Self defense shooting in the news: Sarasota, FL
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jfh
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for convenience' sake--
other than link and url text, this is the complete article.
Note that this guy is a Post Office Employee. Here's hoping he doesn't get fired.
Jim H.
other than link and url text, this is the complete article.
SARASOTA -
Elliott Firby left the post office on Tallevast Road, where he has worked the night shift as a mail sorter for the past 13 years, and headed home on Thursday.
It was 2:45 a.m. and he was alone on the road, save for a dark pickup truck that slowed down, let Firby pass and started following him on University Parkway.
Firby was suspicious.
“Something is fixing to jump off,” he recalled thinking to himself, as he sat at a table at the Sarasota Police Department on Thursday afternoon and told the story to reporters.
The truck was still behind him when Firby pulled into his driveway on Rilma Avenue and got out to open a gate. A guy jumped out of the truck with a shotgun — politely telling Firby that he was being robbed.
“Give it up, sir,” he said.
Firby, 54, had followed recent news reports of violence in Newtown, especially a rise in shootings and a recent spate of home invasions. His wife was asleep inside the home and he was concerned that the robber might try to get to her.
About a year ago — worried about the increase in crime — Firby and his wife got concealed-weapon permits.
“You have to do something to protect yourself,” he said. “The police can’t be there all the time.”
Firby started carrying a .380-caliber pistol wherever he went, stashing it in his pocket.
As the robber approached with the shotgun, Firby went to his knees to make him think he was complying.
The shotgun was covered with a T-shirt, police say, and the robber fumbled with it.
Firby reached for his pistol and fired a round, striking the robber in the stomach.
The robber stumbled back toward the truck and Firby fired again, missing as the truck sped away.
A few hours later, officials at Sarasota Memorial Hospital called the police to say that a teenager, Brandon Ellis, 16, had showed up with a bullet wound.
Ellis just finished his junior year at Booker High School, where he played basketball and football.
He has no arrest record, police say. His injury is not life-threatening.
Detectives plan to charge him with attempted robbery when he is released from the hospital.
Late Thursday, detectives arrested Ellis’ half-brother, Cadareus Ray, on an armed robbery charge.
Ray, 18, who graduated from Booker in 2008, was a linebacker on the football team and, after graduation, continued to play football at a junior college in California.
When Ellis was dropped off at the hospital, a surveillance camera filmed the black truck as he climbed out of it. Detectives found the truck later Thursday in front of the 25th Street home where Ellis and Ray live.
Detectives say Ellis and Ray were cruising Sarasota looking for someone to rob, and that it was Ray who gave Ellis the shotgun.
Firby says he had $5 on him.
“It wasn’t a whole lot of money,” Firby says, “but you do what you have to do when you’re looking down the business end of a shotgun.”
For Firby, the ordeal left him shaken, tired and thankful that he was armed.
He first thought about carrying a gun last year, as the the economy’s condition rapidly deteriorated.
People started moving out of his neighborhood and vagrants took over a few empty houses.
Once, someone cut his phone lines. Another time, when he was on a bicycle, someone shot him with a paintball gun. He and his wife figured it was time to take their safety more seriously.
They took a gun course, got the concealed-weapon permits and try to never leave home without a pistol within reach.
Detectives have cleared Firby of any wrongdoing in the shooting. Florida’s “Stand Your Ground” law — which allows people to use deadly force when they face bodily harm — was a factor in the decision not to charge him.
“He was looking at dying,” said Sarasota Police Capt. Bill Spitler. “And he has every right to defend himself.”
Elliott Firby left the post office on Tallevast Road, where he has worked the night shift as a mail sorter for the past 13 years, and headed home on Thursday.
It was 2:45 a.m. and he was alone on the road, save for a dark pickup truck that slowed down, let Firby pass and started following him on University Parkway.
Firby was suspicious.
“Something is fixing to jump off,” he recalled thinking to himself, as he sat at a table at the Sarasota Police Department on Thursday afternoon and told the story to reporters.
The truck was still behind him when Firby pulled into his driveway on Rilma Avenue and got out to open a gate. A guy jumped out of the truck with a shotgun — politely telling Firby that he was being robbed.
