Scandium revolvers
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Jim March
Member
Ah. Yep, 990fps from a snub.
Interesting. Somewhere I'd heard it was higher...can't recall where though, it was more than a year ago.
Thanks!
<scratches head>
Stuff ain't that hot, is it? BuffBore's new mild 357s look good in comparison.
Betcha Tim is right, too...that 140gr Sierra JHP he's loading ought to work at his velocities. Cor-Bon was loading it hotter and it was coming unglued.
Veeery interesting. The Speer 135 in 357 is very accurate, that's one plus, but now we know why it's so controllable in 12.5oz scandium S&W 357 snubs. It ain't got no heat on it. Hey...you know what, Buffbore's 158+P tops it in energy levels. Jeez, bigtime.
Interesting. Somewhere I'd heard it was higher...can't recall where though, it was more than a year ago.
Thanks!
<scratches head>
Stuff ain't that hot, is it? BuffBore's new mild 357s look good in comparison.
Betcha Tim is right, too...that 140gr Sierra JHP he's loading ought to work at his velocities. Cor-Bon was loading it hotter and it was coming unglued.
Veeery interesting. The Speer 135 in 357 is very accurate, that's one plus, but now we know why it's so controllable in 12.5oz scandium S&W 357 snubs. It ain't got no heat on it. Hey...you know what, Buffbore's 158+P tops it in energy levels. Jeez, bigtime.
ArchAngelCD
Member.
I guess I don't need to answer!! LOL
mlandman,
Thank you for posting the links to show my numbers were correct.
mlandman,
Thank you for posting the links to show my numbers were correct.
I'm getting to not like the Speer GDHP 357 mag SB load. As Jim succinctly put it: "there sure feels like more energy difference than that!" It's a lot of flash and bang.
Of course, ~32% difference is nothing to sneeze at. But it really does test one's patience and tolerance for recoil more than the 38+P load.
I believe I will sponsor JE223 to test of that load out of a Scandium snubby next month, after we finish with the GDHP 9mm round. I'm intrigued to see the difference in gelatin vs. the 38+P, and see if the flash and bang is worth the extra recoil.
Of course, ~32% difference is nothing to sneeze at. But it really does test one's patience and tolerance for recoil more than the 38+P load.
I believe I will sponsor JE223 to test of that load out of a Scandium snubby next month, after we finish with the GDHP 9mm round. I'm intrigued to see the difference in gelatin vs. the 38+P, and see if the flash and bang is worth the extra recoil.
Ala Dan
Member in memoriam
In The Snubby
One of my co-workers uses a S&W 325PD as his personal defense sidearm
on an everyday basis. He reports recoil too be sharp, but manageable~!
One of my co-workers uses a S&W 325PD as his personal defense sidearm
on an everyday basis. He reports recoil too be sharp, but manageable~!
RNB65
Member
I suggest you try to find one to test fire before buying. I'm betting that once you've fired 5 rds of 357mag thru one, you'll decide you don't want one.
I do not uinderstand this position
Quote: "I suggest you try to find one to test fire before buying. I'm betting that once you've fired 5 rds of 357mag thru one, you'll decide you don't want one."
Given:
1. The felt recoil is the same as the 442 using +p 38 special loads.
2. The 340 has the capability to shoot +P 38 special OR .357 rounds.
3. In any of the various models, the 340 has better sights. Red front ramp, Hi-Viz, or 24/7 nite sights. The only equalizier is the stock Crimson Trace grips that are available for both.
Why would anyone prefer the 642 or the 442 over the 340 series?
Quote: "I suggest you try to find one to test fire before buying. I'm betting that once you've fired 5 rds of 357mag thru one, you'll decide you don't want one."
Given:
1. The felt recoil is the same as the 442 using +p 38 special loads.
2. The 340 has the capability to shoot +P 38 special OR .357 rounds.
3. In any of the various models, the 340 has better sights. Red front ramp, Hi-Viz, or 24/7 nite sights. The only equalizier is the stock Crimson Trace grips that are available for both.
Why would anyone prefer the 642 or the 442 over the 340 series?
Vern Humphrey
Member
I don't know anyone who has one of these lightweights who enjoys shooting it -- and most don't shoot it much. I'd a lot rather have my Colt DS that I have put thousands of rounds through than I gun I shy away from practicing with.
