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Safety Warning!

Discussion in 'Handguns: General Discussion' started by Bowhunter57, Sep 25, 2011.

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  1. Bowhunter57

    Bowhunter57 Member

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    I had a Springfield Armory 1911 Compact Carry V10 and had been carrying it in a DeSantis OWB holster (carried in a 3:30 position), that was made for my M&P 9mm. It seemed to fit "ok", held it in place, but the trigger ring flaps/guards are too large for the SA 1911. I needed to purchase the correct holster for the weapon that I intended to carry!

    I have NEVER had a weapons mishandling incident, in my entire life. I've been handling all types of weapons since I was 10 years old.

    Anyway... A couple of weeks ago, my brother and were out fishing. As I got out of the car, I was getting our fishing gear ready to go and remembered my CCW was still in the car. (We had traveled a distance to this location and I had put my SA 1911 in the console.) When I retrieved the SA from the console, I checked the safety and it was on, so I pulled up my shirt and attempted to put it in my holster. Well, I wasn't looking at what I was doing and the SA didn't just slide in the holster as had done on previous occassions. So, I wiggled it in a side to side motion in attempt to get the pistol to slip inside the holster.

    What I didn't notice was that one of the ear tabs (trigger guards for the M&P) was pushing on the trigger, while the other tab had flipped the ambi-safety off. Ofcourse, my hand was pushing down on the grip safety at the back of the pistol grip and ....you guessed it. BANG!!! Needless to say, I was in a state of shock and afraid to look to see how much of my butt that I'd just blown off. :uhoh: Fortunately, all I got was a huge muzzle blast burn and concussion bruise from the short and ported barrel. Obviously, the shorts I WAS wearing were ripped to shreds, with the back pocket mssing and a bullet nick in my leather wallet. :barf:

    I'm not afraid/embarassed to tell this story, as it may help others and save lives to realize that every weapon has to be carried in its' own holster, that was designed for that weapon. I was very lucky and thank God, to this day, that that's all that happened to me. My brother was standing on the other side of the car, the bullet went into the grass and there were no other people standing around in the area. We made a pact to never tell our retired Mom, the events of that day.

    I had intended to keep my SA 1911 in the safe, until I purchased the correct holster for it AND get the ambi-safety removed. However, as of this incident I have sold the SA 1911 and replaced it with a Smith & Wesson M&Pc, in 9mm. Since I already own the service model, in the same caliber, I am familar with its' functions.

    Bowhunter57
     
  2. Cocked & Locked
    • Contributing Member

    Cocked & Locked Member

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    Thanks for sharing that info...ouch :eek: Glad you are OK!
     
  3. Mike1234567

    Mike1234567 member

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    Wow... glad you're okay. Thank you for sharing. The lesson is "get an appropriately-made holster". After seeing this I'll make darned sure to avoid that problem.

    What's the line in that Christmas movie? "You'll shoot your butt off, kid". Yeah, that's it.
     
  4. bigfatdave

    bigfatdave Member

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    Well, I'm glad you came out OK, mostly by luck

    If you were using the right holster, that wouldn't have happened
    If you were wearing a holster that was comfortable in the car, that wouldn't have happened
    If you had utilized the grip safety properly, that wouldn't have happened
    ... I talked about proper use of the grip safety while re-holstering in post #16 and #64 in this thread:
    ... http://www.thehighroad.org/showthread.php?t=615691

    Switching guns won't fix all your problems, although I wish I'd known there was a Springer 1911 on sale in the area because it was "unsafe".
     
  5. JohnKSa

    JohnKSa Member

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    An unusual amount of resistance when reholstering is a warning sign. Immediately stop trying to reholster, make the gun safe, and then determine what is causing the obstruction.
     
  6. dprice3844444

    dprice3844444 member

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    se fla i love claymores 01/sot
    coulda shot yourself in the butt and suffered brain damage,thats 1 reason i never carry a 1911
     
  7. David E

    David E Member

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    It's not the fault of the 1911, which has multiple safeties that must be defeated before it'll go off.

