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SGVGC THR Shoot in Southern California

Discussion in 'Rallying Point and Range Discussions' started by Beetle Bailey, Dec 22, 2005.

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  1. Beetle Bailey

    Beetle Bailey Member

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    heeheehee. . . I had a notion to open up the big dictionary I keep next to the keyboard, but that sucker is pretty heavy :eek: . . .

    Okay, so now everybody knows that I spell about as well as I shoot: In either case, if I get it on paper, I'm pretty pleased. :uhoh:
     
  2. Pointman1776

    Pointman1776 Member

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    BB, you are CORRECT sir, Kevlarman's EXCELLENT video shows you approaching the target behind the barrel, putting one through the terrorist's COM A-zone, and then, without hesitation and with extreme prejudice, shoving your muzzle just about right on top of the paper for a head-shot A-zone, and calmly squeezing the trigger like you were pouring yourself a glass of orange juice before sitting down outside and reading the morning paper.
     
  3. Pointman1776

    Pointman1776 Member

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    Some unsolicted feedback:
    1. Which one do YOU shoot better?
    2. Glocks are considered DA trigger firing control systems for the purposes for IPSC and USPSA, and so therefore are eligible for USPSA Production Division.
    USPSA Production division scores all Production approved pistols (see the list here on the USPSA website) equally as "Minor" power factor, regardless of caliber used or velocity of ammo. So there is no gaming advantage to shooting a .45ACP.
    Now, that said, the foundational roots of practical shooting is to practice with what you would most likely carry, and so, to that end, if you shoot the Glock 30 in .45ACP better or if you would like more practice with the Glock 30 or whatever, then by all means, shoot it!

    Bottom line is: bring what you like, and shoot what you bring!

    For more info, tips and tricks on practical shooting, click here -->
    What is Practical Shooting? IPSC? USPSA? IDPA? Explanation with 90+ free video clips!

    Cheers!
     
  4. Pointman1776

    Pointman1776 Member

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    btw, Black Majik, FO front sights ARE allowed in the new SSD.

    USPSA NROI Rulings: Fiber optic front and rear in Production and 1911 SS

     
  5. Pointman1776

    Pointman1776 Member

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    Still cleaning...

    Where does this part go again??? :confused: :confused: :confused:

    Parts_640x480.jpg
     
  6. Kevlarman

    Kevlarman Member

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    Actually, I think I shoot my Glock and CZ equally well. The only reason I picked the CZ to compete with is because 9mm is a lot cheaper to feed over.45 (and I only have two mags for the Glock).

    If I were able to get a CCW here in California, I'd definately be training more with my Glock. Alas, it's not to be. :mad:

    Fo now, I suppose I shall stick with the CZ until I get good enough to shoot off a bad guy's thumb at 25 yards (ala Rally Vincent). :neener:
     
  7. Beetle Bailey

    Beetle Bailey Member

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    Yeah, I was kinda wondering if you were gonna clean all those guns at the same time. . . :uhoh:

    A lot of times, she's doing it at CQB range, but I think the hard part is that the baddies are pointing guns right back at her :eek: .

    Hmmm. . . even though I enjoyed using my Colt last time, I can shoot my
    CZ75 again next time so you won't feel so lonely.
     
  8. Kevlarman

    Kevlarman Member

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    More videos!

    I could've sworn I had Mike's video up yesterday...
    Notice his dainty walk through no man's land! :neener:
    Click here to watch USPSA-Shoot-4-23-06-Mike

    This girl is pretty good!
    Click here to watch USPSA-Shoot-4-23-06-Female

    I think Eyon should have kept the cigar in his mouth... haha
    Click here to watch USPSA-Shoot-4-23-06-Eyon

    Forget his name, but he's fast!
    Click here to watch USPSA-Shoot-4-23-06-Some-Fast-Guy

    Oscar is pretty good too!
    Click here to watch USPSA-Shoot-4-23-06-Oscar

    Again
    Click here to watch USPSA-Shoot-4-23-06-Oscar-2

    Shooting some steel, plus the Five-SeveN!
    Click here to watch USPSA-Shoot-4-23-06-Steel

    These videos should play in just about any browser. It does take a few seconds to connect, and these videos are pretty big so let it load up fully.

    Let me know if there are any problems.
     
  9. Kevlarman

    Kevlarman Member

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  10. Pointman1776

    Pointman1776 Member

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    Dude! You're HIRED!! You are DA man!
    Your pics are incredible, and your videos are fantastic!
    How'd you catch the flying brass shots? All my shots with my camera come out crazy blurry, and don't even get me started on my video clips.

    THANKS!!!
     
  11. Pointman1776

    Pointman1776 Member

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    Some-Fast-Guy = world famous super squad GrandMaster and multiple world/national/local champion Taran Butler.

    Female = Ericka Ramirez. She was a fantastic junior shooter years ago, stopped shooting for many years, and is just now starting to get back into it...and she is coming back with a vengeance. She is awesome, even though she is still shaking out the cobwebs. She's one of my daughters shooting heroes, and they love shooting on whatever squad she's in.
     
  12. Pointman1776

    Pointman1776 Member

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    Some-Fast-Guy = world famous super squad GrandMaster and multiple world/national/local champion Taran Butler.
    He was testing a friend's pistol for the first time, and STILL spanked us even with the glitches. Amazing.

    Female = Ericka Ramirez. She was a fantastic junior shooter years ago, stopped shooting for many years, and is just now starting to get back into it...and she is coming back with a vengeance. She is awesome, even though she is still shaking out the cobwebs. She's one of my daughters shooting heroes, and they love shooting on whatever squad she's in.
     
  13. Kevlarman

    Kevlarman Member

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    Haha, I just take a crapload of pictures and post the ones that look the best. Captuing flying brass is pure luck!

    Thanks for cluing me in as to who the fast guy and female were. ;)
     
  14. Black Majik

    Black Majik Member

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    James,
    Awesome pictures and videos. Those are real clear!