Vern, although you don't "know" me, per se, you can now say you "heard about" someone who likes shooting their MP340: me.
I love shooting my 340 and 442. Lots of fun, and a great challenge. I shoot them at least once a week, most often 2x a week, and enjoy every round. they're a riot.
I love shooting my 340 and 442. Lots of fun, and a great challenge. I shoot them at least once a week, most often 2x a week, and enjoy every round. they're a riot.
joe4702
Member
Love my 360PD after putting a Pachmayr Compac grip on it. Slightly more bulky, but far more comfortable and easier to shoot than the stock boot grip.
Before changing grips, I was ready to sell the gun. Now its actually a fun range gun.
Before changing grips, I was ready to sell the gun. Now its actually a fun range gun.
orionengnr
Member
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News Flash..
The guy asked about the 325 PD, which is 23 oz 45 acp revolver.
Most everyone is going on and on about the 12 oz 357 model 340/360, 38+p/357 ammo choices, etc.
You are comparing apples and jalapenos.
The 325 has a bit of bite, but it is nothing like the 340/360.
I wanted one until I shot it and a Kimber Ultra Carry the same day. Both weigh the same (within an ounce), external length/height are similar. The 1911 is thinner and easier to conceal, and holds two more rounds.
The recoil of the 1911 was significantly less and I shoot it far better.
That settled it for me.
The guy asked about the 325 PD, which is 23 oz 45 acp revolver.
Most everyone is going on and on about the 12 oz 357 model 340/360, 38+p/357 ammo choices, etc.
You are comparing apples and jalapenos.
The 325 has a bit of bite, but it is nothing like the 340/360.
I wanted one until I shot it and a Kimber Ultra Carry the same day. Both weigh the same (within an ounce), external length/height are similar. The 1911 is thinner and easier to conceal, and holds two more rounds.
The recoil of the 1911 was significantly less and I shoot it far better.
That settled it for me.
ArchAngelCD
Member.
Because the M442 will cost you half as much as the M340, that's why!!
The 325PD is a great revolver if you are looking for something its size. For me, it is too large for a "pocket" gun. Mine stays in my fanny pack that I wear only when I am bike riding. I carry two full moon clips as extra ammo and the fanny pack lets me carry a revolver this size with no problem, so for a fanny pack gun, I really like it, but as a pocket gun it would be too large. I carry mine with Buffalo Bore 230gr. FMJ-FN +P ammo and I dont find the recoil to be objectionable--but thats me.
klover
Member
296 and 329 here
If I find a 325 for a good price I'll get it too.
Being that both are larger frames than a J frame, the recoil gets spread to a greater area, hence feels lighter. It's easier to find the larger handle in a pocket model like the 296. I would much rather shoot a 296 .44 special than a stainless 649 in .357. Weight is about the same, but spread out, so carry is easy.
I put the wood grips back on the 329 since it is not that bad on recoil with .44 mag bullets (recommended not greater than 200 grain). Accurate enough for most needs, follow up shots a little slower. Very packable.
I love Scandium
If I find a 325 for a good price I'll get it too.
Being that both are larger frames than a J frame, the recoil gets spread to a greater area, hence feels lighter. It's easier to find the larger handle in a pocket model like the 296. I would much rather shoot a 296 .44 special than a stainless 649 in .357. Weight is about the same, but spread out, so carry is easy.
I put the wood grips back on the 329 since it is not that bad on recoil with .44 mag bullets (recommended not greater than 200 grain). Accurate enough for most needs, follow up shots a little slower. Very packable.
I love Scandium
ArchAngelCD
Member.
Yeah, they are very ugly!!
I agree with LopLop. I've had a 340PD now for over 2 years. I practice with .38's, +P's and .357's. I'll admit I'll shoot alot more .38's than .357's but the .357's are managable. I have small hands and wrists too. I carry either 145gr Silvertips or the GoldDot 135gr Short Bbl .357's. Just ordered a set of LaserMax Grip laser sights for it. It's my daily carry.
I've found the recoil on my 325PD to be...faster...than my 625. Not painful at all, just quick.
The downside is that I had a bullet pull from the case at the range (or more accurately, the case pull off the bullet), tying up the cylinder and thereby the gun. The bullet was easily removed by pulling it out the front of the cylinder.
