Quantcast
  1. Upgrade efforts paused for now. Thanks for your patience. More details in the thread in Tech Support for those who are interested.
    Dismiss Notice

Shellholder problems?

Discussion in 'Handloading and Reloading' started by jski, Nov 14, 2022.

  1. jski

    jski Member

    Joined:
    Jan 28, 2016
    Messages:
    1,901
    Location:
    Florida
    I have a Hornady shellholder #36 and an RCBS shellholder #23 both for the .32 H&R Mag. My die set is Redding and my press is a Redding T-7 turret press. The brass is Starline.

    Now the problem: When I resize if I use the Hornady shellholder, I sometimes have a problem lining up the case properly resulting in a crimp in the case wall, i.e., a small fold. If I switch to the RCBS caseholder, everything seems to line up correctly and I have no problems resizing.

    Does this make sense?
     
    GeoDudeFlorida likes this.
  2. Thomasss

    Thomasss Member

    Joined:
    Aug 3, 2020
    Messages:
    1,098
    Location:
    Wisconsin
    Some of manufacturer's equipment is compatible while others are not. RBCS and Redding generally are. Hornady and Lee Precision are also good in some equipment. For now, make sure the cartridge chambers properly by trying it in a go/no go gage. I found using the same mfr. dies and shell holders eliminates most problems. I learned long ago mixing Hornady dies with RCBS shell holders don't work.
     
    EricBu and CoalCrackerAl like this.
  3. Charlie98

    Charlie98 Member

    Joined:
    Nov 20, 2017
    Messages:
    6,951
    Location:
    McKinney, TX
    It's possible there is junk in the shellholder groove, keeping the shell from fully inserting into the shellholder. It's also possible the groove isn't cut enough. If it's not lining the shell up... it's junk.

    I have noticed there are differences between some brands of shellholders... I have 3 different brands for .308, and they are all different.
     
    FROGO207 and ballman6711 like this.
  4. jski

    jski Member

    Joined:
    Jan 28, 2016
    Messages:
    1,901
    Location:
    Florida
    The same thing has occurred when reloading 357 rounds using a Lee shellholder and RCBS shellholder.
     
  5. ballman6711

    ballman6711 Member

    Joined:
    Jul 20, 2019
    Messages:
    937
    I use both Hornady and RCBS dies and both brands of shell holders. I have noticed a difference in the shell holders, but haven't noticed a difference using one brand shell holder with the other brand die.

    I would suggest using a pipe cleaner and cleaning the shell holder and trying again. IF you find one shell holder works better than the other, use that one, but I think cleaning your shell holder may fix your problem.

    chris
     
    deadeye dick and CQB45ACP like this.
  6. GW Staar

    GW Staar Member

    Joined:
    Feb 26, 2009
    Messages:
    3,298
    Location:
    New Mexico and Proud American
    Sometimes the spring clip holding the shell holder in, is so tight that it doesn't allow the brass to self-center in a die. And sometimes cranking too fast by itself can force the case into a die in an unwanted way. Many years ago, I stretched the shell holder clips on my RCBS Rock Chucker (as advised by someone in Handloader Magazine), to allow shellholders to move more free and and thus be allowed to self center......I had way less problems then, as long as I didn't think I had to make speed records cranking ammo. I think that has ruined more brass than anything else.
     
    lordpaxman, Bfh_auto and CQB45ACP like this.
  7. GeoDudeFlorida

    GeoDudeFlorida Member

    Joined:
    Dec 1, 2020
    Messages:
    8,286
    I mix-n-match Lee, Hornady and RCBS dies and shell holders but I’ve typically found the Lee sizing dies work with any shell holder while the Hornady sizing dies work best with Hornady shell holders. I have not experienced this off-center thing though. The only thing is the Hornady shell holders are tighter fit. That’s pretty minor and it comes down to a preference. I agree about cleaning the shell holder first. Also check the rims of the cartridges that are off center for burrs and debris.
     
    CQB45ACP and ballman6711 like this.
  8. jmorris

    jmorris Member

    Joined:
    Sep 30, 2005
    Messages:
    21,188
    Sounds like manufacturing tolerance. My curiosity would have me measuring them.

    B1219B51-84F0-40E9-AC48-D49865612DF3.jpeg
     
    gpb, allisd17, AJC1 and 2 others like this.
  9. jski

    jski Member

    Joined:
    Jan 28, 2016
    Messages:
    1,901
    Location:
    Florida
    Didn’t find any dirt in the shellholder but didn’t really expect to. It’s brand spanking new!
     
  10. mdi

    mdi Member

    Joined:
    Dec 31, 2007
    Messages:
    5,014
    Location:
    Orygun!
    Sorta on topic (?). I've heard of some reloaders removing the spring clip on the ram that holds the shell holder in place and replacing it with an O ring. Allows the shell holder to "float" and self align. (I have no such problems with my Co-Ax)
     
  11. jski

    jski Member

    Joined:
    Jan 28, 2016
    Messages:
    1,901
    Location:
    Florida
    Can you use shellholders with a Co-Ax?
     
  12. 9mmepiphany

    9mmepiphany Moderator Staff Member

    Joined:
    Dec 27, 2002
    Messages:
    25,397
    Location:
    northern california
    Why would you want to?
     