    Eyon, thanks for looking up the legalities of FO sights. I think it'll be great for faster sight acquisition, but for some reasons I think when I need to shoot steel, I cant really shoot worth beans with a FO sight. I'll have to fiddle with it more to decide whether it'll be beneficial.

    Is Mike tip-toeing across the course? That would go real well with the "Pink Panther" theme song :D

    I cant wait to do this again!
     
  15. Pointman1776

    Pointman1776 Member

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    Okay...some initial thoughts (I'm tired and I'll be straight to the point):

    I am so IMPRESSED with the safety discipline exhibited by every single shooter. You guys are the class act. I'm fiercely proud to shoot on a squad with all of you, and can't wait to shoot with you guys again!

    We have FUN!! I HATE arsepole squads, and this squad has fun. Thanks guys!

    1. Keep moving. I'm doing better at shooting and reloading ON THE MOVE and DON'T STOP. Tactically and strategically an advantage for IPSC/USPSA.
      Note: for IDPA = shooting on the move and especially reloading on the move = FTDR (Failure To Do Right) procedural penalties in a big way (must do all that from "cover" position).
    2. Need to work on my reloads.
    3. Need to make sure shooter's gun truly is holstered before turning around.
    4. Need to do a more consistent job declaring range is clear before turning around.
    5. Need to remember that somebody is filming my antics...sorry BamBam-31 and Beetle Bailey - you guys did awesome, just funnin' - sorry if I caused ill feelings.
    6. Need to work on my reloads.
    7. Need to shoot faster.
    8. Need to check my score sheets when you guys are scoring me, because I can't, for the life of me, remember but a couple of no-shoot penalties, and yet on several stages I'm marked with 30 points in penalties - say WHAT?? I think you guys are dockin' me...at least that's my story and I'm stickin' with it.
    9. Oscar shoots my gun better than I do. Unacceptable. AND it was his first time shooting that gun in a match (my second match with that gun, but plenty of range time with it... :( )
    10. I still have a slight flinch with the DE .44Mag...gotta work on that.
    11. Kevlarman is hired. I hope you got to do some shootin'!
    12. Need to work on my draws.
    13. Need to work on my reloads...actually, I need Kevlarman to teach me reloads.
      By the way, if you guys want to see some bonkers reloads, check out this vid clip of Travis Tomasie reloading (shooting for USArmy Marksman Unit (US AMU)) at the time (clip is 2003 USPSA Open Division Nationals in Oregon):
      (hint: don't blink...)
    14. Need to move faster between targets.
    15. I clean shot the Texas Star for the first time ever = YAY!
    16. Accuracy over speed really jumped me up in the rankings from last time. I think, just maybe, there might be something to this "accuracy" thing I keep hearing about.
    17. I probably should stop saying "NICE!!" when a shooter is shooting his stage and just keep my mouth shut...sorry guys! :eek:
    18. When asking Kevlarman to "point the gun up so I can see inside" I didn't mean point the muzzle up into the sky (big no-no...which he didn't do anyway), I should have said, "keep the gun level (not pointed down to ground) so I can see inside the pistol" to visually ensure pistol is clear. Sorry Kevlarman for any confusion there, mate.
    19. Don't shoot to slide-lock...it wastes time. The idea of starting with a 10-round mag + 1 in the pipe is so you can shoot 5 targets (10 shots), and reload without having to rack/release the slide which takes more time than just reloading and keep shooting.
    20. Need to work on my reloads.
    21. We need to go back out again. Not sure I can wait another month to shoot a match with you guys...man, you really kept me on my toes and showed me quite a few things. Thanks!!
    22. Stage 4 was the classifier, right? If yes = all right baby!!! (more on that in my next post...)
    23. My buddy John simultaneous won AND lost the revolver division...heh heh...I'm gonna tease him for a long time on that one...:evil:
    24. Kevlarman needs to post a vid clip of the famous Beetle Bailey draw...that's CLASSIC! heh heh...:evil:
    25. Need to work on my reloads.
    26. Beetle Bailey is the slide master...nobody slides into home like he does...need to get that guy some cleats...
    27. Beetle Bailey should practice grabbing reload mags from the front to the back.
    28. Beetle Bailey is the master of the low crouch shoot.
    29. I think Beetle Bailey is overthinking his shoots and second guessing his skills...go with your instincts, my friend...and you will rock!
    30. BB needs some anger management
      (...whoops...was that outloud?)
    31. I like my new SIGARMS Law Enforcement hat - thanks emilsal!!!
    32. You guys could use some Kydex gear and CRSpeed Hi-Torque belts.
    33. Perhaps a Fiber Optic front sight (red? green? other?) would really help you guys, and dramatically make it easier (--> faster times) to acquire your front sight and engage the targets.
    34. Need to remember to wear my eye protection. DOH!!
    35. Need to work on my reloads.
    36. I wonder if the NROI allows RO's to smoke stogies while running a stage?
    37. Black Majik wants so hard to shoot a clean fast shoot that a slight hiccup in the gameplan appears to cause him to lose focus...trust yourself mate, just keep shooting! Shoot your way through it!
      Like this guy...
      Steve Anderson(1.8MB)
      It may take a while for Steve to wake up and get in the game, but when he does, watch out.
    38. At this rate, it won't be long before Black Majik starts spankin' me without even breakin' a sweat.
    39. ABearden is a smooth shooter...that's the principal recipe for clean shoots with fast speed. I need to do more of that.
    40. philpan was our resident iceman...nothing phased him...he just kept shooting...that's mental fortitude. I need to do more of that.
    41. H57 was fearless...not sure if he knew what to expect, but he grabbed the bull by the horns and never let go. Greatheart/Braveheart that guy.
    42. BamBam-31 needs to change his name to "BlamBlam-2Alpha". Won't be long before he trusts his speed, shooting stance, and allows himself to start shooting and reloading on the move. Then watch out Black Majik.
    43. emilsal is still the master of the double-tap. Love those splits. Once he figures out his sighting preferences and gets some range time with his Grayguns P226R...whooooo mama, look out.
    44. emilsal brought a "ringer" with Uncle "O" and I feel the fool for assuming it was his first match for the first couple of stages before I realized...wait a second...somethin' ain't right here...he has the style of an old hand at this...sure enough, I was able to learn quite a few things from him...very generous and gracious man and teacher, thanks!
    45. ABearden and philpan loves 'em snake eyes, yessiree. That's fun shootin'.
    46. Need to finish cleaning the guns.
    47. Need to buy more ammo.
    48. Need to buy steel targets like BamBam-31 ... thanks for bring that target, that was great!
    49. Need to work on those damn infernal reloads.

