Shot 4 times with a 45, goes home after a visit to hospital

[Philo_Beddoe]

The victim remained outside, but McKnight returned a few minutes later and jumped out of the car with a .45-caliber pistol. He confronted the victim and shot him four times, police said – three times in the legs and once in the arm.

Police said the victim was treated at the hospital and released.

http://www.sj-r.com/top-stories/x157347761/Alleged-gunman-found-hiding-in-basement-this-morning

More proof that shot placment is far more important than caliber.

 

[Hunt480]

Hey Beddoe, hows clyde?

 

[rd2007]

this is why you practice, practice, practice..

 

[Old Fuff]

More proof that shot placment is far more important than caliber.

The Old Fuff would agree, unless a major blood vessel is cut, and lacking quick medical care the victum bleeds out.

The reverse is also true, in that a minor cartridge/caliber bullet that makes a direct hit on a critical organ often ends an attack in quick order.

But in a (seldom) perfect world a well-placed bullet of major caliber is best of all. In the present example the shooter didn't hit anything important - that may or may not be good depending on the circumstances.

 

[NG VI]

Well...

I'd say this is a case where the fact that shot placement matters becomes a canard. I don't have any particular love, respect, affection, or history with .45 ACP, and in almost every instance I will choose a 9x19mm or .40 S&W caliber pistol over the same in .45, but really this just shows that when you shoot like an asshat you get results like an asshat.

 

[The Lone Haranguer]

Here, on the other hand, is what would seem to be a well placed shot, yet the recipient ran almost 300 yards before collapsing and survived to be put on trial.

A police manhunt ended when a K-9 found him almost 300 yards from the Subway shop, collapsed near a bank. He had sustained a gunshot wound to the thorax from the Marine's weapon, striking some 2" above the heart. Gadson was charged with armed robbery, and, since his accomplice had died during a felony, Gadson was committing, he was also charged with murder. He is still awaiting trial at this writing.

Link

(I am fond of quoting this article because of the many lessons that can be learned from it.)

 

[GLOOB]

OP: placement over caliber:
Ohhh, I dunno about that.

1. He survived the encounter, and the other guy never even attacked him.
2. If he had used a lesser gun like a .380 Lorcin, half the forum apparently believes he would have been better off throwing it at the other guy.
3. If you're gonna shoot someone in the leg over a $10.00 debt and go to jail for a long time, you should really get your bullet's worth. He would have really shortchanged himself with a .22.

 

[Oyeboten]

If I had to take a wild guess...

It would be that the 'shooter' had felt 'dissed' by the soon to be victim...and, shot the then 'victim' aiming for Legs as a way of rebuking, without killing...

Just a guess though...

 

[Shawn Dodson]

Here, on the other hand, is what would seem to be a well placed shot, yet the recipient ran almost 300 yards before collapsing and survived...

Unless the bullet physically damages or disrupts central nervous system structures, a person will not be incapacitated until he/she experiences blood loss in sufficient quantity to produce unconsciousness.

When a person is not rapidly incapacitated by a gunshot wound it is because the bullet either failed to damage vitals critical to immediate survival (the bullet's path through the body missed vitals or the bullet didn't penetrate deeply enough to reach vitals) or, if the bullet damaged vitals the injury was inadequate to produce blood loss in rate and volume to quickly cause physiological incapacitation.

Seemingly well-placed shots can, and do, miss vital structures.

 

[hardluk1]

gloob Jokeingly if the bad guy had a 10 round .22 he could have fired all 10 rounds quicker than the 4 .45 rounds and with the law of averages hit something vital with better shot control. hehe. Any of those those .45's hit one inch one way or another than that oll boy might be died. As said before, practice,practice,practice. A nice 6" group,center of mass.

 

[huntsman]

but McKnight returned a few minutes later and jumped out of the car with a .45-caliber pistol. He confronted the victim and shot him four times,

I'll bet he was holding his pistola sideways.

 

[MachIVshooter]

unless a major blood vessel is cut, and lacking quick medical care the victum bleeds out.

And that could've happened in very little time if the femoral artery had been damaged, which is not uncommon with bullet wounds to the thigh area. The guy is lucky.