    The OP, who didn't watch while he reholstered, is only speculating about how it happened. Maybe the safety was already off from previous handling and he didn't see it. Maybe the holster tab engaged the triggerguard. Maybe it was his finger.

    I have a hard time understanding how the holster tabs could disengage a properly fitted thumb safety without even a partially attentive person knowing it.

    Using proper holstering technique, he would've prevented the incident, even using the wrong holster.

    The safeties and features on the 1911 don't exist on the M&P, so it's much easier to replicate the incident with it. Ironic, ain't it.
     
  8. Mike1234567

    Mike1234567 member

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    Actually, the M&P, in addition to the drop safety, can be had with or without a thumb safety and/or a mag safety.
     
  9. Zerodefect

    Zerodefect Member

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    This is why I love good hard Kydex. I recommend a Ravens Concealment Holster. Easiest to reholster holster I've used that still conceals ok.

    Crossbreed for IWB. (But you do have to be more careful IWB)


    Or make your own:
    DSC01648.jpg
    DSC02069.jpg


    Holds the safety on and covered so you can't accidentally flick it off:
    DSC02068.jpg
     
  10. David E

    David E Member

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    Yes, it does. Which version has the grip safety?

    Exactly.
     
  11. Mike1234567

    Mike1234567 member

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    True but the validity of a grip safety depends on how careful one is when shoving a pistol into a holster. Most folks I observe have the grip firmly in hand when holstering.
     
  12. David E

    David E Member

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    The grip safety gives the shooter an optional, safer holstering method, especially for someone who nearly shot their ass off.

    I suspect the M&P the OP purchased lacks the thumb safety, as most M&P Compacts do.

    If the difficult holstering of the 1911 wasn't a clue, which the OP speculates was sufficient to knock the safety off, then it will take much less effort to replicate his accident with his new gun.

    I just find it amusing that the OP sold the gun because it worked exactly as designed instead of reevaluating his gun handling methods.
     
  13. JTQ

    JTQ Member

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    I agree.

    It seems as if it would have been easier and cheaper to just buy a holster for a 1911.

    A holstering discharge is certainly more likely with an M&P than with a 1911.
     
  14. AK103K

    AK103K Member

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    I find it interesting that a few months ago, something similar was posted with a Glock being the gun that went off, and the 1911 boys were all over it telling us how safe the 1911 is, and how something like this couldnt possibly happen, due to all the extra safeties the 1911 has.

    Now of course, its not the fault of the 1911. :rolleyes:

    In both cases, it was user error, and similar user error with the same result.

    Im still amazed people will drop a grand on a handgun, and then spend $10 for an Uncle Mikes holster, or use something else they have laying around.
     
  15. Sky

    Sky Member

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    Glad you are OK but bet that hurt; especially the next day!
     
  16. vvanders

    vvanders Member

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    Yikes, glad you were okay.

    I second the Kydex recommendation, I've got a MTAC that's great for my P220 Compact. Leather on the inside for comfort and Kydex perfectly moulded for the gun model.

    6176534261_2884bdf879_b.jpg
     
  17. Bowhunter57

    Bowhunter57 Member

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    I do not dismiss operator error with the 1911. I definately should have paid attention to how I was reholstering...especially after there was the slightest difficulty.

    After the incident, I was literally "gun shy" of the weapon. If you've never had a close call of this nature (I hope it doesn't happen to anyone else), it will rattle you to your core. I didn't carry anything for over 2 weeks and then eventually went back to a .38 snubbie.

    I am in no way blaming the weapon, the safeties or other functions. It's a matter of familarity, as I've owned the M&P longer, have handled it more and more often. As much as I like my DeSantis leather holster, for my M&P, I like the look, feel and function of the Kydex & Raven holsters...even better. These hard shaped holsters retain their shape and some have release locks, which is even better.

    Many thanks to all that have replied and that have shown concern for my well being. :) It is my hope that this posting will help others to not make the same or simular mistake.

    Bowhunter57
     
  18. David E

    David E Member

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    When you undertake something as serious as carrying a loaded gun on your person for defense, then you owe it to yourself and everyone around you to be serious about it.

    Using a holster that fits "good enough" can bite you in the ass, like it nearly did here.