    See you guys soon!
     
  16. Black Majik

    Black Majik Member

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    Eyon,

    Thanks for pointing this out. In the videos you can see sometimes it seems as if I had the gun jam on me, so i tap rack and bang. What actually happens (as I figure out AFTER the match) was that I was trying to double tap faster than i should, and I didn't allow the trigger to reset. Therefore, when i pull the trigger the 2nd time, it of course wont fire and I think the gun jammed. Then, Tap, Rack and Bang adds 2 more seconds to my time. :eek:

    At least I know its me and not the gun. :)
     
  17. Pointman1776

    Pointman1776 Member

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  18. Pointman1776

    Pointman1776 Member

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    I think BlamBlam-2Alpha is learning from this guy, and listening to Tiny Tim in his head...

    http://media.putfile.com/IPSC-Jihad (posted by Flork at SIGforum.com)

    firedevil.gif
     
  19. Pointman1776

    Pointman1776 Member

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    By the way, you should check out the reply comments to that video on SIGforum.com:

    Thread 1

    Thread 2
     
  20. Beetle Bailey

    Beetle Bailey Member

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    Well, WRT the "terrorist" losing his top, you just never know when he's wearing body armor. . . :uhoh: :p

    (At least, that's my story and I'm sticking to it!) :neener:
     
  21. Pointman1776

    Pointman1776 Member

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    Running Gun IPSC / GenX Match Results - 04/22/2006

    http://nrg.jvdynamics.com/nrg/match_results/match_disp.php?match=20060422&club=NRG

    Note: click here Section 8. Getting started (finding a match, gearing

    up, tips, tricks, reading/analyzing match results, etc.)
    (scroll down) to learn how to read the results and headings from left to right.
    I also usually track for comparative analysis the top shooter for each stage in Open and the class I shoot in and bold their classification as a visual reference.
    Since we had 4 shooters in Limited 10 as well as 6 shooters in Production, I've included/bolded the top Shooter, top Limited 10 shooter, and top Production shooter for each

    stage and overall.

    And philpan was somehow categorized in Limited 10 even though he was shooting a P229R (which is universally considered a Production division pistol because of the DA/SA

    trigger system) which unfortunately put him against some faster pistols, but allowed him to score Major since he was shooting .40.
    Interesting.
    philpan - conscious strategic decision or accident? Inquiring minds want to know!

    So I was reviewing these scores last night and was trying to figure out how, for the life of me, did I get so many penalties?
    I can't remember shooting that many no-shoot targets or shooting the targets in the wrong order or from the wrong position/port, or obtaining procedural errors, etc.
    Maybe you guys are plotting against me and secretly marking the "no-shoot" or "procedural" boxes on my score sheet when I'm not looking to dock my scores?
    So I did some more reading last night, and learned that even a "mike" is assessed a 10-point penalty. :eek: YIKES!
    So not only do you NOT get the points because of the miss (no Alpha, Bravo, Charlie, or even a Delta point(s)), you get a zero MINUS ANOTHER 10 points for each miss!!
    The stage has a total number of rounds expected (remember like 12T, 2P, 4PP, 30 rounds, Comstock?), and not obtaining the expected number of rounds is a -10 point

    penalty for each round less than the total expected.
    And if you hit a no-shoot, that's ANOTHER -10 points.
    In other words, two alphas = 2 x +5 points = +10 points.
    But just 1 mike + No-Shoot = 2 x -10 points each = -20 points, which is a 30 point differential!!!
    Even two deltas = 2 x +1 point = +2 points is far superior to -20 points (22 point differential).
    So those misses can REALLY add up quick and bury you! Especially if it's a mike/No-Shoot combo = that's a real killer.

    I think the lessons learned here is:
    a) accuracy: make sure you have all the required shots on each target, no misses (usually two holes per target), even if you have to slow down your shooting a little to make

    sure you get those shots on target, and
    b) if you aren't sure if you got two shots on the target, probably best to put another shot on the target because the 10-point mike penalty is going to hurt much worse than

    the tiny bit of extra time it takes to put another shot on the target,
    c) make sure you engage all the targets (no skipped/missed targets), and
    d) don't hit whitey.

    Okay, moving on...

    Just some quick thoughts on the overall standings as we didn't get a chance to shoot Stage 5 and our ranking/scores are therefore artifically lower than they would have

    otherwise been.

    [color:blue]Final Standings[/color]
    Overall - All Divisions Scored Together
    1 CHEESMAN, HENRY L2335 GM Open Major N N N N 673.0097 100.00%
    3 BUTLER, TARAN L2354 GM Limited 10 Major N N N N 633.7297 94.16%
    46 JONES, CHRIS Pen U Production Minor N N N N 338.1142 50.24%
    66 BUMANGLAG, OSCAR U Production Minor N N N N 226.5506 33.66%
    67 KARNOFF, EYON A55472 U Production Minor N N N N 218.6008 32.48%
    75 LAM, MIKE U Limited 10 Major N N N N 171.2134 25.44%
    78 CHANG, RICHARD U Limited 10 Major N N N N 162.2056 24.10%
    79 ROBILLOS, JAMES U Production Minor N N N N 159.4860 23.70%
    82 BEARDEN, ARTHUR U Production Minor N N N N 143.2253 21.28%
    83 LEE, KEN U Limited 10 Major N N N N 118.0609 17.54%
    85 PANGILINAN, PHIL U Limited 10 Major N N N N 52.7938 7.84%
    87 YU, HEINDRICK U Production Minor N N N N 26.6704 3.96%
    88 SALONGA, EMIL U Production Minor N N N N 20.7944 3.09%