“Give it up, sir,” he said.
Firby, 54, had followed recent news reports of violence in Newtown, especially a rise in shootings and a recent spate of home invasions. His wife was asleep inside the home and he was concerned that the robber might try to get to her.
About a year ago — worried about the increase in crime — Firby and his wife got concealed-weapon permits.
“You have to do something to protect yourself,” he said. “The police can’t be there all the time.”
Firby started carrying a .380-caliber pistol wherever he went, stashing it in his pocket.
As the robber approached with the shotgun, Firby went to his knees to make him think he was complying.
The shotgun was covered with a T-shirt, police say, and the robber fumbled with it.
Firby reached for his pistol and fired a round, striking the robber in the stomach.
The robber stumbled back toward the truck and Firby fired again, missing as the truck sped away.
A few hours later, officials at Sarasota Memorial Hospital called the police to say that a teenager, Brandon Ellis, 16, had showed up with a bullet wound.
Ellis just finished his junior year at Booker High School, where he played basketball and football.
He has no arrest record, police say. His injury is not life-threatening.
Detectives plan to charge him with attempted robbery when he is released from the hospital.
Late Thursday, detectives arrested Ellis’ half-brother, Cadareus Ray, on an armed robbery charge.
Ray, 18, who graduated from Booker in 2008, was a linebacker on the football team and, after graduation, continued to play football at a junior college in California.
When Ellis was dropped off at the hospital, a surveillance camera filmed the black truck as he climbed out of it. Detectives found the truck later Thursday in front of the 25th Street home where Ellis and Ray live.
Detectives say Ellis and Ray were cruising Sarasota looking for someone to rob, and that it was Ray who gave Ellis the shotgun.
Firby says he had $5 on him.
“It wasn’t a whole lot of money,” Firby says, “but you do what you have to do when you’re looking down the business end of a shotgun.”
For Firby, the ordeal left him shaken, tired and thankful that he was armed.
He first thought about carrying a gun last year, as the the economy’s condition rapidly deteriorated.
People started moving out of his neighborhood and vagrants took over a few empty houses.
Once, someone cut his phone lines. Another time, when he was on a bicycle, someone shot him with a paintball gun. He and his wife figured it was time to take their safety more seriously.
They took a gun course, got the concealed-weapon permits and try to never leave home without a pistol within reach.
Detectives have cleared Firby of any wrongdoing in the shooting. Florida’s “Stand Your Ground” law — which allows people to use deadly force when they face bodily harm — was a factor in the decision not to charge him.
“He was looking at dying,” said Sarasota Police Capt. Bill Spitler. “And he has every right to defend himself.”
Note that this guy is a Post Office Employee. Here's hoping he doesn't get fired.
Jim H.
LightningJoe
Member
The BG chose to stop fighting. Had he wanted to empty his shotgun into his victim, he could have done so. Handguns don't often produce incapacitation. Had the victim had a more determined attacker, we'd almost certainly be mourning him now. But I'd still respect his choice to fight.
Hungry Seagull
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I say good shoot.
Stomach hits must hurt like hell, I dont think that youth would have had the mental witheral (Spelling?) to fight off the hit and continue to return fire.
Will the post master lose job? Probably, but that is one postmaster who is more than welcome somewhere up here where things are getting somewhat better outside the city.
The part about the driving with the truck's actions on the road was really firing me off with alarm bells all that slowing down and stuff... I dont play that game.
Stomach hits must hurt like hell, I dont think that youth would have had the mental witheral (Spelling?) to fight off the hit and continue to return fire.
Will the post master lose job? Probably, but that is one postmaster who is more than welcome somewhere up here where things are getting somewhat better outside the city.
The part about the driving with the truck's actions on the road was really firing me off with alarm bells all that slowing down and stuff... I dont play that game.
bigione
Member
If I were being followed, I would try to get to a busy aea or a LEO station. Also call 911. Still a good shoot and a heads up response. Next time, get the gun out earlier.
