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Secret Hold put on legislation by Shadow Senator

Discussion in 'Legal' started by Thin Black Line, Aug 24, 2006.

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  1. Thin Black Line

    Thin Black Line Member

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    I learned something new today. Apparently, 99 senators are not really
    necessary anymore. Whether or not you want transparency on how your
    money is really being spent, I wonder how this could affect firearms
    legislation? What allows this action in the Senate?

    Furthermore, if such action is legal in the Senate, why hasn't some red-blooded
    American Senator always come forward and put a hold on legislation that
    infringes upon the Second Amendment?

    Let me re-quote for the skimmers out there:

    Yes, one Senator effectively vetos the bill for the other 99.
     
  2. Nitrogen

    Nitrogen Member

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    I'd love to see more on this secret senate rule.
     
  3. rbernie
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    rbernie Member

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    I seem to recall that the hold is not an official rule - it's a gentleman's agreement between members that indicates the intent to filibuster a bill in advance of the actual filibuster.
     
  4. longeyes

    longeyes member

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    The best government money can buy.

    Maybe, before we spread "liberty" to the savages, we'd better take care of our own latrine first.
     
  5. Waitone

    Waitone Member

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    I believe the term is "discharge petition".
     
  6. Sindawe

    Sindawe Member

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    From the U.S. Senate web site:
    Nothing there about a "secret hold". :scrutiny:
     
  7. xd9fan

    xd9fan Member

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    Could not agree more.
     
  8. tyme

    tyme Member

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    That's not a "shadow senator." It's just an unidentified/anonymous senator. And the hold is not secret, since everyone seems to know about it.
     
  9. orangelo

    orangelo member

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    How is this any different than small committees deciding which bills will see a floor vote and which ones disappear never to be seen again?
     
  10. longeyes

    longeyes member

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    He/she won't be "anonymous" for long. That we can count on. That identity will be on the Internet in 24 hours. That's why the Web is on the crack-down list.
     
  11. Thin Black Line

    Thin Black Line Member

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    Let me check the Politically Correct Phrasology Database: how about
    a "Senator in the shadows"? Oh, wait, we still can't use "shadow"
    because of the negative connotation. Let me work on this some more
    so it's palatable to the Two-Headed Partiya......working......working......
    Ka-ching!

    Here --the whole article has been re-edited:

    Titles aside, one must question which Senator leaked news about this
    so-called "gentlemen's" agreement?

    BINGO.
     
  12. Phantom Warrior

    Phantom Warrior Member

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    Is anyone else tired of a bill not getting passed because it MIGHT be filibustered? I agree with the suggestion put forward when the judicial nominees were in limbo. Make them filibuster the darn thing. Let them bring the wheels of the Senate grinding to a halt in front of God and everyone. Let them look like political jackasses for holding up the business of the Senate because they don't want to give something an up or down vote.

    Right now, this senator has effectively filibustered the bill already without expending any political capital or looking like an idiot for holding up the Senate. They should at least be forced to stand up and explain why they are opposing a bill that has wide support in both parties.
     
  13. Car Knocker

    Car Knocker Member

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    Doesn't have to be a Senator, more likely it was a staffer.
     
  14. Thin Black Line

    Thin Black Line Member

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    Anyone else remember the threat to fili the 1994 AWB that wasn't pursued?
    Again, interesting to see how they pick and choose when to apply these
    floor tactics. When you know who the actors are that play the characters
    of a particular scene, then you see how it all fits together as a rather lovely
    choreographed stage play.......mostly like Kobuki Theater in its style.

    Someone needs to shed the light on the Senator who would play the
    Kuroko!
     
  15. agricola

    agricola Member

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    Thats unbelievable - our Parliament is full of arcane trickery but none of the members have the power of veto over everyone else (only the monarch in theory).
     
  16. rbernie
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    rbernie Member

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    If the Majority Leader wanted, he/she could force the bill to the floor and disregard the hold. This is a courtesy hold for a period of time, and nothing more.
     
  17. Waitone

    Waitone Member

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    The situation is worse. How about congressing laboring mightly creating legislation because it plays well to the Great Fed Up and then torpedoing the legislations effectiveness by inserting language with nullifies everything else in the bill. Who pulls this crap? Start with Snarlin' Arlen. Example? Try Arlen's legislation designed to fix Bush's wiretap efforts. Both parties engage in the practice. :banghead:
     
  18. JohnBT

    JohnBT Member

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    Imagine the number of bills that would be passed each year if not for all of these sleight of hand tactics. The more they can slow things down the better I like the government.

    John
     
  19. rbernie
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    rbernie Member

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    Where's Jorge X. McKie when ya need him? :D
     
  20. Brett Bellmore

    Brett Bellmore Member

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    The reason you don't see "secret" holds in cases like the AWB, is that this tactic only works where most of the Senators are in agreement with it. It's a way for a bunch of Senators to block a bill, without any one of them having to own up to being the guilty party.

    They could over-ride the "hold" any time they wanted; It's just a convenient excuse not to act on a popular bill that Senators don't like.
     
  21. Robert J McElwain

    Robert J McElwain Member

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    Point of order please.

    I think the "secret hold" is just that, and it's to avoid embarrassment of the requesting Senator. A discharge petition is what is necessary for all the other Senators to get the leadership to release it over the objections of the secret Senator.

    Does someone no the details of this?

    Bob
     
  22. James T Thomas

    James T Thomas Member

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    republic democracy

    I believe the whole process of referring bills, after the first reading, is a method used to bypass our republic form of governement so that a small oligarchy; committe, can thwart the will of the people.

    With the computerization of the vote process within both the senate and house, there is no more a necessity for Committe review of proposed legislation, and for that matter, the practice of adding riders, etc. to bills can be eliminated, and must be, also!

    Bills for legislation must simply be voted upon by their own merit. And without interference of fillibustering. After all, that was the purpose of a senate originally anyway; that regional issues could be reviewed susequently beyond the self interest of vested local constituents, legislating through their representatives.
     
  23. cuchulainn

    cuchulainn Member

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    It's not a matter of being PC -- it's a matter of not confusing us.

    "Shadow Senator" and "Shadow Representative" refer specifically to Washington D.C.'s elected representatives in Congress. These people have the same lobbying/hobnobbing powers as other congressmen, they even have Hill offices and staff, but they cannot propose legislation or vote.

    Thus, your title made many of us think you were referring to Paul Strauss or Florence Pendleton.

    See: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_States_Congressional_Delegations_from_District_of_Columbia
     
  24. Car Knocker

    Car Knocker Member

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    Hopefully Herbert's son will revive McKie someday.
     
  25. Cosmoline

    Cosmoline Member

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    Notice how the "gentlemen" band together to cover their backsides. Maybe it's time for someone to burn down DC again. It is the anniversary of the last time that took place

    [​IMG]
     
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