    Analysis:
    1. Taran and Henry are among the world's best. That's the benchmark guys.
    2. Nevermind the rankings for our squad; again - we did not get a chance to shoot Stage 5
    3. Also note that Taran was shooting a friend's single stack for the first time as a favor to test it out for his friend. Single stack. First time. The man is fast.
    4. And interestingly, Henry shoots a Caspian framed wide-body double-stack 1911 race gun because the frame is slightly smaller than the traditional STI or SV frame and fits

      his hands better. (I have long fingers and prefer the STI and SVI frames). Three-time back-to-back-to-back IPSC World Champion Eric Grauffel of France ALSO shoots a

      smaller framed pistol, a Tanfoglio Witness race gun, and seems to do just fine with it as well.
    5. So to answer the question once and for all: shoot what YOU shoot best. Ignore everyone else. Period.
    6. Note: Oscar shot my pistol better than I did. Unacceptable. AND that was his FIRST time shooting a SIG in competition, and not only was it his FIRST time even seeing

      my pistol, we actually changed pistols on him after the first stage or two from the LTT P226ST-9mm to the Grayguns P226ST-9mm. This was my second match with that

      pistol although I've had plenty of range time with it and he spanked me soundly. Unacceptable. Uncle "O" is not allowed to shoot on our squad anymore.
    7. Oh, by the way: Jojo's Running Gun IPSC club is NOT your normal USPSA club. So many shooters go on to win National and World Championship Titles who

      shoot/practice here EVERY SATURDAY that it's almost unfair to compare our little squad's results with theirs. However, that said, there are three HUGE advantages that

      easily outweigh any ego bruising caused by shooting with them. A) You get to see them in action and learn from their styles, strategies, tactics, approaches, etc. B) They

      will answer any question you have and help you in anyway they can to help you become a better shooter. C) You get a sense of the benchmark required to play at that level

      and it gives you a fantastic brass ring to shoot for. Besides, most of them are comics on the side and it's a lot of laughs to hear them joke with each other, tease each other,

      and have a great time.
      (P.S. They are also fortified by Uncle Mike's special barbeque yummy eats, and that can only help!)

    [color:red]Lessons Learned:[/color]
    1. I need more practice. NRG again this weekend anyone?
    2. I got a chance to talk to Taran at lunch during the barbeque (is that some great yummy eats from Uncle Mike's grill or what!), and totally out of the blue asked him (no

      idea where it came from) if he would be willing to run a clinic for us new shooters one Saturday at the match when he's not training/preparing for a big match.
      Not only did he say "sure" but he said we should probably have it at his private ranch + range in the Simi Valley! [Austin Powers]eeYeah, baaby![/Austin Powers]
      I'll email him this week and get more info, so stayed tuned for more info (pricing, dates, pre-requisites, separate thread, etc.).
      By the way, Taran specializes in Limited and Limited 10 divisions, shoots 1911's exclusively (for all you 1911 nuts) and will be adding Single Stack division to his competition

      schedule this year.
     
  22. Pointman1776

    Pointman1776 Member

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    [color:blue]>>Stage 1: MEDIUM RANGE[/color]
    Overall
    Place Name No. Class Division Pts Pen Time Hit Fact Stg Pts Stg %
    1 BANTA, TONY 92 B Open 120 0 14.24 8.4270 100.00%
    2 BUTLER, TARAN 81 GM Limited 10 118 0 14.34 8.2287 97.65%
    59 BUMANGLAG, OSCAR 76 U Production 108 10 31.10 3.1511 37.39%
    62 BEARDEN, ARTHUR 87 U Production 112 10 32.65 3.1240 37.07%
    63 CHANG, RICHARD 78 U Limited 10 112 10 33.03 3.0881 36.65%
    66 LAM, MIKE 75 U Limited 10 123 0 42.37 2.9030 34.45%
    70 KARNOFF, EYON 80 U Production 103 30 29.93 2.4390 28.94%
    72 ROBILLOS, JAMES 79 U Production 95 20 32.17 2.3314 27.67%
    78 LEE, KEN 73 U Limited 10 113 20 49.05 1.8960 22.50%
    82 PANGILINAN, PHIL 85 U Limited 10 106 10 66.87 1.4356 17.04%
    86 SALONGA, EMIL 74 U Production 81 60 38.34 0.5477 6.50%
    88 YU, HEINDRICK 86 U Production 74 70 84.74 0.0472 0.56%

    Limited 10
    Place Name No. Class Division Pts Pen Time Hit Fact Stg Pts Stg %
    1 BUTLER, TARAN 81 GM Limited 10 118 0 14.34 8.2287 100.00%
    12 CHANG, RICHARD 78 U Limited 10 112 10 33.03 3.0881 37.53%
    13 LAM, MIKE 75 U Limited 10 123 0 42.37 2.9030 35.28%
    16 LEE, KEN 73 U Limited 10 113 20 49.05 1.8960 23.04%
    18 PANGILINAN, PHIL 85 U Limited 10 106 10 66.87 1.4356 17.45%

    Production
    Place Name No. Class Division Pts Pen Time Hit Fact Stg Pts Stg %
    1 MC COURT, MATT 37 C Production 117 0 26.66 4.3886 100.00%
    4 BUMANGLAG, OSCAR 76 U Production 108 10 31.10 3.1511 71.80%
    7 BEARDEN, ARTHUR 87 U Production 112 10 32.65 3.1240 71.18%
    8 KARNOFF, EYON 80 U Production 103 30 29.93 2.4390 55.58%
    10 ROBILLOS, JAMES 79 U Production 95 20 32.17 2.3314 53.12%
    15 SALONGA, EMIL 74 U Production 81 60 38.34 0.5477 12.48%
    16 YU, HEINDRICK 86 U Production 74 70 84.74 0.0472 1.08%