If it was me, and an Armed Robber was being polite and no-nonsense, if he was being respectful and economical in his manner, I'd oblige nicely-enough with no hard feelings and no bothers as for wanting to draw on him or harm him.
Rude or huffy or insulting/yelling Armed Robber, one bullying, one chomping at the bit to get into 'violence', that'd be a different story.
Granted, one is entitled to respond with deadly force if someone is threatening you with a Weapon...but as for me, it'd all depend on the man, his manner and presence, and my judgement about it, as for whether I really felt 'threatened' and or in any need of rebuking or harming him over it.
These sound like a couple of alright enough kids, who go into a foolish escapade-mode and they are lucky things did not go worse.
I hope they learned their lesson..!
And I hope the Judicial System is 'reasonable' to them for thier impetuous youthful mistake.
Rude or huffy or insulting/yelling Armed Robber, one bullying, one chomping at the bit to get into 'violence', that'd be a different story.
Granted, one is entitled to respond with deadly force if someone is threatening you with a Weapon...but as for me, it'd all depend on the man, his manner and presence, and my judgement about it, as for whether I really felt 'threatened' and or in any need of rebuking or harming him over it.
These sound like a couple of alright enough kids, who go into a foolish escapade-mode and they are lucky things did not go worse.
I hope they learned their lesson..!
And I hope the Judicial System is 'reasonable' to them for thier impetuous youthful mistake.
eight433
Member
yes but as far as obliging them, the attacker MAY have become more aggressive when he learned the man only had 5 dollars on him, shooting him out of spite or to scare him into giving him any more money he "may" have had stashed.
DawgsFan_07
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- 40
Agree with eight. I heard of that happening here not too long ago.
SCKimberFan
Member
Based on the story, good shoot. Another stupid 18 year old learned one of life's lessons the hard way.
RobNDenver
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- Mar 23, 2008
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- 275
IMHO Armed robbery with a shotgun is no escapade. Pointing a gun at a robbery victim is as vicious a felony as they come. Mr. Firby did a good job, and the perpetrators deserve a lengthy term in prison. "Alright enough kids", don't commit armed robbery
Gottahaveone
Member
I have written about 5 responses to this and can't seem to edit one to the point where it is THR acceptable. I don't know where you were raised, but in my neighborhood people riding around at 2am with a shotgun and performing ARMED ROBBERIES are not "alright enough kids". They are felons.
Hungry Seagull
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Not to mention DEAD sometimes from something before 18 at times.
Little children playing at big adult things... they get someone or themselves hurt or dead.
Little children playing at big adult things... they get someone or themselves hurt or dead.
Kind of Blued
Member
WHAT?!?!
Someone with a shotgun, who you have already identified as an "Armed Robber"? You treat them according to their manners?
Robbing people, threatening their lives, and pointing a shotgun at them, is bad manners, sir.
Sorry, Oyeboten is all wrong, in my opinion
because...if you give in to the guy with a shotgun in your driveway the man with the gun then sees that he has your house to rob also and maybe the two brothers decide to rape the woman who is in there. Not to mention they may just decide to off their two victims so there are no witnesses. Of course I am Monday morning quarterbacking but you cannot trust criminal thugs to be sensible and unselfish. Mr. Firby did the right thing once he let them follow him to his house. However, I will say that since he suspected some trouble brewing he should have driven to the nearest police station or went to an overnight business area or, if he had a cell call the authorities and keep driving for a police dept. If he wanted to protect his home he should not have let anyone follow him there.
because...if you give in to the guy with a shotgun in your driveway the man with the gun then sees that he has your house to rob also and maybe the two brothers decide to rape the woman who is in there. Not to mention they may just decide to off their two victims so there are no witnesses. Of course I am Monday morning quarterbacking but you cannot trust criminal thugs to be sensible and unselfish. Mr. Firby did the right thing once he let them follow him to his house. However, I will say that since he suspected some trouble brewing he should have driven to the nearest police station or went to an overnight business area or, if he had a cell call the authorities and keep driving for a police dept. If he wanted to protect his home he should not have let anyone follow him there.
earlthegoat2
Member
Nobody really knows how things will end up or who is going to shoot first or ends up dead or why. If you have legal right to shoot or not make up your mind and do it or not.