    JimKirk likes this.
  13. thump_rrr

    thump_rrr Member

    Joined:
    Nov 7, 2010
    Messages:
    1,114
    Location:
    The North Country
    I switched to a Forster Co-Ax.
    I no longer need shell holders.:D
     
    JimKirk likes this.
  14. Thomasss

    Thomasss Member

    Joined:
    Aug 3, 2020
    Messages:
    1,098
    Location:
    Wisconsin
    My problem between RCBS and Hornady was that mixing the dies with another's shell holder would not always complete a full length sizing and resulted in failing a plunk test. By keeping a die and shell holder of the same mfr. together, the problem disappeared immediately. I have both RCBS and Hornady dies and have one mfr. die per rifle since the seating depth is different. My RCBS dies are a very old 1976 set and the Hornady dies are a very new custom taper set. Maybe that is the difference.
     
    GeoDudeFlorida and ballman6711 like this.
  15. joelp34252

    joelp34252 Member

    Joined:
    Jan 3, 2021
    Messages:
    1
    I noticed in my Lyman hand primer, if using an RCBS shellholder the primer would not seet deep enough. Bought a Lyman shellholder and the problem went away. They are not the same.
     
  16. FROGO207

    FROGO207 Member

    Joined:
    Dec 7, 2008
    Messages:
    11,502
    Location:
    Mount Desert Island Maine
    When using a single stage press that has you snap in a shellholder the groove in the ram that the shellholder snaps into can get crud in it as well. This can lead to off center brass just like if it was in the shellholder groove. Lee, Hornaday, and RCBS shellholders all work the same for me in my Lee or my RCBS presses. YMMV
     
  17. jmorris

    jmorris Member

    Joined:
    Sep 30, 2005
    Messages:
    21,188
    GeoDudeFlorida likes this.
  18. jski

    jski Member

    Joined:
    Jan 28, 2016
    Messages:
    1,901
    Location:
    Florida
    Because a rigid shellholder is more precise than a sloppy “universal” shell holding spring mechanism? My “universal” RCBS priming tool requires constant manual adjustments to line things up properly. The old RCBS priming tool which uses shellholders requires less manual assistance.
     
    Last edited: Nov 15, 2022
    Bfh_auto likes this.
  19. Cheesemaker

    Cheesemaker Member

    Joined:
    Jul 10, 2007
    Messages:
    537
    Location:
    North Carolina
    The Co-Ax has its own shell holder system - may well be better than a "universal" solution.
     
  20. jmorris

    jmorris Member

    Joined:
    Sep 30, 2005
    Messages:
    21,188
    If you get your fingers off things or at least do not apply pressure to anything significant enough to not let the system do what it’s supposed to do. If your “helping” it out, lining things up. you probably are not really helping things.

    If he’s talking about the priming system, I don’t think there is a shell holder system for it. I don’t generally use single stage priming systems (preferring hopper fed hand primers) but have used the co-ax system only because you can adjust it to any case head diameter and I didn’t have an appropriate shell holder.
     
    mdi, ballman6711 and GeoDudeFlorida like this.
  21. 9mmepiphany

    9mmepiphany Moderator Staff Member

    Joined:
    Dec 27, 2002
    Messages:
    25,397
    Location:
    northern california
    Nope, if your goal is concentric functions applied to the case, the Co-Ax method of positioning cases in relation to the die is more precise...that is why both the shell and the die retention system are floating; it's by design for improved concentricity
     
  22. mdi

    mdi Member

    Joined:
    Dec 31, 2007
    Messages:
    5,014
    Location:
    Orygun!
    There are after market parts available for replacing the jaws with a shell holder attachment. But there is no reason. I have two sets of jaws that cover 99% of the cases used today and the system is much easier, faster to use and allows the case to "float". Fast forward 1:30 for an explanation of Co-Ax shell holding jaws https://duckduckgo.com/?q=How+do+co-ax+shell+holder+jaws+work?&t=chromentp&atb=v314-1&iax=videos&ia=videos&iai=https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RYvV5t-ZMdM

    My Co-Ax is the best press I have used. It is easy to use. With good bullets I can hold .001" variation on OAL. Run out on my 308 handloads was running less than .0015" average. I made a tool for cast bullet sizing with Lee push through sizing kits. On press priming isn't great and for me, getting the shell holder is a pain.
     
    Last edited: Nov 16, 2022
  23. Ironicaintit

    Ironicaintit Member

    Joined:
    May 7, 2015
    Messages:
    2,387
    Location:
    Colorado
    That's what first brought my attention to their minute differences too. Tool bottomed out before I felt it seat! That's not okay
     
  24. Charlie98

    Charlie98 Member

    Joined:
    Nov 20, 2017
    Messages:
    6,951
    Location:
    McKinney, TX
    I bought a full set of Lymans many years ago, but I also have a fair amount of RCBS shellholders... they are definitely not the same. I have to take notes on which shellholder I use... for something like sizing. If I swap shellholders out, the ram hits the bottom of the sizing die before camover, or... vice versa... doesn't size enough. That gave me fits in .308 for a while till I figured out what I was doing.
     
  1. This site uses cookies to help personalise content, tailor your experience and to keep you logged in if you register.
    By continuing to use this site, you are consenting to our use of cookies.
    Dismiss Notice