    Analysis: Ah, the infamous head-shot stage.
    1. Most people dropped points because there were two targets which were partially painted black to represent hard cover, and they seemed to psychologically cause people

      to skip over them (sometimes the mind only looks for certain shapes/colors and skips/ignores the rest).
    2. Uncle "O", ABearden, Black Majik, and BamBam-31 (aka BlamBlam-2Alpha) all shot better than me, and therefore are not allowed to shoot on our squad anymore.
    3. philpan shot more accurately and had less penalties, and therefore is not allowed to shoot on our squad anymore.
    4. I was about 1 second faster than Uncle O, and we scored about the same hits (103 vs. his 108), but I dropped 3 mikes (-30 points) and he only dropped 1 mike (-10

      points) and so, bang, just like that, he jumps 11 places ahead of me. I had a mike + a no shoot, so I guess I had another mike somewhere on the range. Bummer.
    5. ABearden was almost as fast, more accurate (112 pts), only dropped 1 mike, and also spanked me. His up close CQB work (tight snake eyes to the head (see pic)) is first

      rate. Since this was his first match, I'll say "beginner's luck" and feel better about it.
    6. Black Majik and ABearden are in a virtual stastical dead even tie: 112 pts each, 1 mike each (-10 pts each), but ABearden was just 0.4 seconds faster and edged ahead of

      Black Majik in the standings. Folks, 0.4 seconds is NOTHING...a slight faster reload, a slightly quicker hit on steel, one shot on a steel plate instead of two, etc. That's all it

      takes.
      Also remember the scoring advantage for shooting "major": Alphas are 5 pts for both Maj and Min, but Bravos are 4 pts Maj but only 3 pts Min, and Charlies are 3 pts Maj

      but only 2 pts Min, and Deltas are 2 pts Major but only 1 pt Minor. So it's possible that a Min shooter a Maj shooter have the same time, same number of alphas, charlies,

      deltas, etc, but the Maj shooter will win, as it should be, for shooting higher momentum ammo. Note also that in Production, there is no "Major" scoring...regardless of

      caliber, it's all counted equally as "Minor".
      Note that even though ABearden was shooting .40, he was in Production and so was scored as Minor, and Black Majik was shooting Lim10 with .45 and allowed to make

      Major, so in order for them to get the same score, ABearden had to have more alphas/charlies than Black Majik.
    7. BlamBlam-2Alpha (aka BamBam-31), true to form, scored the HIGHEST out of all of us (123 pts), in fact, 123 points was THE HIGHEST SCORE of that stage, AND he had a

      clean shoot (no mikes), and so even though I was more than TWELVE (12) SECONDS FASTER (30% faster), he still spanked me silly and placed 4 positions higher than me.

      Nice job!

      Funny thing, in the video, you see that BB-2A skipped that one partial hardcover black-painted target as he went on to shoot the final three targets on the far left and then the

      steel plate through the port with the last bullet in the gun, went to slide lock, stood up to start to unload and show clear, when I pointed out that he skipped the partial

      hardcover black-painted target on the right, so BB-2A reloaded, engaged, placed two shots on target, and then unloaded and showed clear and holstered to complete his run.
      What would have happened if he didn't take those extra SIX seconds for two more shots and instead saved the six seconds and accepted the two mikes?
      Time drops to 36.37, Pts drop to 113 (assume he didn't get his usual 2 alphas so 2 x -5 pts = -10 pts), with -20 pts MORE for getting 2 mikes = adjusted 93, then divide by

      time (93/36.37) = 2.5571 hit factor.
      A 2.5571 hit factor would have put him in 69th place, instead of 66th place.

      Now, what if that happened to Uncle "O", but say, only a 3 second delay (didn't need to reload, just two shots on last target)? 108 pts drops to 78 adjusted for the 2 mikes,

      time drops to 28.1 = 78/28.1 = 2.7758 hit factor = 69th place instead of 59th place.
      Wow. Big drop.
    8. Kevlarman had some awesome reloads and decent double taps, as his low time shows, and even though he only had 2 mikes, he didn't get as many Alphas as he needed

      to jump up in standings. His reloads and smooth and fast style still pushed him up the ladder. He'll need to get more alphas to move up.
    9. Even though Beetle Bailey one of the top scores of the stage (113 pts but 2 mikes and so most likely did not engage that last partial target), the famous "Beetle Bailey

      Partial Mozambique" (one to the chest (instead of 2) and one to the head (with extreme prejudice)) makes his time irrelevant, I believe. ;) I'm tellin' you, it's the quiet ones.
    10. philpan ALSO scored very well (106 pts), and only had 1 mike, and for his first shoot ever, a respectable time. He, too, should be shooting very well very soon.
    11. emilsal: I really feel bad for emilsal on this stage. He NAILED all four opening steel pepper poppers faster than any of us AND with only 4 shots (no extra shots needed),

      and was moving well through the stage when the gun FTExtract/Eject causing a bad double-feed jam / gun malfunction halfway through the stage. So even though we all

      agreed to have him reshoot (normally that's just too bad during a sanctioned match, but for us...who cares), the problem is that kind of issue will throw anyone off their

      game, and it is so frustrating to have to reshoot a stage, ESPECIALLY when you were in the zone the first time around, and to have to mentally refocus and block all that

      baggage out for the reshoot. I feel DOUBLY bad because it was my prized LTT P226ST-9mm that he was shooting. I feel TRIPLY bad because he asked to try the LTT this

      time around instead of the Grayguns P226ST-9mm that he shot at the previous match a few weeks ago because THE SAME THING happend to him with the Grayguns

