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self-defense

Discussion in 'Legal' started by johnl285, Jun 27, 2005.

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  1. johnl285

    johnl285 Member

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    if a burglar with a gun stole money and then walks away, are you allowed to shoot him in the back? it's california and he trespassed onto your yard.
     
  2. dasmi

    dasmi Member

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    No, you are not. You will be convicted of murder. If you were going to shoot him, you should've done it when he was threatening your life. Once the threat ends, ie, he walks away, that's it.
     
  3. scottgun

    scottgun Member

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    You can't shoot someone for trespassing (except maybe Texas)

    And you can't shoot someone who is retreating.

    If he is still a threat while his back is turned, they maybe. There are circumstances where shooting someone in the back maybe justified, but the short answer is no.
     
  4. WT

    WT Member

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    No, you are not. He no longer poses an immediate threat to you as he is walking away.
     
  5. dasmi

    dasmi Member

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    I could be wrong, but this smells like a troll. Like an anti trying to get us gun-toting redneck types to say "Hell yes! Shoot that mother-effer!"
    Apologies if I am incorrect, and this was an honest question.
     
  6. logical

    logical Member

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    No, but you are however allowed to follow him home and re-rob him of your money on his property.
     
  7. johnl285

    johnl285 Member

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    no chance to shoot him while he was a threat. suddenly in a summer afternoon, while eating hamburgers grilled outside with kids around, a man wearing black points a gun at your head and takes money. the kids are crying and hiding behind bushes. the intruder has a malicious confidence and smiles with his "power." then rushes away with his back turned. you have a gun hidden in your pocket...

    YOU'RE TELLING ME YOU CAN'T SHOOT HIM????
     
  8. dasmi

    dasmi Member

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    You cannot shoot him. If you do, you will end up in prison.
     
  9. johnl285

    johnl285 Member

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    and let me add to that, upon the assailant's death, investigators find that he has a criminal record, he owned an illegal unlicensed gun, he's an immigrant with an expired visa.

    YOU'RE TELLING ME THAT SHOOTING HIM WAS ILLEGAL???? (and yes this is a legitimate question by me, and don't curse and say "hell")
     
  10. dasmi

    dasmi Member

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    1) No, you cannot shoot him. That would be illegal.
    2) It find it interesting that you tell me I can't say "hell" presumably because you find it wrong, yet you ask if it's legal to shoot someone, who is no longer a threat, in the back as he runs away.
    3)
    What does that have to do with anything?
     
  11. scottgun

    scottgun Member

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    I hate to say this, but even illegal immigrant felon illegal gun owning thiefs are human. So all the rules apply.

    Now, as he was running away, you could shout to him that he forgot something, maybe you had some extra cash in a different pocket. Then when he comes back.... :banghead:
     
  12. Lennyjoe

    Lennyjoe Member

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    Once the perp turns to flee he is no longer an immediate threat unless he is firing his weapon over his shoulder.

    You can, if you want to try, to pull your weapon and shoot him while he has the gun to your head but you have about a 99.9% chance of loosing that fight.
     
  13. WT

    WT Member

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    johnl - under the conditions you describe, you cannot shoot him.
     
  14. johnl285

    johnl285 Member

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    You're Telling Me, If I Rob You With A Gun, All I Have To Do Is Turn My Back To You And I Have A Free Pass To Escape???
     
  15. epijunkie67

    epijunkie67 Member

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    Since you seem to be new to the whole self defense thing I'll try to answer your question.

    You may shoot someone in self defense only if they present,or appear to present, a direct threat to you or someone else at the mment you pull the trigger. Period. Thats it. No other time.

    If he is pointing a gun at you or a family member, or is in the act of doing so, you may fire to defend yourself. If he turns away and walks off, regardles of what else he did before that, then you may NOT legally shoot.

    Dude breaks in, hold you at gun point, beats you and the kids, rapes your wife, and steals your mothers ashes from the urn on the mantle and leaves. As he walks away down the street you retrieve your gun and shoot him in the back.

    Thats murder. Period.

    The threat had passed. Now, same dude is walking away and turns around to come back, maybe for a little something more? Now he's a threat. Now you can shoot.

    Bottom line. They must be a direct threat at the time of engagement or yu can't shoot.
     
  16. johnl285

    johnl285 Member

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    you're telling me a cold-blooded evil loser just has to turn his back, and suddenly he's a good guy and i'm a bad guy for shooting back?

    if someone knocks you down, are you going to stay down or get back up? is this sinful according to the bible?
     
  17. R.H. Lee

    R.H. Lee Member

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    johnl285- Rather than argue with the answers, why don't you try it and get back to us?
     
  18. KriegHund

    KriegHund Member

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    Smells alot like troll bait to me.

    Alot of us here dont feel like going to prison is worth revenge over a cash and a good scare.

    You can type in caps all you want, but thats the simple truth.
     
  19. epijunkie67

    epijunkie67 Member

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    "you're telling me a cold-blooded evil loser just has to turn his back, and suddenly he's a good guy and i'm a bad guy for shooting back?"

    Ahh, but you aren't shooting BACK. To shoot back you would be getting shot AT. But if they are walking away they aren't shooting at you, they are retreating.

    And shooting retreating people in the back DOES make you a bad guy. Sorry. Thats life.

    (And WAS illegal? I hope you mean WOULD BE illegal.)
     
  20. Risasi

    Risasi Member

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    No, now you are both bad guys. Only one is now dead.

    Is that a legal question, or a personal question? If it's the former, the answer is no. If it's the latter, I don't think that is a fair question to ask us what we would do unless we have been in that situation.


    It's legal, according to the laws of Israel, prior to their captivity by Babylon/Media-Persia, you were just in shooting someone caught in the act. You were not just in tracking that same guy down later and killing him.

    Is it legal now? No. Only when an imminent threat to you (and perhaps someone else, Fed. State and local laws apply), are you allowed to use lethal force.

    (Is there any other kind but lethal force?) :D
     
  21. johnl285

    johnl285 Member

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    http://www.mcsm.org/moreuse.html
    check this out in the middle of the page.

    "When robber Roger W. Green put a gun to the head of the wife of store owner In Doi Choi at his Minnesota Avenue SE convenience store on July 25, 1997, Mr. Choi killed the bandit with a shot in the back. The merchant was not prosecuted, either for the shooting or for illegal gun possession."

    WHY WASN'T HE CHARGED IF IT'S ILLEGAL??
     
  22. dolanp

    dolanp Member

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    If you get a DA sympathetic to self-defense who knows a jury will probably acquit out of sympathy then they may choose not to waste time prosecuting you. In CA, you are not likely to encounter such a mix of luck.
     
  23. WT

    WT Member

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    Prosecutor's discretion.

    Okay, john. You're a troll, setting up ambushes.
     
  24. johnl285

    johnl285 Member

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    so you're saying it's legal if the prosector let's it go? hmmm. and what's a troll and ambushing?
     
  25. epijunkie67

    epijunkie67 Member

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    Maybe becuse of this? "a gun to the head of the wife of store owner In Doi Choi " Now I don't know the incident but it sounds as though the bad guy had the gun at her head when he was shot. Thus, he presented a direct threat to someone. As I said before;
    "You may shoot someone in self defense only if they present,or appear to present, a direct threat to you or someone else at the moment you pull the trigger."

    Now if he is pointing the gun at you or the wife he can be shot by anyone from any direction. That removes the threat.
     
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