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Sending a gun to myself in another state?

Discussion in 'General Gun Discussions' started by fallingblock, Jul 21, 2008.

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  1. fallingblock

    fallingblock Member

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    Hello THR.

    I'll be returning to the U.S. again this fall and will need to get my carry
    revolver from AZ to FL (I hold CCW permits for both states).

    Is it legal to send the revolver to myself?

    If so, what carriers offer this service?


    Thanks.
     
  2. Jimmie

    Jimmie Member

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    Yes, you can ship to yourself. For a handgun, you have to use UPS or FedEx.

    http://www.atf.treas.gov/firearms/faq/faq2.htm#b8

    Or just travel with it.
     
  3. M203Sniper

    M203Sniper member

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    http://www.atf.gov/firearms/faq/faq2.htm#b7

    (B7) May a nonlicensee ship a firearm through the U.S. Postal Service?[Back]

    A nonlicensee may not transfer a firearm to a non-licensed resident of another State. A nonlicensee may mail a shotgun or rifle to a resident of his or her own State or to a licensee in any State. The Postal Service recommends that long guns be sent by registered mail and that no marking of any kind which would indicate the nature of the contents be placed on the outside of any parcel containing firearms. Handguns are not mailable. A common or contract carrier must be used to ship a handgun.

    [18 U.S.C. 1715, 922(a)(3), 922(a)(5) and 922 (a)(2)(A)]

    (B8) May a nonlicensee ship a firearm by common or contract carrier? [Back]

    A nonlicensee may ship a firearm by a common or contract carrier to a resident of his or her own State or to a licensee in any State. A common or contract carrier must be used to ship a handgun. In addition, Federal law requires that the carrier be notified that the shipment contains a firearm and prohibits common or contract carriers from requiring or causing any label to be placed on any package indicating that it contains a firearm.

    [18 U.S.C. 922(a)(2)(A), 922(a) (3), 922(a)(5) and 922(e), 27 CFR 478.31 and 478.30]

    (B9) May a nonlicensee ship firearms interstate for his or her use in hunting or other lawful activity? [Back]

    Yes. A person may ship a firearm to himself or herself in care of another person in the State where he or she intends to hunt or engage in any other lawful activity. The package should be addressed to the owner. Persons other than the owner should not open the package and take possession of the firearm.


    (B10) May a person who is relocating out of State move firearms with other household goods? [Back]

    Yes. A person who lawfully possesses a firearm may transport or ship the firearm interstate when changing his or her State of residence.

    Certain NFA firearms must have prior approval from the Bureau of ATF before they may be moved interstate. The person must notify the mover that firearms are being transported. He or she should also check State and local laws where relocating to ensure that movement of firearms into the new State does not violate any State law or local ordinance.

    [18 U.S.C. 922(a)(4) and 922(e), 27 CFR 478.28 and 478.31]


    :)
     
  4. myrockfight

    myrockfight Member

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    Are you flying or driving, or what? Or are you relying on the good ole U.S. military to fly you there and you can't fly with your handgun as checked-in baggage?

    If you are flying, I know there is a specific procedure to get it on the plane. You have to ship the ammo and the gun in seperate containers, etc. IIRC. Let someone else chime in who goes to competitions and what not. They do it all the time and would be able to tell you exactly what to do. Listen to someone who has done it frequently and recently. Then check to make sure that is right. I wouldn't want to screw the pooch on that one.
     
  5. fallingblock

    fallingblock Member

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    THR is a great place!

    Thanks for all the info folks. Just what I was after M203Sniper!

    I will be flying (ugh - used to be kinda fun before TSA)
    and would prefer to avoid as many hassles relating to airports
    as possible. Last time I was 'home' I got a body search
    for the Great Lakes Air pony flight up to ShowLow from PHX.

    The reason? I suspect it was because I'd declared 100 rounds
    of factory .38 SPL ammo in checked baggage - it must have
    been a slow day for TSA.:rolleyes:

    Are FedEx and UPS generally amenable to the procedure?
     