      P226ST-9mm last time. I've posted in the armorer's section a plea for help, and got some fantastic advice, including a reply from Bruce. I'm going to take both slides and

      extractors apart again, double and triple check them to make sure there is no blockage and all the pieces are functioning correctly, are the correct shape, are the right

      version for the right caliber from the factory, etc. And if we still have problems, then it's time for one of the newer designed P226 external extractor designs/kits. For more

      info, click here. So a couple of extra shots on the opening pepper poppers on the re-shoot

      probably led him to believe that he had to "make up" some lost time as compared to his first run, and even though his time was indeed pretty good with some great

      double-taps, the expense of rushing the second shot to save time contributed to more mikes and a lower score in the final analysis. Perhaps slowing down just a tad, and

      getting those second shots on paper, should really jump his scores up, as evidenced by BamBam-31's slow time but relatively high placement.
    12. I think I'm going to call H57 our slow-and-steady tortoise-and-the-hare shooter. Nothing phased the guy. Just quietly went about doing his job. He appears to be a

      careful shooter (took his time to do the job right), but is such a nice gentleman that he didn't want to hurt the target's feelings, and so just fired warning shots which were

      ungratefully scored by uncaring RO's as 7 mikes. He's a misunderstood shooter, that's all. We'll cure him of that right quick. Manners after the beep? Out the window,

      mate. COMMENCE FIRING! Maybe Beetle Bailey, our other shy shooter, can give us lessons in extreme prejudice close quarters battle (EP-CQB) to break us out of our molds.
    13. Now: Taran: Lim 10, single stack, first time shooting his friend's pistol testing it out for him = 14.34 seconds, which was just 0.1 second behind the winning score, and

      118 pts (vs. Tony's 120 pts), for 2nd place. With ZERO mikes. There's our benchmark, folks.
    14. He was more than TWICE as fast as me, was MORE ACCURATE than me, and...to rub it in...had ZERO mikes (to my 3 mikes).
    15. Give the guy a dirt clod and he'll beat me all up and down the range with it.
      (...note...to...self... -- ... practice...practice...practice...practi...)
    16. Taran also holds the distinction of obtaining his GrandMaster ranking status faster than any other shooter in history, 13 months, from the time of his first shoot to the time

      he qualified GrandMaster.

    [color:red]Lessons Learned:[/color] Even if we have to slow down to avoid mikes and get more Alphas, it's worth it. Speed will come later.
     
  23. Pointman1776

    Pointman1776 Member

    Joined:
    Dec 23, 2004
    Messages:
    175
    Location:
    Lost in Left Angeles, The Peoples' Demokratic Repu
    >>Stage 2: WHICH PORT FIRST?
    Overall
    Place Name No. Class Division Pts Pen Time Hit Fact Stg Pts Stg %
    1 CHEESMAN, HENRY 52 GM Open 122 0 10.18 11.9843 100.00%
    5 BUTLER, TARAN 81 GM Limited 10 116 0 11.25 10.3111 86.04%
    43 BUMANGLAG, OSCAR 76 U Production 120 0 22.28 5.3860 44.94%
    67 BEARDEN, ARTHUR 87 U Production 91 10 28.20 2.8723 23.97%
    72 LAM, MIKE 75 U Limited 10 118 0 43.52 2.7114 22.62%
    74 KARNOFF, EYON 80 U Production 108 30 29.93 2.6061 21.75%
    75 ROBILLOS, JAMES 79 U Production 90 20 29.71 2.3561 19.66%
    78 LEE, KEN 73 U Limited 10 114 10 46.30 2.2462 18.74%
    81 CHANG, RICHARD 78 U Limited 10 97 30 34.63 1.9347 16.14%
    84 PANGILINAN, PHIL 85 U Limited 10 83 40 36.79 1.1688 9.75%
    85 SALONGA, EMIL 74 U Production 99 30 68.47 1.0077 8.41%
    87 YU, HEINDRICK 86 U Production 86 20 93.07 0.7091 5.92%

    Limited 10
    Place Name No. Class Division Pts Pen Time Hit Fact Stg Pts Stg %
    1 BUTLER, TARAN 81 GM Limited 10 116 0 11.25 10.3111 100.00%
    15 LAM, MIKE 75 U Limited 10 118 0 43.52 2.7114 26.30%
    16 LEE, KEN 73 U Limited 10 114 10 46.30 2.2462 21.78%
    17 CHANG, RICHARD 78 U Limited 10 97 30 34.63 1.9347 18.76%
    19 PANGILINAN, PHIL 85 U Limited 10 83 40 36.79 1.1688 11.34%

    Production
    Place Name No. Class Division Pts Pen Time Hit Fact Stg Pts Stg %
    1 JONES, CHRIS 14 U Production 110 0 19.45 5.6555 100.00%
    2 BUMANGLAG, OSCAR 76 U Production 120 0 22.28 5.3860 95.23%
    8 BEARDEN, ARTHUR 87 U Production 91 10 28.20 2.8723 50.79%
    10 KARNOFF, EYON 80 U Production 108 30 29.93 2.6061 46.08%
    11 ROBILLOS, JAMES 79 U Production 90 20 29.71 2.3561 41.66%
    15 SALONGA, EMIL 74 U Production 99 30 68.47 1.0077 17.82%
    16 YU, HEINDRICK 86 U Production 86 20 93.07 0.7091 12.54%

    Analysis:
    1. Kevlarman shot faster than me and had less penalties and therefore is not allowed to shoot on our squad anymore.
    2. Beetle Bailey and H57 also consistently had less penalties than me, and therefore are not allowed to shoot on our squad anymore.
    3. emilsal shot my LTT P226ST-9mm better than I could, and therefore is not allowed to shoot on our squad anymore.
    4. The Uncle "O" Factor again takes the stage win for our squad. How? Watch Kevlarman's excellent video of his shoot. Very smooth. Never stopped moving, even

      shooting while pulling/moving back away from the targets on the right side to engage targets through the other ports. Nice double taps. Accurate (120 pts, the highest for

      our squad), and fast, six seconds faster than the 2nd place shooter on our squad, and zero mikes. Smooth reloads...not blazingly fast, but smoooooooth. (...he's a smooth

      operator...) Nice!
      But you can't shoot on our squad anymore, so there.
    5. ABearden again had a solid score, only 1 mike, smooth fast time, and presto...#2 place on the squad again. NICE!
      But you can't shoot on our squad anymore, either, so there.
    6. BlamBlam-2Alpha had one of the top scores of the stage, even 2 points higher than Taran, with zero mikes. Bump his speed up (over time), and he'll rocket to the top.
    7. I had 30 points in penalties??? I liked this stage! How did I three mikes? I demand a recount.
    8. Kevlarman was actually 0.2 seconds faster than me, and even had 1 less mike, but my accuracy helped me stay just one place ahead of him. Whew!!
    9. Beetle Bailey: again, good scores, only 1 mike, but takes his time.
    10. Watching the video of Black Majik on this one shows that he tried a different approach to taking out the steel and paper targets...which cost him some time during the

      extra transitions. He tried to make up for that time with faster shots and double-taps, but at the expensive of accuracy, which ultimately led only to a lower score.
    11. philpan had a very good time, shows comfort with the pistol and sport, but it appears he is focusing perhaps too much on speed rather than accuracy (83 pts and 4 mikes)
    12. I can't remember what happened here with emilsal and H57, I suspect this is where we had a couple of equipment jams again.
    13. Again, Taran: very accurate (116 pts), zero mikes, and twice as fast as Uncle O and THREE TIMES faster than me.