    Steve Malloy, a cop and gunwriter for SWAT was found dead last year. From what they determined, he'd been carrying a Colt 1903 (IIRC) in his waistband without a holster. He'd told his wife a few days before, "I really should get a holster for this."

    He bent over to tie his shoe when the gun fell out of the waistband, discharging when it hit the floor, the bullet striking him in the chest. He was found in the garage. He apparently was going to drive himself to the ER

    He had other guns that had holsters. The gun does not know you and will kill you or someone else in a moment of carelessness.

    Take this stuff seriously, do it right and never stop being careful.
     
  19. Ridgerunner665

    Ridgerunner665 Member

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    That is worthy of being repeated...loudly!

    Truer words were never spoken...
     
  20. 1911Tuner

    1911Tuner Moderator Emeritus

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    Yep. Too often, we're lulled into a false sense of "safety" with whatever design we're enamored of...and we get careless.

    Don't be that guy. It's not a toy and it damn sure ain't your "Little Friend." It's as dangerous as a rattlesnake, and it should be regarded as hostile whenever your hand is on it.

    Reholstering isn't something that is normally done in a hurry. Slow down. Pay attention.

    Is gun. Gun not safe.
     
  21. David E

    David E Member

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    I disagree with "gun not safe."

    It's not like the old kid game "Time Bomb," where you wind up a toy bomb, tossing back and forth until it goes off.

    A gun won't randomly and inexplicably go off by itself. THAT would be unsafe.

    As long as we use safe gunhandling AND devote our full attention to it, they won't simply "go off."

    "is gun, pay full attention as you handle it with respect."
     
  22. bigfatdave

    bigfatdave Member

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    Read this article by CorneredCat in its entirety.
    How to Safely Use a Belt Holster

    Now ... after you've read the whole thing ...
    Observe the last illustration in that article. THAT is how to place a gun in a holster, for a 1911 variant, you hold the hammer back and get off the grip safety.
    You also pay 100% attention to what you're doing, use a holster that fits the weapon, don't force anything, and you don't do stuff that causes unnecessary administrative handling like taking the weapon off just to ride in a vehicle ... get a comfortable holster and use it properly.
    Holstering in a belt holster is pretty much the same regardless of position, you shouldn't need to look even if the gun is in front.

    OP, get some snap-caps, stand/sit in front of the idiot box, and practice a smooth (not fast!) draw and re-holster every commercial break. After a while, add in dry-firing at every phone#/website/celebrity endorser/vehicle/whatever that pops up on screen, and then smoothly re-inserting the weapon into the holster. You don't have to hurry, you don't have to force it, and if you're going to drop the hammer or fire the striker in a negligent fashion, better to do it with a snap-cap in the gun in private, rather than causing a hazard to the public and an embarrassment to responsible carriers. The more I think about this, the more I get annoyed, your methods are just a headline waiting to happen, and that headline will be written to make ME and EVERYONE ELSE look like dangerous idiots, too. On top of that, if you pulled that stunt somewhere secluded and actually injured yourself seriously, you could die quite rapidly from blood loss. I doubt your fishing kit has GSW treatment materials in it, in fact I'd be surprised if there was a FA kit in that vehicle or someone who knew how to use it under stress. Do try to take some effective measures to not punch holes in yourself without warning, changing guns won't solve the underlying problems here.
     
    Last edited: Sep 27, 2011
  23. jerkface11

    jerkface11 Member

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    That grip safety didn't stop him from blowing a hole in his pants.
     
  24. bigfatdave

    bigfatdave Member

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    nothing was going to stop that from occurring until the OP learned how to handle a firearm
     
  25. jojo200517

    jojo200517 Member

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    I bet in addition of being ripped to shreds the shorts had a strange odor and lots of brown stains. I know mine would have. Glad ya didn't ventilate your butt cheek.

    Hope it didn't scare ya away from the 1911. Ya managed to defeat both the manual safety and the grip safety, and get the trigger pulled. 3 strikes against the operator and you got off lucky, may anger the glock guys but a glock would have give ya one chance before attempting to blow ya a new poop hole.
     
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