Securing your collection: Safes, GPS, Cameras, etc

Discussion in 'General Gun Discussions' started by wacki, Oct 8, 2013.

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  1. wacki

    wacki Member

    Sep 16, 2006
    Reminiscing the Rockies
    This is an overall / master asset protection thread. All things that protect your valuables. My primary motivation is protecting my NFA stuff. Any advice is appreciated as I'm learning.

    Security Cameras
    • 8 meg or better resolution inside the property and out.
    • This will allow you to read license plates at 50 yards.
    • Many cameras are lousy or not admissible in court
    • Check local legal and regulatory requirements when determining the resolution needed in order to be able to use camera footage as evidence in court.
    • At $600 and up you can easily stream your cameras to your iphone. Cheaper if you have the tech expertise.


    General concepts
    • Bolting to the concrete floor is a must. Otherwise they carry it off and take their time elsewhere.
    • Get a safe that slows down a thief long enough to allow time for cops to show up after the alarm goes off
    • Amsec and many other high end safes will use carbide chunks in their walls to break drill bits and wear down grinding tools
    • Google "small TL-15 safe" to find a relatively high quality small safe.

    UL certification for safes
    • Class 125
    • Class 150
    • Class 350
    • Class TL-15 ( will resist abuse for 15 minutes from tools )
    • Class TL-30 ( will resist abuse for 30 minutes from tools )
    • Class TL-40
    • Class TRTL-30
    • Class TRTL-60
    • Class TXTL-60

    Other tricks
    1. SmartWater stains criminals with invisible dye
    2. GPS trackers are available for safes
    3. Anything CS gas related is a legal mess an not a good idea unless you have lawyers and engineers... and are a corporation / bank.
    4. Put a motion sensor next to your safe as some burglars won't use your homes door or window for entry
    5. Don't advertise what you have. Most of the time you've met the person that robbed you. They may be a plumber, pizza delivery guy, "friend", etc...

    Last edited: Oct 8, 2013
  2. CB900F

    CB900F Member

    Feb 22, 2003

    Where to start? OK, TL15 is for the door only, same with TL30. If all sides are rated then it would be a TL(15 or 30)X6. TLTR is a tool and torch attack rating & the same applies. The U.L. build classifications aren't mentioned at all. And I've got other irons in the fire at the moment.

  3. 303tom

    303tom member

    Jul 16, 2011
    Good Lighting, A Pitt bull + 4 & I keep most every thing else locked in the Arms Room..................
  4. ColtPythonElite

    ColtPythonElite Member

    Jan 8, 2011
    Safe, lots of exterior motion lights, good neighbors, a decent neighborhood, and insurance work for me.
  5. herrwalther

    herrwalther Member

    May 1, 2013
    Layers. Start off at your property line and work towards your firearms. They make motion detectors to put at the entrance to your driveway so you know when someone pulls up. I am not a big fan of motion detection lights outside, they just give the baddie light to see what they are doing. Instead Home Depot sells a motion detector that connects wirelessly to a surge protector you plug a light inside. I am sure others sell it but that is where I found mine. These will help when you are home. A professionally installed alarm system connected to a reliable home security agency will help secure firearms when you are away.
  6. Midwest

    Midwest Member

    Sep 13, 2011
    Also hidden compartments, walls, floorboards and rooms. Out of sight, out of mind.
  7. Outlaw Man

    Outlaw Man Member

    Jan 18, 2007
    Cleaning my guns.
    8 MP is overkill inside, and, in most cases, outside. I'd be looking at the 1 MP range indoors, unless you have an enormous house, in which case it's likely you can afford state-of-the-art everything. Outside, you're probably going to be fine with 1.3 or 2 MP in most scenarios. Again, it depends on the lenses and sensors, as well as having good lighting. Get good cameras with good compression (H.264, preferrably) and take advantage of the lower frame size to minimize your bandwidth and storage requirments.

    As stated above, generally, a camera with much lower resolution will be capable of license plate recognition. It really depends on your site, setup, and what you're trying to see.

    Yes, it's a good idea to check with local authorities to see what level of forensics is required. I'd venture to guess that outside of major cities, though, most won't be able to tell you, as they simply don't have a standard. A caveat: if you're doing this at a business, you can open yourself up to liability by installing an incomplete system. People expect a certain amount of protection to go along with it (who broke into my car while I was in your store?), and some courts are agreeing.
  8. NeuseRvrRat

    NeuseRvrRat Member

    Jan 24, 2011
    Wilmington, NC
    do you have a link?
  9. PRM

    PRM Member

    Apr 14, 2008
    Out of sight - and insurance
  10. Outlaw Man

    Outlaw Man Member

    Jan 18, 2007
    Cleaning my guns.
    River rat, I've seen it in trade magazines, so nothing offhand. I'll see what I can dig up, though.
  11. leadcounsel

    leadcounsel member

    Jun 5, 2006
    Tacoma, WA
    1. Operational Security.
    *Don't advertise or provide your address to strangers who know you may have guns. For instance, PIFs here on THR, or bills of sale for guns. Imagine how easy it would be for a nefarious person to PIF something only to get your home address, knowing you have lots of guns because you post here every day with pictures, your work schedule, etc.
    *Don't provide your work schedule or location to strangers.
    *Don't post on FB or other media about the trip you are going to take or while you are away. Post AFTER you return if you must.
    *Don't show off your collection to strangers or untrusted people.

