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Shipping a gun to yourself out of state?

Discussion in 'General Gun Discussions' started by Vector, Oct 22, 2012.

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  1. Vector

    Vector Member

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    A long gun is being gifted to me as a present (or at least I think it is) out of state.
    I will fly and be there for several days. Now I could buy a hard lockable case and check it, but that will involve not only the cost of the case, but also an extra $25 for an extra checked bag fee. So I was thinking of shipping it USPS to myself back home in a non descript package.

    So first, is it legal?

    How safe would it be (i.e. gun being stolen)?

    Any other considerations?
     
  2. SaxonPig

    SaxonPig Member

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    It's legal to ship a gun to yourself but it sounds like the rest of the deal is not legal. A person in one state cannot give or sell a gun to a resident of another state. An FFL may sell a long gun to an out of state buyer as long as all laws in both states are followed and the FFL is willing to do it which 99% are not.

    Have the gun shipped to an FFL in your state for legal transfer to you.
     
  3. dogtown tom

    dogtown tom Member

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    Federal law requires that the firearm be transferred to you through a licensed dealer in that state. You would need to complete a 4473 and pass NICS. I HIGHLY recommend contacting a dealer at your destination BEFORE you go. Use the "Find an FFL" search feature on GunBroker.com




    Yes, as long as:
    1. The firearm is legally transferred from the person in possession to you via 4473/NICS.
    2. The firearm is legal for you to possess in your own state.






    There are thousands of firearms mailed every day through the USPS. It is every bit as safe as UPS or FedEx. I highly recommend insurance for the full value as well as Signature Confirmation on delivery.
    To be legal, only YOU may actually ship the firearm to yourself.....no one else can do it, otherwise it becomes a violation of Federal law for both of you. There is no notification required when you ship a rifle or shotgun via USPS.

    Read this first:http://www.thehighroad.org/showthread.php?t=651375






    .
     
  4. reuben mishler

    reuben mishler Member

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    ...
     
    Last edited: Oct 23, 2012
  5. reuben mishler

    reuben mishler Member

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    Last edited: Oct 23, 2012
  6. dogtown tom

    dogtown tom Member

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    Do this and get caught and you'll never own a gun again.

    This is the worst advice you could possibly give the OP.
    What you are advising him to do is commit a Federal crime.



    Key word here is IGNORANCE......yours.:rolleyes:
    You don't have a clue as to Federal law regarding the interstate transfer of firearms. Read this and get back with us:
     
  7. Vector

    Vector Member

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    It would seem several people believe I need to do paperwork. The two states involved are Florida and North Carolina. The long gun can be owned in either state without issue. I have a CCW, but I figured it was mute since it will be a gift.

    As to a general question of gifting a firearm, does it matter if the person gifting it to someone is a friend vs. a relative?
     
  8. dogtown tom

    dogtown tom Member

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    No.
     
  9. wgsigs

    wgsigs Member

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    What reuben mishler is proposing is only true if the giver dies and bequeaths it to you - not gifting it while alive, even if he or she is a family member. The issue is being residents of two different states.
     
  10. Frank Ettin

    Frank Ettin Moderator

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    This is 100% wrong. Federal law requires that the transfer be done through an FFL (with all formalities -- 4473, etc.), And there is no exception under federal law for a gift, from a family member or otherwise. If the OP and the person giving the gift were to do what you suggest, each would be committing a federal felony by violation 18 USC 922(a)(3) and 18 USC 922(a)(5). The penalty to which each could be subject is up to five years in a federal prison and/or a fine (plus a lifetime loss of gun rights).

    Here's the text of the applicable federal law:


    In the case of long guns, the transfer may be done by an FFL in the transferee's State or residence or the transferor's State of residence as long as (1) the long gun is legal in the transferee's State of residence; and (2) the transfer complies with the laws of the State in which it takes place; and (3) the transfer complies with the law of the transferee's State of residence. In connection with the transfer of a long gun, some FFLs will not want to handle the transfer to a resident of another State, because they may be uncertain about the laws of that State. And if the transferee resides in some States (e. g., California), the laws of the State may be such that an out-of-state FFL will not be able to conduct a transfer that complies.

    All of that regarding the transfer of a long gun comes under 18 USC 922(b)(3):
     
  11. NavyLCDR

    NavyLCDR member

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    I am glad Frank posted the actual statutes so that people can see the two felonies that would be committed if anyone followed reuben mishler's advice. It will be interesting to see if reuben mishler posts again.

    Vector,
    Your CCW has nothing to do with the transfer of ownership of firearms. Like Frank Ettin posted, if the person gives (transfer ownership of the rifle to you, via gift or sale) without going through an FFL, they violate 18 USC 922 (a)(5) and commit a Federal felony.

    When you return to your home state with that rifle, that you obtained from out of state, without an FFL, you violate 18 USC 922 (a)(3) and commit a Federal felony. Get caught and you lose not only your CCW, but your right to possess firearms at all until (if) you can't get your record expunged of the conviction.

    Is it really worth it to save the $30 average for an FFL transfer? If it were me, I would just have the giver mail the rifle to an FFL in your state and get the gun there.
     
  12. wgsigs

    wgsigs Member

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    I am a little confused and need some clarification. Can the gun be gifted to Vector in person in the first place even with FFL paperwork? Wouldn't it be the same as if Vector tried to buy the gun in person in another state, which is forbidden? Wouldn't the gun, in either case, have to be shipped/transferred to an FFL in Vector's home state?
     