  6. jakemccoy

    jakemccoy Member

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    If I were flying, I'd rather send the gun through UPS or Fedex. Airlines and their pissed-off luggage handlers are not properly equipped to handle anything really. They consistently damage or lose my luggage. I don't even want to go on vacations with checked bags anymore because I'm tired of waiting a couple days for them to find my lost luggage. I can't imagine the stress of having a gun lost. At least UPS has tracking. I would strongly avoid checking a gun onto any commercial passenger plane.
     
  7. brickeyee

    brickeyee Member

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    While it is legal to ship a gun to yourself, good luck finding a common carrier that will allow it.
    Most of their own policies that restrict what they will allow.
     
  8. fallingblock

    fallingblock Member

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    Now there's a point....

    :uhoh:

    Has anyone had recent experience shipping from Phoenix?

    Jakemccoy, I agree wholeheartedly with your advice.

    As well as the body search incident last time at Sky Harbor,
    on all subsequent U.S. flights my bag was searched.
    I use inexpensive locks to monitor and provide TSA the
    entertainment of cutting them.:D

    There was a tremendous thunderstorm in progress when
    I departed Atlanta and the bag was apparently opened
    outside - the contents were soaked when I arrived at LAX.
     
  9. WBFletcher

    WBFletcher Member

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    My advice to you is to have the gun and accessories packaged up *before* you come into the store.

    Hell, come in to the store, pick up a white FedEx Express box, go out to your car, pack it up, come back in, and ship it off.

    Just don't check the box that is marked "Dangerous Goods", and don't tell the desk jockey that you're shipping a firearm, and you'll be OK.

    The chances of your package getting irretrievable lost are miniscule, so I personally wouldn't bother with shipping insurance, as that requires the shipper to visually verify what's in the box. If it's a gun, that raises red flags.
     
  10. FCFC

    FCFC Has Never Owned a Gun

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    Is that legal?
     
  11. Gator

    Gator Member

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    Nope.

    § 478.31 Delivery by common or contract carrier.
    (a) No person shall knowingly deliver or cause to be delivered to any common or
    contract carrier for transportation or shipment in interstate or foreign commerce to
    any person other than a licensed importer, licensed manufacturer, licensed dealer, or
    licensed collector, any package or other container in which there is any firearm or
    ammunition without written notice to the carrier that such firearm or ammunition is
    being transported or shipped:


    Unless you are sending it to one of the classes of FFL mentioned above you must notify the carrier.
     
  12. freakshow10mm

    freakshow10mm member

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    Federal law states you must inform the shipper that the package contains a firearm, but it is illegal for them to mark it as such.
     
  13. SASD209

    SASD209 Member

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    For legal purposes, this happened to a friend of mine:


    "I tried shipping my revolver from my hometown to my address in Wyoming that I was staying at (Note: I can CCW legally in both my home state and Wyoming). I worked out the timing so I would be there to accept it. USPS: no way. FEDEX: no way. UPS: no way. It was IMPOSSIBLE to get it done within their rules. Trust me, I printed everything out, went to and called at least a dozen shipping centers with these guys. They only ship to a FFL, and only within their rules. In the end, I printed out my Federal laws, alerted my attorney and family, and braved the trip to a NYC airport. I'm not going to say which airline, as this would give away the airport. I declared my unloaded and trigger-locked revolver with 25 rounds in the same lock box, and filled out the form. They looked at it and made sure it was unloaded, and away I went. No call to PAPD, no call for TSA, just "business as usual". I really credit the airline staff for being professional. It worked out that time, I'm not sure I'd tempt fate again."
    Long story short: you can't ship it via common carrier in the way the OP wants to.

    SASD209
     
  14. freakshow10mm

    freakshow10mm member

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    USPS said no because your friend probably isn't an FFL. Only licensed firearm manufacturers or dealers can ship handguns via USPS.
     
  15. jakemccoy

    jakemccoy Member

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    Your friend had another option of using an FFL dealer for a fee. I'd choose that option over checking a gun onto a plane. My personal experience with luggage getting lost just won't let me do it.
     
  16. SASD209

    SASD209 Member

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    Both correct.

    He is not a FFL, and he didn't want to ship the revolver to a FFL for a fee of $25 to $100 which they wanted for the transfer. Plus, he didn't personally know any of the FFL's on the receiving end. My basic point was that the OP cannot legally do the transfer he wants to (non-FFL, shipping to self).
     
