SBR, Suppressor, or SBS? Too Many Choices!?

[Still 2 Many Choices!?]

I'm finally going to do it!! Taking the NFA plunge!! A suppressor is high on the list, but so is an SBR. The SBS is not really looking all that viable at the moment, as I have plans for a future Saiga SBS project one day when funds allow.

Now to the SBR issue at hand. I am attempting to do this SBR the smartest way possible, and here is the thing. Do I register my Bushmaster rifle, or do I register my AR-pistol ? If I SBR the rifle, since these are the only two AR's that I own, that would(???should???) allow me to then possess uppers in any barrel length I choose to swap out on both platforms; as the AR-pistol is already legal with any barrel length, and once registered, so will the SBR.

Or do I register the pistol, and then simply add a stock after I get the stamp back? I won't be able to possess extra uppers if I go this route however.

If I do option one, and start gathering multiple short uppers after registration, all future AR rifle purchases would have to be SBR's or I'll have to get rid of the extra uppers to be in compliance. Option two would give me one SBR, and one rifle, with no AR-pistol; and I want the pistol.

So considering I plant to accumulate more AR's anyway, does option one make the most sense?

Still 2 Many Choices!?

 

[Javelin]

Well Still 2 Many Choices,

You cannot SBR anything originally manufactured as a Pistol (so your AR pistol lower will never be able to have a stock on it).
If your heart is set on an AR build SBR (and it is a good choice IMO) then my advice would be to pick the lower you feel you like the best and send in for the ATF tax stamp. You can then place any upper you want on it. Put the barrel length and overall length on the form of the set-up you will most likely have. It does not matter which caliber you place on the form (.223, 9mm, .308) just put the one that you will most likely have on hand first.

Past that the ATF does not care which caliber upper you place on it and no letter is required (now) to change the upper (hope I am making sense). The AR build SBR is a lego gun and the ATF understands this so they are very lax on the overall specs. They just require you are specific in the approval form. Past that you can modify it however you like.

 

[Still 2 Many Choices!?]

Javelin, thx for the response but I believe you are incorrect. If I was to add a stock to my Glock 23, which they do make, I would have created an SBR. You can certainly change a pistol into an SBR, just have to have the form 1/tax stamp first.

 

[jpatterson]

http://www.black-guns.com/870SBS Wood.jpg

 

[Javelin]

Javelin, thx for the response but I believe you are incorrect. If I was to add a stock to my Glock 23, which they do make, I would have created an SBR. You can certainly change a pistol into an SBR, just have to have the form 1/tax stamp first.

You can try I guess. I would just advise you in letting them know that your registration of a Short Barreled Rifle is actually manufactured originally as a pistol.

 

[CDignition]

Do em all.. get out the CC and let it melt a little.. A one man economy fluff,lol

 

[W.E.G.]

You don't need that stuff.

Now, get outside and paint the porch.

 

[Taurus44]

You can SBR a pistol, and once you have an SBR you CAN have multiple (short) uppers. Just do NOT put one of those short uppers on your non-registered lower!

The easiest route would be to SBR your pistol. Get the lower engraved and send in your forms. Once you get the stamp back, throw a stock on that bad-boy and roll! In the meantime, you can collect all the short uppers you want since your gun is already registered as a pistol.

 

[Still 2 Many Choices!?]

Thx everyone, and W.E.G; as we all know,"need" is very subjective . Besides, I havent made any major firearms purchases since the DSA FAL, and I know you approved of that one ! So before Xmas my revised short list for firearms is to SBR something, then save for an Xmas suppressor. Quite the stocking stuffer I know !!!

 

[Halo is for Kids]

If my state was friendly to the idea here's what I would do about it...

I would register a multi caliber marked lower just in case.

I would make sure the lower is of outstanding quality (that sucker's going to have to last)

This is what I had in mind:

 

[Javelin]

If my state was friendly to the idea here's what I would do about it...

I would register a multi caliber marked lower just in case.

I would make sure the lower is of outstanding quality (that sucker's going to have to last)

The ATF has been rejecting Form 1 applications with more than one caliber noted. They want one and one only. If it is an AR they don't care what caliber you do after it is approved.

If you have a non-AR platform and you would like to change the firearm (ie barrel length, overall length of the stock, caliber, etc). You can send them a letter explaining exactly what you are wanting to do and they will update the NFA database.