 

[christcorp]

This is why, no matter what gun I am carrying, I ALWAYS train for center of mass and 3 shots. I will not fire 1 shot and then re-access the situation. It will be 3 shots. They will be 3 very quick shots. I NEVER take my handguns to the range and ever practice shooting 1 shot at a time. I want 100% muscle memory to know to shoot 3 times. If I hit center of mass with one shot, the chance of reducing the threat is increased by "X%". If I can hit center of mass with all 3 shots, my odds and percentages go up tremendously of hitting a vital area. I AlWAYS practice shooting groups of three. I don't want my mind to have to think beyond "Shoot-Yes/No" and "AIM for Chest". After 3 rounds, I can mentally assess the situation and determine if I will shoot 2 more. I think the most dangerous thing you can do is to shoot 1 round and reaccess the situation. If you're going to shoot someone with a pistol, there is no reason in the world to not shoot at least 3 rounds.

 

[Sapper771]

While overseas, there was an incident were an insurgent fired on one of our patrols. The lead
Gunner opened fire on the insurgent, hitting him 8 times with his M240B machinegun (7.62). I think the engagement range was around 300-400 meters.
The insurgent was able to make it back to his truck and drove himself to the hospital that was in the town. The Patrol found him at the hospital and he did make a full recovery.

Some people are just lucky, others not so much.

 

[19-3Ben]

but really this just shows that when you shoot like an asshat you get results like an asshat.

A) That's really funny. Thanks for the laugh.
B) Could not have put it any better myself.

 

[19-3Ben]

I think the most dangerous thing you can do is to shoot 1 round and reaccess the situation. If you're going to shoot someone with a pistol, there is no reason in the world to not shoot at least 3 rounds.

I worked with an investigator who is an old guy. He was on CT's first SWAT team back in the 80's. He always told me "Anything worth shooting once is worth shooting twice."

 

[w_houle]

... but that's impossible! Everyone knows that if you were shot with a .45 in the elbow, that the shock from the round would knock the top of your skull clean off!

 

[Weevil]

There was a kid in India that had a pole go through his head.





He survived and is doing fine.




http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/art...ndian-teen-survives-4ft-pole-rammed-head.html


A bullet wound or even four are minor injuries by comparison.


Contrary to what you see on TV and in the movies handguns are not some sort of magic death-ray that will render someone dead instantly.

Oh they can and sometimes do but this is the exception not the rule.

 

[GLOOB]

double post

 

[GLOOB]

There are a lot of people posting comments to this effect, and no particular reason I chose yours, Christcorp:

This is why, no matter what gun I am carrying, I ALWAYS train for center of mass and 3 shots.

I'm just wondering if you guys have read the article. "This" is likely going to be prosecuted as attempted murder. Better shot placement would not have "stopped a threat" faster. It would increased the chance of a senseless murder.

Even if you advocate the successful completion of senseless murder (for the resultant proof of your marksmanship, or to prove the effectiveness of your favorite caliber??), consider that he could have been aiming for his victim's arms and legs. Who knows what he was thinking?

 

[MachIVshooter]

A bullet wound or even four are minor injuries by comparison.

Gunshot wounds are much more traumatic than impaling wounds. Our EMS guys can elaborate better than I can, but basically, objects like poles usually invade the body at relatively low speeds and, unless the object is rather sharp edged, they tend to do more pushing things out of the way than tearing and shredding like bullets do.

 

[Weevil]

Gunshot wounds are much more traumatic than impaling wounds. Our EMS guys can elaborate better than I can, but basically, objects like poles usually invade the body at relatively low speeds and, unless the object is rather sharp edged, they tend to do more pushing things out of the way than tearing and shredding like bullets do.

Well that depends on the bullet being used.

An FMJ does lot more "pushing" than "tearing and shredding" regardless of caliber.


Even so unless that "tearing and shredding" is to vital organs it's not going to instantly kill someone.

The pole in the head is a good example of the sort of punishment the human body is capable of enduring.



Do you really think a bullet passing through that same area would have done that much more damage???

 

[easyrider604]

Good thing the victim survived.

Totally unjustified shooting. That hoodlum Mcknight cannot shoot well, thank heaven, but no doubt he should be put away for a long time.

 

[Weevil]

I dunno I'd have to agree that if the guy owed him money and he shot him three times in the legs and once in the arm, he wasn't really going for a kill shot.

 

[Maj Dad]

This all points back to Center Mass. Shoot to wing, and you'll wing. I defy any one to show an instance when a person was shot 4 times center mass and didn't go down (with a 38 spl on up but for sure with a 45). I'm sure there are all kinds of anecdotal tales, but it just doesn't jibe with the realities of human anatomy and gunshot wounds. I'll defer to the eye-witness events of drug-crazed zombies who soaked up 50 chest wounds with a 50 BMG...