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Save a Life, Surrender Your Knife

Discussion in 'Activism Discussion and Planning' started by Deaf Smith, Jun 23, 2015.

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  1. hso

    hso Moderator Staff Member

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    You'll have to provide some real proof for that ridiculous claim since there's nothing out there that I've seen, and I track knife issues carefully, that indicates this is even a consideration much less tracked and there's no logic to the claim either.
     
  2. DHJenkins

    DHJenkins Member

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    This makes perfect sense for a country where name calling is a police matter, two men can behead a soldier in the middle of the day outside an army base while pedestrians just walk around them or filmp them, a life sentence is 35 years and denying voting rights to inmates and deportation of illegal immigrants is a human rights violation.

    The biggest thing we have in common is our langauge - and even that is way off.
     
  3. ironworkerwill

    ironworkerwill Member

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    Where will it end? Blunt fork tines, rubber toothpicks, clawless hammers, .... what then? It's idiocracy at it's finest.
     
  4. hso

    hso Moderator Staff Member

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    Nerf world is the goal of the well intentioned while ensuring everyone is under control is the more sinister.
     
  5. barnbwt

    barnbwt member

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    "Ruprecht! Put the cork, back on the fork, before you lose your other eye"

    773e3-6a00d8341dbac353ef0133f369b473970b-pi.jpg

    TCB
     
  6. Lycidas Janwor

    Lycidas Janwor Member

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    Yep, the UK is no better than Cuba in many ways, they are basically two sides of the same coin. In the UK, you can't say anything in public about things like marriage being between one man and one woman because that is considered "hate" speech. I remember reading an article about a preacher who got arrested for talking about Biblical marriage on a street corner. They arrested him and put him in jail.

    I'm guessing that the royal family is armed to the teeth. They have their own security force and the military to protect them from harm. Why doesn't the royal family tear down those walls and give up their arms, why does the average citizen have to do it but not the royals?
     
  7. natman

    natman Member

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    You are correct. I worked in England recently and bought a Swiss Army knife specifically because it didn't lock. I forgot it was in my pocket when I visited the Houses of Parliament and turned up at the security check. A guard offered to hold it to be picked up when I was done. He also carefully checked it to make sure none of the blades locked. If any had been locking I would have been arrested.

    I told him I was absent minded, not stupid.
     
  8. JustinJ

    JustinJ Member

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    Did you also read that he received over $20K in damages plus compensation for legal fees? The point is, occasionally reading articles about the UK, especially those with a political agenda, should hardly be considered adequate to make broad based conclusions about an entire country.
     
  9. stonecutter2

    stonecutter2 Member

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    When I visited London in 2008, I was surprised at how many public safety posters and ads I saw talking about "Knife crime" and "if you carry a knife, you're a criminal."

    It was as if someone removed "gun" from the ads, and inserted "knife."

    The news even covered "knife crimes" at times.

    Make no mistake - remove one "threat" and the media and politicians will find another. Criminals are criminals - even if they're reduced to rocks, they'll use rocks. And then the laws against rock crime will come to pass.

    Seeing this potential grim future gave me motivation to financially support organizations who fight to uphold the 2nd amendment.
     
    Last edited: Jun 24, 2015
  10. old lady new shooter

    old lady new shooter Member

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    "Criminals are criminals - even if they're reduced to rocks, they'll use rocks."

    They already do. It's a favorite method of Palestinian terrorists in Israel. The "rocks" are frequently large chunks of concrete, the size of a brick or more.
     
  11. JFrame

    JFrame Member

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    Thanks for the confirmation, Natman.

    Quick thinking on your part... :)

    .
     
  12. hso

    hso Moderator Staff Member

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    There are a lot of misconceptions about knife laws in the UK that our UK members have been able to dispel.

    Locking blades are legal to carry in the UK as long as there's a reasonable purpose (to/during/from work, hunting, fishing, recreational activities, etc.), but the burden of proof is on the citizen. Many of our UK members comfortably carry them because they have a ready "excuse", but the risk is there regardless. Assisted openers and autos are forbidden. Non locking blades require no explanation, but still face the same sort of restrictions we see in the US on specific places we can't carry them (I had to stash my folder at Hoover Dam of all places several years ago).