  13. nazshooter

    nazshooter Member

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    Wgsigs: Yes, if it's a long gun but many ffls won't do it. If it's a handgun then it would have to be shipped to a ffl in the OPs state.

    Sent from my ADR6425LVW using Tapatalk 2
     
  14. fireman 9731

    fireman 9731 Member

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    I shipped a long gun to myself from CO to KY, but I bought the gun in CO while I lived in KY. It cost around a hundred bucks to overnight and insure it, and dealing with the ignorant at the post office was a hassle at both locations. I'm sure Fed-Ex would of been better but USPS was my only option where I was.

    In your situation though, You better just send it through a dealer.
     
  15. reuben mishler

    reuben mishler Member

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    Last edited: Oct 23, 2012
  16. dab102999

    dab102999 Member

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    Wgisgs wrote:

    I am a little confused and need some clarification. Can the gun be gifted to Vector in person in the first place even with FFL paperwork? Wouldn't it be the same as if Vector tried to buy the gun in person in another state, which is forbidden? Wouldn't the gun, in either case, have to be shipped/transferred to an FFL in Vector's home state?

    Nazshooter replied:

    Wgsigs: Yes, if it's a long gun but many ffls won't do it. If it's a handgun then it would have to be shipped to a ffl in the OPs state.
    _________________________________________________

    Now I am a little confused, does this mean if he bought a long gun across state lines it has to be shipped FFl?? And is that federal law??. The reason I ask is because I live on the IN/MI line and know of people (don't want to incriminate myself) that have passed background check and bought a long gun and transported it home them selfs from a dealer. Also have bought long guns at gun shows from private individuals and done the same. I know of at least one instance where the buyer was unsure and asked the state boy that was there if this was o.k. before he bought a long gun and was informed that it was fine as long as he was eligable to buy the gun and gun was legal??. So were these transactions techically illegal???...If so good thing all the guns I bought in Indiana where in the years that I lived down there.
     
  17. CoRoMo

    CoRoMo Member

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    Nope. Not forbidden. You can purchase a long gun in any state. Can be shipped, does not have to be.
    Nope.
    That's because this does not violate federal law.
    That's a violation of -at least- federal law.
    If you are referring to the private transaction between two residents of different states, the 'state boy' did not give you the correct answer. See the 'quote box' in post #6; it is a FAQ from atf.gov
     
    Last edited: Oct 23, 2012
  18. smalls

    smalls Member

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    No, you may buy a long gun in any state, so long as the gun in question is legal in your state. It must be transferred to you through an FFL, buy you may take possession of it in other states than your own.

    Handguns must go through the FFL in your home state.

    Why? There is no need to send it through a dealer. Nor is there a need to overnight the package, or pay for anything special. You may walk into USPS with the package, tell them "I have a package to send", and send it. No need to even tell them what's inside it, as long as it's a long gun. Insurance is suggested, though.
     
  19. Kyle M.

    Kyle M. Member

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    I've bought several long guns out of state from ffl's and I've been able to bring them home with me. Handguns on the other hand have had to be shipped to my ffl at home. I've also had no less than three ffl's tell me I can buy a gun from an individual out of state, but it has to be shipped from an ffl in said state to an ffl in my state regardless of whether it is a rifle or handgun.
     
  20. Mike Sr.

    Mike Sr. Member

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    shipped to myself....

    I went to Alaska last Summer to see my brother. He lives in Soldotna.

    I shipped my Marlin 444p to myself using their address, they picked it up at the PO for me. Then when I left, I shpped it back to myself to my home address. ....using the same box....


    I did not want to screw with the airline format.
     
  21. smalls

    smalls Member

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    They broke Federal law. Only you are allowed to take possession of that box.
     
  22. Frank Ettin

    Frank Ettin Moderator

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    They may pick up the box addressed to the gun owner in care of them. But they may not open the box.
     
  23. smalls

    smalls Member

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    Thanks for the clarification.
     
  24. NavyLCDR

    NavyLCDR member

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    Let's summarize.....again.....

    Federal law for the transfer of ownership of firearms, regardless of if the transfer of ownership is gift or sale, family or not - the only exception is by inheritance when someone dies:

    1. Federal law allows transfers of rifles, shotguns and handguns only between residents of the same state with no FFL involved.

    2. Federal law allows the transfer of a rifle or shotgun to a person outside their state of residence by an FFL only - if the state laws of both the recipient and the FFL are complied with.

    3. Federal law only allows the transfer of other than a rifle or shotgun to a person inside their own state of residence.

    Person A in State A wants to give a rifle or shotgun to Person B who is a resident of State B. The transfer cannot happen directly between Person A and Person B. The transfer can go through an FFL in almost any state, so long as the state laws of the FFL and Person B are complied with.

    Person A in State A wants to give a firearm other than a rifle or shotgun to Person B who is a resident of State B. The transfer cannot happen directly between Person A and Person B. The transfer must go through an FFL in State B only.

    Once Person B lawfully owns the firearm, having been previously transferred to him by an FFL, he can then ship it to himself in another state, or transport the firearm himself between states. He can also ship it to himself in care of another person, the third person can receive the package, but most hold the package, unopened, for Person B to finally receive it.
     
  25. wgsigs

    wgsigs Member

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    Thanks everyone for the clarification and NavyLCDR for the summary. I think it is clearer to me now. I was mixing up the laws and process for handguns with that for long guns.
     
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