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Since when do we want silencers??? Haha

Discussion in 'NFA Firearms and Accessories' started by speaksoftly, Feb 17, 2011.

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  1. speaksoftly

    speaksoftly Member

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    I've noticed something lately. People want silencers. I don't know why but 5 years ago I don't remember there being this much interest in cans. Yet now companies are cranking them out like P-mags and people are buying them up like crazy. Why is this?
     
  2. Sky

    Sky Member

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    Think more have been around people who have them and like the idea of shooting without hearing protection and being able to carry on a conversation.....especially women....just a thought...
     
  3. Ironman

    Ironman Member

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    Yeah. Its becoming more mainstream. Imagine going to your local range and not having to wear earpro and you could hold a conversation with anyone. I've been to silenced only shoots and its pretty cool to experience it. The industry still has alot to catch up on since hollywood has always portrayed silencers as evil tools.
     
  4. speaksoftly

    speaksoftly Member

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    Personally, I'm more ready for the industry to keep up with the Hollywood notion that the .45 ACP sounds like a pin drop with a silencer. Haha
     
  5. Harve Curry

    Harve Curry Member

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    The older I get and have hearing problems, the more I appreciate my hearing that I have left. Also the non-shooting belly acher's cannot complain about Noise-Pollution and close the decades old shooting range down, hahaha.
     
  6. Taurus44

    Taurus44 Member

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    I think online gun sites and forums have disspelled many of the myths and misconceptions about owning NFA regulated items. People are just realizing that it is easier/cheaper to do than they originally thought.

    Back before I started reading about Title II stuff online, I thought there was some sort of mystic, black art ju-ju involved in acquiring them. Now I have a Trust and six stamps with no end in sight.
     
  7. frankenstein406

    frankenstein406 Member

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    It would be nice to hunt squirrels with one. God there annoying when deer hunting. I use to think they were hard to get, now I just know they cost money and some paperwork.
     
  8. Harve Curry

    Harve Curry Member

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    What is the deal with Trusts? So the Class II stuff is not in limbo and you can pass them on when you check out?
     
  9. Taurus44

    Taurus44 Member

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    That is one benefit. The other advantage is that by using a Trust (or LLC, or S Corp, or...) you avoid the hassles of having to send in fingerprints and photos and, most importantly, you get to avoid the whole CLEO sign-off.

    The CLEO sign-off is a huge stumbling block for a LOT of people who want to get into the Title II game. If you live in an area with a non-NFA friendly CLEO, he/she can effectively stop your application process by refusing to sign-off on your form... Even if there is no good reason for them NOT to sign.
     
  10. One-Time

    One-Time Member

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    Because people have always thought they were illegal, now theres many mainstream types who are writing about them, and even more shooters getting them, now we just need to remove suppressors from the NFA and transfer them like a firearm that any FFL can carry
     
  11. Harve Curry

    Harve Curry Member

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    One Time,
    Really they're no different then any other accessory. Like adding a scope, laser sight, red dot, range finder, or a flashlight. De-List them altogether. Shoot for that. :)
     
  12. BADUNAME37

    BADUNAME37 Member

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    I would like one on my .22 just so I can shoot neighborhood varmints in the middle of the night when I put my light on and see a huge skunk digging up my lawn. As it is, either it takes several shots from a target Pistol, and then the thing makes its way into the woods or under my attached barn, only to suffer needlessly.

    If I use the 12 gauge, the neighbors call thinking I am setting off a cannon as their whole house shook. I try the .410 with a maglight miniature inside a piece of pipe insulation with several tie-wraps around the insulation and barrel on top. Those lights don't put out much light so I don't feel real comfortable turning off the house lights and walking around my yard with the small flashlight.

    I live in an extremely rural area, there just happens to be a couple of houses close by and only one person who complains as they think ALL the animals should live.

    I hope a skunk sprays her good when she least expects it. Then, she'll be calling me to come and shoot them for her!
     
  13. bigfatdave

    bigfatdave Member

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    You put a light-reducing device on your maglite?
    How dare you operate an unlicensed darkener!
     
  14. One-Time

    One-Time Member

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    @ Harve, I agree, but incrimentalism is what will win it for us, so lets do step 1 first, then get it where it should be, but i agree 100%
     
  15. kayak-man

    kayak-man Member

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    I think a lot of it has to do with the fact that people are realising that they are legal.

