

    razorback2003 Member

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    I've used the Powerbelt bullets with Blackhorn 209 in an inline muzzleloader, but I knew that there had to be a cheaper cast bullet with sabot option than the Powerbelt bullets. I also was not impressed with the accuracy of the Powerbelt bullets.

    You are not using gas checked 44 or 45 caliber bullets are you with the sabots?

    Also does it matter if the bullets are lubed or not? Most commercial cast handgun bullets are lubed.
     
    Last edited: Mar 26, 2014
  5. rsrocket1

    rsrocket1 Member

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    Location:
    Sacramento, CA
    The sabot takes care of the bullet to barrel interface. No need for lube or gas check. The bottom of the sabot is the gas check and the sidewalls both grab the bullet to impart spin and also seal off the gases. You can use bullets intended for gas checks, just don't install the GC's. The smaller diameter base will help get the bullet/sabot down the barrel a little easier.

    At least for me, the .452 bullet with the T/C sabot was really snug going down. That was good because I knew it would seal off the gases well and there is zero gas cutting on the sabot and no sabot residue in the barrel even after a session shooting 30+ shots. A loose sabot/bullet is not good in a muzzleloader. BTW, I never cleaned the bore of the gun during the 30+ shot session and there was no fouling of the barrel at all. A couple of patches soaked in Hoppes No.9 cleaned the bore followed by a couple of dry patches and one with a little oil before storage.
     
  6. curtste

    curtste Member

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    I've used Beartooth Hardcast with Harverster Crush Rib sabots and 90Gr of BH209. But, I ended up just going back to Hornady XTP .44mag bullets with the same sabot and powder load when I shot them up. They shot fine in my gun, but 300Gr of hardcast seemed like overkill for whitetail deer inside of 100 yards.
     
  7. razorback2003

    razorback2003 Member

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    I wonder if just some bulk 45 ACP 230 grain cast lead bullets that are flat point would work well for deer within a hundred yards.

    Would the lube on any commercial cast bullets hurt anything if the bullet is in a sabot?
     
  8. mohican

    mohican Member

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    Messages:
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    Location:
    somewhere in the buckeye state
    If you are putting pistol bullets into plastic sabots for white tail deer, I would just as soon cast them from pure lead. I wouldn't worry about casting from wheel weights or harder lead alloys - the sabot will act like a gas check and on a deer size critter with light skin/bones pure lead should expand a lot better.

    Remember, prior to sabots muzzle loading projectiles were cast or swaged from pure lead versus alloys. Hundreds of thousands of deer have fell to patched round balls cast from pure lead.

    If the game changes to something tougher like hogs or elk and you want more penetration versus expansion then casting wheel weight bullets and sticking them in sabots starts to make sense.
     
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