 

[Halo is for Kids]

The ATF has been rejecting Form 1 applications with more than one caliber noted.

-well I sure am glad that's the case. I'll sleep a little sounder tonight knowing I'm safe from hard core criminals with registered multi calliber sbr's.

 

[Conqueror]

You can absolutely register a pistol as an SBR, it is done all the time and javelin is 100% incorrect.

Also, if you have a single SBR lower - REGARDLESS of whether it was a pistol or a rifle first - you can own as many short uppers as your heart desires. The only requirement is that you keep the original upper to match the specs on the Form 1. If you ever sell that original upper you must notify ATF of the new specs so they can update the registry.

 

[Conqueror]

Also: I would get a suppressor first. I'm glad I did. Unless you're clearing houses, you don't urgently need that extra few inches of rifle maneuverability. But a suppressor is good for your health and can benefit everyone.

 

[Javelin]

You can absolutely register a pistol as an SBR, it is done all the time and javelin is 100% incorrect.

Ok I am 100% incorrect. I tried when I was originally trying to order one from RRA CLIII department and was told no to the SBR'ing of pistols due to ATF regulations.... I probably should just call the BATFE myself to get the scoop but that SBR is already done.

You guys just do whatever you can get away with while you can get away with it as I stopped trying to understand the BATFE and their ever-changing proceedures. My advice is only current personal experience through June 08.

Also, if you have a single SBR lower - REGARDLESS of whether it was a pistol or a rifle first - you can own as many short uppers as your heart desires. The only requirement is that you keep the original upper to match the specs on the Form 1. If you ever sell that original upper you must notify ATF of the new specs so they can update the registry.

And didn't I already say this?

 

[Javelin]

-well I sure am glad that's the case. I'll sleep a little sounder tonight knowing I'm safe from hard core criminals with registered multi calliber sbr's.

I think its because they can only select one caliber for the NFA database.

 

[rob_s]

I'd get he SBR and then the can. A can on a 16"+ barrel is pointless IMHO. The entire point of buying an SBR for me was to attach a can to and not have it be obnoxiously long and unwieldy.

SBR with can on top, virtually identical AR with 16" barrel on the bottom


Same two guns, less the can on the SBR

 

[rfurtkamp]

Ok I am 100% incorrect. I tried when I was originally trying to order one from RRA CLIII department and was told no to the SBR'ing of pistols due to ATF regulations.... I probably should just call the BATFE myself to get the scoop but that SBR is already done.

ATF does not care whether it was a rifle, pistol, or a lump of clay. The restriction on conversion is for AOWs, not SBR/SBS/DD. Those may never have had a stock on.

Half the reason certain 'pistols' are sold these days are for people to SBR - the HK-51/53/33/MP5 clones, Sig 556 pistol, etc come to mind.

Nobody really wants a 8 pound metal pistol firing rifle rounds.



All were pistols once.

 

[Javelin]

All were pistols once.

All are pre or post '86 AOW too.

 

[rfurtkamp]

All are pre or post '86 AOW too

As the manufacturer of all 3 above, they were pistols when I started. Never AOW.

 

[wdlsguy]

Pre- or post-1986 is only significant in the context of machineguns.

 

[Still 2 Many Choices!?]

Conqueror- I plan to go with the SBR route first for a few simple reasons though. First, I alrady own the pistol AR, so when I get the stamp back I can use the 10" upper until I find a dedicated upper for the SBR. Second, the cost is only $200 for the stamp(see reason one above) as opposed to upwards of 400 for suppressor, then $200 more for the stamp. Last, if I got the can first, I would still need gunsmithing to remove the permanently attached AK muzzle brake before I could mount a quick detach system.

 

[mgregg85]

I have a nasty craving for a Tromix Saiga SBS, I wish they were legal here in MI.

 

[Conqueror]

All are pre or post '86 AOW too.

Negative. First, as wdlsguy mentioned, 1986 only matters for machine guns, not any other NFA item. Second, AOWs cannot have a shoulder stock, which all of those do. They are stocked weapons with OAL under 26" or barrel under 16" and are therefore defined as SBRs.

 

[Girodin]

I'm SBRing my gsg-5P. The major, if not only, reason they make those things is to SBR them.

While I dont have the stamp yet I have never heard before that SBRing a pistol was a problem and I have seen SBRs that started life as pistols.

After the SBR I plan to get a suppresor as well.