    Lessons Learned:Target acquisition strategy, reload strategy, movement, and accuracy over speed were the keys to this stage.
     
  24. Pointman1776

    Pointman1776 Member

    Joined:
    Dec 23, 2004
    Messages:
    175
    Location:
    Lost in Left Angeles, The Peoples' Demokratic Repu
    >>Stage 3: SEMI CLOSE QUARTERS
    Overall
    Place Name No. Class Division Pts Pen Time Hit Fact Stg Pts Stg %
    1 BUTLER, TARAN 81 GM Limited 10 102 0 11.23 9.0828 100.00%
    2 ARREDONDO, RALPH 61 M Open 102 0 11.39 8.9552 98.60%
    47 BUMANGLAG, OSCAR 76 U Production 100 0 24.67 4.0535 44.63%
    51 KARNOFF, EYON 80 U Production 106 0 27.34 3.8771 42.69%
    57 LAM, MIKE 75 U Limited 10 108 0 29.66 3.6413 40.09%
    71 BEARDEN, ARTHUR 87 U Production 87 10 29.57 2.6040 28.67%
    76 ROBILLOS, JAMES 79 U Production 96 30 28.22 2.3388 25.75%
    80 CHANG, RICHARD 78 U Limited 10 94 30 30.62 2.0901 23.01%
    81 LEE, KEN 73 U Limited 10 90 30 35.40 1.6949 18.66%
    85 PANGILINAN, PHIL 85 U Limited 10 79 50 32.27 0.8987 9.89%
    86 YU, HEINDRICK 86 U Production 86 30 63.35 0.8840 9.73%
    87 SALONGA, EMIL 74 U Production 66 60 41.77 0.1436 1.58%

    Limited 10
    Place Name No. Class Division Pts Pen Time Hit Fact Stg Pts Stg %
    1 BUTLER, TARAN 81 GM Limited 10 102 0 11.23 9.0828 100.00%
    10 LAM, MIKE 75 U Limited 10 108 0 29.66 3.6413 40.09%
    16 CHANG, RICHARD 78 U Limited 10 94 30 30.62 2.0901 23.01%
    17 LEE, KEN 73 U Limited 10 90 30 35.40 1.6949 18.66%
    19 PANGILINAN, PHIL 85 U Limited 10 79 50 32.27 0.8987 9.89%

    Production
    Place Name No. Class Division Pts Pen Time Hit Fact Stg Pts Stg %
    1 BUMANGLAG, OSCAR 76 U Production 100 0 24.67 4.0535 100.00%
    2 KARNOFF, EYON 80 U Production 106 0 27.34 3.8771 95.65%
    7 BEARDEN, ARTHUR 87 U Production 87 10 29.57 2.6040 64.24%
    10 ROBILLOS, JAMES 79 U Production 96 30 28.22 2.3388 57.70%
    15 YU, HEINDRICK 86 U Production 86 30 63.35 0.8840 21.81%
    16 SALONGA, EMIL 74 U Production 66 60 41.77 0.1436 3.54%


    Analysis:
    1. Again, Uncle O shot smooth, clean, and fast for the squad win.
    2. I finally shot a clean stage, which really helped my scores. I was slightly more accurate than Uncle O (106 vs. 100 pts), both had clean shoots (no mikes), but I was 2.5 seconds slower than Uncle O so he placed a few places above me. After my shoot, a couple of guys asked why I shot 3 rounds instead of two rounds on two of the targets.
      I answered because I thought that one of my shots was a Charlie, instead of a second Alpha, so I made a conscious decision to fire another quick follow-up round to make up for the bad shot without loosing too much time. As it turned out, one target had 3 alphas (one of the shots was really close to the Charlie line but still an alpha...I thought I hit the Charlie as I was shooting it), and the other target had 2 Alphas and a Delta, so that follow-up shot saved me from 6 points and instead gave me 10 points, which was worth the 0.3 seconds or so it took to fire a follow-up shot. Follow-up shots are sometimes NOT advantageous, so you have to be strategic about when to use this approach because sometimes it can actually lead to a net-loss in points rather than a net-gain.
    3. BlamBlam-2Alpha: well, just more of the same (with a twist). 6th highest score of the stage of 88 shooters, clean shoot (zero mikes), blah blah blah. But...twist...he added some speed! BB-2A was just 2 seconds slower than me, and was hot on our heals. Accuracy is what got all three of us that high, and then the secondary factor of speed was the only thing that separated the Uncle "O" Factor, BB-2A and me.
    4. ABearden shot a pretty clean stage, 1 mike, but perhaps the longer shots are what is causing the lower scores. Nice time though.
    5. Kevlarman had 3 mikes, a nice time, and a nice score. His draw and reloads are really helping him through to compensate for less accuracy.
    6. Black Majik also had 3 mikes. This is also the stage where the video shows he had a couple of glitches (not sure if pistol slide/battery issue or ammo feed issue with the SWC bullets through a barrel that might not be properly throated to accept/feed SWC's, or if it was operator error short stroking the trigger trying to shoot too fast without letting the trigger all the way out. Regardless, he looks visibly disappointed towards the end of the stage (posture changes, is no longer driving the gun hard through the stage like he usually does), and that hurts his time, and probably distracts his mind from seeing that last partial target.
    7. Beetle Bailey also had 3 mikes, but a decent score, and a faily decent time. What if he took an extra half second to line up his shots to get 2 alphas and a charlie instead of 3 mikes? Time goes to 36.9 and Pts jump to 107, so 107/36.9 = 2.8997 hit factor = 68th place instead of 81st. HUUUUUUUGE jump!
    8. philpan had a pretty good run, it seems: nice time, but 5 mikes slipped him down from where he otherwise probably could have been. Also note that philpan had a squib load malfunction which could have been disasterous. And even though I IMMEDIATELY shouted "SQUIB! SQUIB! SQUIB!", he was already ahead of me with finger off the trigger, racking the slide back, dropping the mag, and trying to clear the stuck casing like an old pro. IMPRESSIVE safety discipline! We finally rammed the slide back into battery with the extractor slipping over the casing, and forcing the slide backward to eject the round. Upon inspection, the primer was struck and ignited, but the bullet never left the casing, which means probably no gunpowder in this round. This is factory ammo, not a reload. Proof you can never be complacent just because you are shooting "factory" ammo, pistols, gear, whatever - it's all prone to errors and glitches. Better to practice clearing those kinds of problems on the range in a match than in "real life".
    9. H57: easy does it approach shows only 3 mikes on a stage that forces the shooter to contort their bodies to shoot around from a barricade. Nice shoot!
    10. emilsal: if I recall correctly, the gun jammed on emil again this stage, adding precious seconds to his time while trying to clear the jam, and then throwing him off his game for the rest of the stage. Once he gets his pistol back from Grayguns, and gets it sighted for his left-eye dominance (and maybe slow down his double-taps just a bit for more control on that 2nd shot), he is going to burn his way up the rankings.