    While we vilify the UK and insult the people and politicians there we need to be reminded that we have many of the same laws in place here in the U.S. Even in TX you couldn't carry a Bowie or a folder with a blade longer than 5" and in San Antonio, the home of the Alamo, you couldn't carry a locking blade shorter than 5". In many states you can cross the state and find yourself entering and leaving jurisdictions that dictate different blade lengths and ban locks or other mechanisms (famous recently is Baltimore where the state of Maryland specifically excludes assisted openers from the switchblade classification, but Baltimore's law may allow an assisted opener to be treated as a switchblade). You could be legal in your home, illegal pulling out of your driveway, legal crossing from city to county and illegal again at the end of the day as you stop for food and yard supplies, all without changing the knife in your pocket! That was the case in my state, considered one of the best 2A states, until we spent 2 years getting preemption in place and then getting rid of the blade length limit and then the opening mechanism prohibition. It has taken over 2 years of effort to change the laws in TX so you wouldn't face the same problem, and we're only close at this point.

    So we may gasp at the extreme in the UK, but never forget we're not that far off of their absurdity in states with populations larger than England's.
     
    Last edited: Jun 24, 2015
  13. Lycidas Janwor

    Lycidas Janwor Member

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    I did not know that but thanks for letting me know. I still say it should have never gotten to that point.
     
  14. Lord Teapot

    Lord Teapot Member

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    we can make the broad based conclusion that the human life of law abiding citizens has very little value placed on it in the UK, due to the difficulty which the UK government, elected by the citizens of the UK, makes acquiring, much less using in self defense, weapons of any kind. this difficulty does not apply to criminals.
     
  15. armoredman

    armoredman Member

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    hso, perhaps another reason I am happy to live in Guns and Ammo's number one state, Arizona, as we passed a knife preemption law a while ago, the first one in the nation, i believe. It is the same as the firearms preemption law, that keeps the restrictions to what the state dictates...which is hardly anything. I have carried a SWORD in public here with no crazy consequences. (Good thing I didn't need it - I know next to nothing about using a sword correctly, but I was young and wanted to see what happened.) Our laws state you can carry any legal weapon concealed on your person within some fairly loose restrictions without a permit, so I would have to assume that a ninja-to would fit the bill...if you know how to USE one.
    Back to England...is there any hope they can change? This IS the country that gave the world the Magna Carta, the great great granddaddy of the Constitution...can they come back?
     
  16. hso

    hso Moderator Staff Member

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    armoredman,

    That was a Knife Rights effort and if AZ wasn't their first it was one of their very first preemption successes. :D

    Will England change? Possibly, but only a little towards our way of thinking, but not much. England's war on knives and self defense is an example to all of us what we have to be vigilant for.

    Most Americans don't know the crazy tattered quilt of laws prohibiting the most common knives that exist across their state and across the country. Americans are unaware that the knife in their pocket that trimmed a string this morning and might cut a seat-belt free this afternoon could be illegal in every jurisdiction they cross from the time they leave their door to the time they return and it could be illegal because of the opening mechanism in one jurisdiction, the lock in another, and the blade length in 2 more without ever leaving their pocket (matter of fact it could be illegal in their pocket or on their belt in different parts of the day:eek:).

    We like to pretend there are no crazy knife laws in the U.S. and that we can heap scorn on the U.K. with impunity, but it took years of work by Knife Rights and people in each state to get rid of the hodgepodge of laws in TX and AZ and TN and ... through getting preemption passed. It took years to get rid of lock mechanism restrictions and opening mechanism restrictions and blade length restrictions in those and other states and still we have NYC charging thousands of people every year with violating a gravity knife prohibition for carrying a one hand opener and TX making carry of a 6" Bowie knife illegal and Washington state making it illegal to sell, own or carry a 2" switchblade that is legal in California.

    So we can't forget that we've put many laws on the books prohibiting the sale, possession, and carry of common pocket knives in this country that are nearly as stupid (and in some cases) just as stupid as the knife laws in the U.K. and we have to work to ensure we don't fall prey to more and that we support organizations here fighting to get rid of them.
     
    Last edited: Jun 24, 2015
  17. barnbwt

    barnbwt member

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    "we can make the broad based conclusion that the human life of law abiding citizens has very little value placed on it in the UK, due to the difficulty which the UK government, elected by the citizens of the UK, makes acquiring, much less using in self defense, weapons of any kind"
    Uh, yeah, also that little thing about being prosecuted for any intentional injuries or harm caused to your attacker :rolleyes:. As they say down under (as well) 'self defense is no reason to own a firearm'

    Seeing as urbanization seems to be consistently at the root of this kind of moral disease, England's wildly lopsided distribution seems likely beyond redemption (as it has been for a good, long time, now).

    TCB
     
  18. Kaeto

    Kaeto Member

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    Here in Mi there is no knife law preemption. Right next to the city I live in there is a city where if you have a knife of any size you will get a minimum of 3 days in jail.
     
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