Some of all this unknown stuff is enough to make some people just shoot first and ask questions later. If that is the choice they make I will support them in it as long as it was a kill or be killed situation.
Some of all this unknown stuff is enough to make some people just shoot first and ask questions later. If that is the choice they make I will support them in it as long as it was a kill or be killed situation.
SCKimberFan
Member
He was suspicious but let them follow him home? Not too bright. I would have called 911 while I was driving and led these ID10ts all over the place, while advising the 911 operator of my location.
On a 2nd note, how does one politely tell someone he was being robbed at the point of a gun?
benEzra
Moderator Emeritus
Plenty of people have been shot when the "businesslike" robber pointing the gun at them turned furious when the victim didn't have as much money as the robber wanted.
It's not about the $5 in your wallet, it's about the load of 00 buckshot pointed at your heart, and the fact that the finger on the trigger of that gun pointed at you belongs to someone with little compunction about using it.
I say well done to this guy; reacted well I think, and who are we all to pick spots.
But, to throw in my post mortem armchair general comments in with everyone elses, I think if I'd have twigged on that I was being followed as this guy had, I certainly would not have gone home, I'd have kept on driving around till they either got bored/too nervous and gave it up - accompolished by driving somewhere as busy as possible at 2.45am, or preferably to the local police station. As well as not IDing your home, extra driving around would give time to think and plan and get ready for a confrontation.
But, to throw in my post mortem armchair general comments in with everyone elses, I think if I'd have twigged on that I was being followed as this guy had, I certainly would not have gone home, I'd have kept on driving around till they either got bored/too nervous and gave it up - accompolished by driving somewhere as busy as possible at 2.45am, or preferably to the local police station. As well as not IDing your home, extra driving around would give time to think and plan and get ready for a confrontation.
flrfh213
Member
i usualy carry a snub 357, but i never go home if i think i am being followed. it has happened 1 time but luckly i was told i had a tail light out after a leo interviened, the man folowing was being nice, no ill intent in mind. but you never know...
maskedman504
Member
WHAT? Point a shotgun at me and ask me nicely? These could surely be the signs of a sociopath.
As for the .38 ACP and ability to fight off the pain- this kid sure couldn't Pain can be an incapacitating factor, especially for a 16 year old lacking a spine.
Well...we all imagine differing scenarios when reading a bare description.
Sure, what is hard to imagine for one person, may not be, for another...we all fill in things as may be, when imagining.
One person's past experience, re-actions to evolving situations, fear, presumption, resentment, ipatience, 'programming', belief, or anything else, can and will differ from another's, if countinancing a threat or perceived threat, or threat-in-relation to their poise in countinancing it.
One person panics and rears and shoots a rearing Rattlesnake...another merely steps to the side and walks on...
Probably, the best thing for me, in any of these imaginative or speculative SD situation threads, is to never-mind.
We all are free to deal with exigency and personages, or mutable conditions of threat, and negotiaion with it, as our experience, judgement, presence-of-mind, and people/animal skills and imagination may permit.
Beyond that, all anyone can say for sure, is any given went-down, went down the way it did.
Sure, what is hard to imagine for one person, may not be, for another...we all fill in things as may be, when imagining.
One person's past experience, re-actions to evolving situations, fear, presumption, resentment, ipatience, 'programming', belief, or anything else, can and will differ from another's, if countinancing a threat or perceived threat, or threat-in-relation to their poise in countinancing it.
One person panics and rears and shoots a rearing Rattlesnake...another merely steps to the side and walks on...
Probably, the best thing for me, in any of these imaginative or speculative SD situation threads, is to never-mind.
We all are free to deal with exigency and personages, or mutable conditions of threat, and negotiaion with it, as our experience, judgement, presence-of-mind, and people/animal skills and imagination may permit.
Beyond that, all anyone can say for sure, is any given went-down, went down the way it did.
jim in Anchorage
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A lot of posters seem to be missing the point he had apparently gone HOME when the attempted robbery occured. I am not going so let some punks chase me around town when I am that close to my property."its my turf now,bring it on"
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