    Lessons Learned: THIS stage, and the "what if" recalc's, truly brought home to me to slooooooooooow down, focus, hit those alphas, and shoot

    clean (no mikes)!!!
     
  25. Pointman1776

    Pointman1776 Member

    Joined:
    Dec 23, 2004
    Messages:
    175
    Location:
    Lost in Left Angeles, The Peoples' Demokratic Repu
    >>Stage 4: MADNESS 03-08
    Overall
    Place Name No. Class Division Pts Pen Time Hit Fact Stg Pts Stg %
    1 HOLLAND, KEITH 60 GM Open 70 0 6.89 10.1597 100.00%
    9 QUAN, PETER 7 A Limited 10 69 0 8.63 7.9954 78.70%
    38 KARNOFF, EYON 80 U Production 64 0 12.41 5.1571 50.76%
    40 BUMANGLAG, OSCAR 76 U Production 66 0 13.71 4.8140 47.38%
    52 ROBILLOS, JAMES 79 U Production 60 0 15.06 3.9841 39.21%
    54 CHANG, RICHARD 78 U Limited 10 60 10 12.74 3.9246 38.63%
    66 LEE, KEN 73 U Limited 10 66 0 22.18 2.9757 29.29%
    69 LAM, MIKE 75 U Limited 10 61 20 15.43 2.6572 26.15%
    74 BEARDEN, ARTHUR 87 U Production 61 20 23.76 1.7256 16.98%
    78 PANGILINAN, PHIL 85 U Limited 10 57 30 23.44 1.1519 11.34%
    82 YU, HEINDRICK 86 U Production 27 70 22.77 0.0000 0.00%
    82 SALONGA, EMIL 74 U Production 44 60 16.67 0.0000 0.00%

    Limited 10
    Place Name No. Class Division Pts Pen Time Hit Fact Stg Pts Stg %
    1 QUAN, PETER 7 A Limited 10 69 0 8.63 7.9954 100.00%
    10 CHANG, RICHARD 78 U Limited 10 60 10 12.74 3.9246 49.09%
    13 LEE, KEN 73 U Limited 10 66 0 22.18 2.9757 37.22%
    14 LAM, MIKE 75 U Limited 10 61 20 15.43 2.6572 33.23%
    18 PANGILINAN, PHIL 85 U Limited 10 57 30 23.44 1.1519 14.41%

    Production
    Place Name No. Class Division Pts Pen Time Hit Fact Stg Pts Stg %
    1 KARNOFF, EYON 80 U Production 64 0 12.41 5.1571 100.00%
    2 BUMANGLAG, OSCAR 76 U Production 66 0 13.71 4.8140 93.35%
    5 ROBILLOS, JAMES 79 U Production 60 0 15.06 3.9841 77.25%
    12 BEARDEN, ARTHUR 87 U Production 61 20 23.76 1.7256 33.46%
    14 YU, HEINDRICK 86 U Production 27 70 22.77 0.0000 0.00%
    14 SALONGA, EMIL 74 U Production 44 60 16.67 0.0000 0.00%

    Analysis: This was a classifier. It was seven targets with severely overlapping "no-shoots" leaving very little target exposed, requiring one hit each, a mandatory reload, and then another pass of one hit each.
    1. I choke on classifiers. But it all went right for me this day, and I got the high production score. This will really help me as I work to move my classification up to the next level or two. Production high doesn't mean much when it's 38th place overall and 50.7% of the winning hit factor, but it's a huge personal breakthrough for me and I'm quite happy.
    2. Uncle O - solid as ever.
    3. Kevlarman, another clean shoot.
    4. Black Majik - 1 mike (but no "no-shoots"), and a great time kept him in the hunt.
    5. Beetle Bailey: clean shoot but REALLY slowed down to make sure he didn't hit any white "no-shoots"...he could probably trust his skills a little more and pick up the pace a little.
    6. BlamBlam-2alpha: typical of many solid shooters. Smoke any stage on the range, but come to a classifier and it all goes out the window. I've been doing that for years. I feel for you. I do.
    7. ABearden, philpan, H57, and emilsal: ditto. Solid shooting on every single other stage, but mention "classifier" and "lots of overlapping white "no-shoots" and the best of us get wobbly. I think classifiers are more "mental" then anything else.

    Lessons Learned: Slow down, control the trigger and front sight, and remember the fundamentals as THAT is what classifiers do: force you to remember the basics.
     
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