    2. Layered security. Cameras, lights, alarms, dogs, etc. I like interior timer lights, maybe get a free TV off Craigslist and put it in a front facing room on a timer. The noise and light through a front window may deter thieves. Brace interior windows with custom cut wood dowels, or other locks. Consider braces against interior doors. Upgrade locks, doors, etc.

    3. Cut away areas where thieves can hide on your property. Consider fences or barbed wire for certain areas.

    4. A member here put crushy noisy gravel rocks around his exterior, which is noisy like walking on dry leaves. Good idea.

    5. Insurance. NRA Armscare is what I use. Affordable peace of mind.

    6. Don't store all your eggs in one basket.
  12. TonyDedo

    TonyDedo Member

    Sep 19, 2007
    Concord, MA
    11 replies and only 2 people mention insurance... Typical.

    You can spend a fortune and turn your home into Fort Knox, but all the alarms and safes in the world only slow a thief marginally. If you give a thief enough time and enough incentive, they'll get into anything.

    So give yourself a reasonable first line of defense, but don't forget that stuff is just stuff - it can always be replaced.
  13. Twiki357

    Twiki357 Member

    Jan 26, 2011
    Prescott Valley, AZ
    You will never stop a professional burglar, but most are smash and grab what they can and run. So, as far as I’m concerned, basic obstacles and a house that appears occupied is what I depend on. It may not be that much, but it’s what I can afford.
  14. RetiredUSNChief

    RetiredUSNChief Member

    Jul 9, 2012
    SC (Home), VA (Work)
    Perhaps all these things are necessary. Perhaps not. For me, I won't go overboard. If I wanted to do that, I'd keep an eye out for an old bank or credit union building where the business has closed up shop, buy the building and make it my home so I could use the vault for secure storage.

    This is not to say that I think all this is silly or overrated. Certainly not. It's wise to invest where needed, and nothing wrong with doing so just because.

    The world is not safe, nor even fair. I take precautions as I feel are necessary and insure things as I feel necessary. But I won't go overboard.

    As a guy at work once said about stuff getting lost, stolen, or broken:

    "Ain't nothing but a thing."

    And things can be replace.
  15. 22-rimfire

    22-rimfire Member

    Jun 11, 2005
    For those that do not use a safe, spread your firearms around and place them in multiple locations.
  16. Tejicano Loco

    Tejicano Loco Member

    Oct 11, 2013
    I have a couple other ideas which I plan to work into my "final/retirement" home.

    The main safe or safe room will have a disguised access. I have some ideas on this but it will depend on the home layout. Then I will have a relatively cheap safe in the bedroom where I will keep 5 or 6 cheap firearms as a decoy. It will also hold my daily carry and home defense guns when I am home.

    Have all images streamed via wi-fi to a secure website which I can access via an android app to view and review feed from any of the cameras in my home and around it. They can cut all cables, power, and even if they locate the unit uploading the feed all the data up to that point is already saved on-line.

    In addition to cameras I would like to have two-way communications to my smartphone with speakers and microphones around the house. Maybe I am wrong on this but I suppose having a realtime conversation with the intruders might make them less interested in hanging around too long.
    Last edited: Oct 12, 2013
  17. herrwalther

    herrwalther Member

    May 1, 2013
    When a thread says "securing" that usually means something tangible to protect a firearm collection. Insurance is a no brainer since anyone who doesn't insure thousands of dollars worth of deadly equipment that attracts sticky fingers, is a fool.
  18. thump_rrr

    thump_rrr Member

    Nov 7, 2010
    The North Country
    As others have already mentioned layers of security are a must.
    Something to think about is a second separate security system for the gun safe or vault completely separate from the one protecting the house.
    Different alarm company providing the monitoring, cellular backup, silent alarm, keypad buzzer disabled.
    This alarm will include a door contact, a tamper switch between the bottom of the safe and the floor, a mercury switch if the safe is somehow tilted, a rate of rise heat detector, and an external water level detector.

    Costco has a 4 camera system with DVR and smart phone connectivity for around $700 in Canada.
    I'm sure that it can be found for less in the USA.

    I belong to several ranges and it is surprising how many people advertise that they own firearms on their vehicles with Magpul, Browning and other decals that come with firearms or accessories.

    For those who think that they cannot afford to spend the money securing their firearms ask yourself if you can afford to replace everything your insurance company doesn't replace.
  19. Piratesailor

    Piratesailor Member

    Apr 20, 2013
    If they get past the three dogs, 2 pits and a chihuahua, AND my mother in law... They can have them. The chihuahua is vicious. Well, I guess they'd have to then break into a safe, etc.
  20. Akita1

    Akita1 Member

    Jan 4, 2013
    Hell (FL)
    Insurance. We can all be the best security experts on the planet but without 24/7 live surveillance, armed guards, dogs, a pissed-off wife/mother in law, kids who shoot better than me, etc., this is academic. The challenge becomes the truly irreplaceable stuff in our collections. All the insurance money in the world will not replace the one Luger 45 on the planet (or so I'm told).

    Still, it's all in the deepest, darkest hole in the house - the fallback best-defensible position in case of home invasion/at home burglary. Almost (almost) prefer that scenario, of course without the family at home that night…step in the parlor.
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