It was only the fourth round, 3 having been fired before it.
Examining the bullet, Independence 230 FMJ, there was a substantial groove around it from the case crimp, and it wasn't merely an undersized bullet or oversized case.
Yes, I know Independence ammo is not the best.
Nonetheless, if you are using a 325PD as a CCW, I'd do some measuring of your favorite ammo...measure OAL of a particular cartridge BEFORE firing, then place it 6th in the queue, and measure OAL again having fired the previous five.
Having fired thousands of ACPs out of Ruger Blackhawk convertibles and S&W 625s, this is the first instance of a pulled bullet for me. There's no doubt the heavier all-steel revolvers simply recoil slower than the 325PD.
The downside is that I had a bullet pull from the case at the range (or more accurately, the case pull off the bullet), tying up the cylinder and thereby the gun. The bullet was easily removed by pulling it out the front of the cylinder.
It was only the fourth round, 3 having been fired before it.
Examining the bullet, Independence 230 FMJ, there was a substantial groove around it from the case crimp, and it wasn't merely an undersized bullet or oversized case.
Yes, I know Independence ammo is not the best.
Nonetheless, if you are using a 325PD as a CCW, I'd do some measuring of your favorite ammo...measure OAL of a particular cartridge BEFORE firing, then place it 6th in the queue, and measure OAL again having fired the previous five.
Having fired thousands of ACPs out of Ruger Blackhawk convertibles and S&W 625s, this is the first instance of a pulled bullet for me. There's no doubt the heavier all-steel revolvers simply recoil slower than the 325PD.
SAWBONES
Member
I own two 340PDs and have fired hundreds of full power factory premium 125gr .357 Magnum JHP rounds through them when trying to find the best (most accurate and precise) loads for CCW.
The felt recoil is "sharpish" but not painful, and nothing that any experienced revolver shooter would find worth whining about.
I did find, after much experimentation, that my two 340PDs did their best with the Gold Dot "short barrel" .38 Special+P 135gr JHP load rather than with any of the .357 Magnum cartridges.
The felt recoil is "sharpish" but not painful, and nothing that any experienced revolver shooter would find worth whining about.
I did find, after much experimentation, that my two 340PDs did their best with the Gold Dot "short barrel" .38 Special+P 135gr JHP load rather than with any of the .357 Magnum cartridges.
orionengnr
Member
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- 5,709
Your opinion, and you are entitled to it.
However, read up a bit and you will find that most people who own one carry with 38+p. The recoil of a 340/360 (with 357s) is painful (my opinion, shared by a pretty good number of people), to the point that very few fire them enough to be proficient.
Note also that there are more than a few for sale with low round count. I owned one 360 and two 340s, and paid at or less than $500 each. They have all since departed, and I don't miss them...
Of the people I sold them to, only one claims to carry it with 357s...
SAWBONES
Member
"However, read up a bit and you will find that most people who own one carry with 38+p. The recoil of a 340/360 (with 357s) is painful (my opinion, shared by a pretty good number of people), to the point that very few fire them enough to be proficient."
I don't disagree with your experience or that of anyone else. I also agree that .357 loads aren't "fun" to shoot in these little lightweight guns. I just wouldn't refer to them as "painful".
What matters most is hitting your target, and as I noted, the Gold Dot "short barrel" 135gr .38 Special loads do this for me in the 340PDs better than any of the .357 125gr loads.
Best.
I don't disagree with your experience or that of anyone else. I also agree that .357 loads aren't "fun" to shoot in these little lightweight guns. I just wouldn't refer to them as "painful".
What matters most is hitting your target, and as I noted, the Gold Dot "short barrel" 135gr .38 Special loads do this for me in the 340PDs better than any of the .357 125gr loads.
Best.
FWIW, the Gold Dot short barrel ammo is not a hot .357 load. A real 357 load will do much better out of a snub (albeit with alot more flash and bang).
Rule #1: Know you customer. IMHO Speer loaded the 357 short barrel GD at that velocity because that's the velocity range where the bullet performs the best, and if it's more pleasant to practice with people will buy more of it.
Rule #1: Know you customer. IMHO Speer loaded the 357 short barrel GD at that velocity because that's the velocity range where the bullet performs the best, and if it's more pleasant to practice with people will buy more of it.
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