  17. jakemccoy

    jakemccoy Member

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    Not only would this option be illegal, but also a scanner could easily identify a firearm in the package. It's not just a case of "concealed means concealed" wink wink. You have to deal with the stress of knowing you're breaking the law over a span of a few days. I would gladly pay FFL fees to avoid the stress, the likely jail time, the likely removal of my gun owner rights forever, the likely removal of my right to vote, etc.
     
  18. jakemccoy

    jakemccoy Member

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    Here's another option to avoid an FFL fee. Check only the frame (or receiver) on the plane with you. The frame (or receiver) is the part considered a firearm by the BATFE.

    Send all other parts through USPS, UPS, FedEx or whatever you want. The other parts are not considered a firearm under federal law. (Think about all the parts you can buy direct on the Internet; you can have everything mailed directly to you, except a completed frame or receiver.) You would not have to notify the carrier of what's in the package. Meanwhile, the dealings with the airline are more likely to be uneventful. If the airline loses your checked baggage containing the receiver, you're not quite as stressed.

    In many guns, the lower receiver (trigger housing) is the part considered a firearm by the BATFE. For example, on an AR-15, this is the lower receiver and the only part you'd check on the plane with you using the proper airline procedures for checking a firearm:
    [​IMG]
     
    Last edited: Jul 22, 2008
  19. fallingblock

    fallingblock Member

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    Oh well, I guess I'd better round up the FFL on both ends...

    Once again thanks for the info!:)


    Was that legal?I have been told that ammo and firearm need to be in
    separate containers.:confused:
     
  20. FCFC

    FCFC Has Never Owned a Gun

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    Sure he can. Looks like he either ran across some UPS/FedEx personnel who didn't know the regs and/or he didn't present the shipment properly.

    Accurate story short: Others have accomplished (legally) what your friend "can't" do.

    There's no question that UPS/FedEx personnel sometimes get all bureaucratic and finicky when faced with a firearm shipment from a non-licensee. But it usually can be worked out in an adult fashion.

    BTW, technically, I dont think that shipping a handgun to yourself is a "transfer."
     
  21. SaxonPig

    SaxonPig Member

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    It's legal, but all the carriers have a policy of only shipping to or from an FFL.

    The fact is, trying to ship a gun without an FFL is nearly impossible without crossing the law or carrier policy.

    BTW- Every single time I have tried to ship a gun the carrier has refused to accept the package if I told them it's a gun. The clerks never know the law or their own company rules.

    With an FFL wanting $20-$30 to ship for you, and the carriers requiring overnight at $60+, the cost of shipping is ridiculous.

    If you can get them to accept the package... which I never can.

    The last time I tried, I was sending a rifle to myself from out of state. Took it to the PO and he asked "It's not a gun, is it?" and I knew I was screwed. He said only an FFL could mail a rifle (wrong) so I gave him my C&R license (which IS an FFL) and he looked at it for 5 minutes. Then went and had the manager look at it for 5 minutes. He came back and started reading it again. I just picked up the box and left.

    Went to UPS where I did not tell them it was a gun. If that broke the law then good. Stupid laws should be ignored. Add it to the long list of laws I probably break everyday without even realizing it.

    That's the problem when you have too many stupid laws.
     
  22. FCFC

    FCFC Has Never Owned a Gun

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    You mean you left just when you were about to correct the clerk's misconception and get to ship your rifle (as you are clearly allowed to do by law)? Why did you give up?

    Interesting view.

    How do you decide which ones are "stupid?"
     
  23. highlander 5

    highlander 5 Member

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    A point here not made your FFL doesn't have to use UPS or Fedex to ship your pistol he can use the USPS and an overnite box that will be much cheaper than UPS/Fedex. next day to a local FFL and your good to go
     
  24. FCFC

    FCFC Has Never Owned a Gun

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    Can an FFL legally ship it (via USPS or UPS/FedEx) directly to the handgun owner in the destination state?
    :)
     
  25. brickeyee

    brickeyee Member

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    "Can an FFL legally ship it (via USPS or UPS/FedEx) directly to the handgun owner in the destination state?"

    No for USPS, handguns are FFL to FFL ONLY.
    Yes for UPS/Fedex.
     
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