    As for silently dispatching critters, have you considered a bow? I figure 35-40 pound draw weight should be more than enough for a skunk.

    I'd really like cans to be unregulated.

    Chris "the Kayak-Man" Johnson
     
  16. Zoogster

    Zoogster Member

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    Hiram Percy Maxim invented the firearm silencer and automobile muffler (called a silencer in some nations.)

    Politicians have since required one as a mandatory safety device to reduce hearing damage and noise pollution.
    When was the last time you heard a 130 decibel truck roaring down the road?
    Maybe never, because they all use mufflers.


    However politicians have restricted protecting your ears with the same technology from the report of gunshots, discouraging its use.



    The same technology that is considered so good as to mandate it and remove the option of not using it on one device was banned on another (NFA was intended as a ban at the time for all intents and purposes, they just didn't believe they had the authority to actually outright ban anything at that point in time. So they required a tax they knew most people couldn't pay before inflation, and wouldn't know about to outlaw the items.)


    Silencers should really be built into guns. Perhaps we are lucky though, imagine if they were unrestricted and viewed normally. They might have mandated their use by now, set decibel guidelines like with automobiles for firearms, increasing the minimum dimensions of firearms.
     
  17. Ironman

    Ironman Member

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    Wow, good point! Ive never thoughtof it that way. That would suck wif they mandated it and had testing like automobiles.:barf:
     
  18. ray55classic

    ray55classic Member

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    Anything the government sticks its foot in they screw up I can just imagine a government approved silenced firearm Can you? That said I think they should be pulled from the class2 list and while we're at it let's repeal the NFA and the GCA of 68' also.Silencers are legal in many european countries {even so I thank God I don't live there} and not considered "evil" but rather a tool to stop noise pollution ,heck they're built into a lot of the english air rifles. I can't think of one other product that would be allowed to make that kind of noise legally in todays society {some Harley's maybe}. As was mentioned earlier quite a few really nice outdoor ranges have been shut down when approaching subdivision's started complaining about the noise. Shoot, around here in Houston every year some new group of homeowners starts ranting about noise from the airports near their homes {even though the airport was built and in operation 30 years before their homes were built and they knew an airport was there when they bought their homes} This is what happened to my favorite range .
     
  19. Justin

    Justin Moderator Emeritus

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    I suspect but cannot prove that the mainstreaming of sound suppressors is largely due to the fact that information detailing the legal process for acquiring NFA items became widespread via the internet starting in the early 2000s.

    Once upon a time, few people were willing to jump through the hoops to acquire an NFA item because just learning the process was considered to be a daunting undertaking.

    Now anyone who's struck by the notion can run a Google search and pretty much have a solid description of the process along with contact info for their local NFA dealer(s) in a few minutes.

    I'd like to think that the mainstreaming of SBRs, SBSs, and cans is one tangible result of the democratization of data brought on by the internet.
     
  20. mljdeckard

    mljdeckard Member

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    What about inflation? Has the relative dollar cost of owning one with the tax stamp become much more manageable to the average shooter, where before it was considered exorbitant?
     
  21. Zoogster

    Zoogster Member

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    That has been a big part of my belief.
    For most of the time since the creation of the NFA people had to first learn it was even an option to legally own, then they had to be interested in learning how to do it.
    This used to require either already knowing someone that already knew the process, or ordering books or looking for details in some library.
    Even if someone found the details they had to be sure the information was reliable, what some random author says on a law even today can be wrong.
    So once learning the process they would want to double check it.

    Today people all learn about it and exactly how to do it and that many others have done it, without even trying.




    But there is another big one:

    Another big change I imagine contributes is a greater acceptance of big brother.
    I know not that long ago a large number of firearm collectors were suspicious of government knowing about their firearms, and the NFA is registration.
    Governments around the world have long used registration to know who has what, who is the type likely to have weapon "stockpiles" they don't know about based on obvious interest in what they do know about, etc
    The GCA of 1968 started FFLS and transfers through them, but person to person sales with no records were still quite common (and still happen in fewer states today).
    Even California had private sales until the 90s.
    Even after the GCA the records were just paper, large quantities of paper hard to even sort through, the potential of computerized databases didn't even exist until computers became common. There was no checking in with government, or much monitoring.
    Now there is NICs even on basic purchases, requiring checking in with big brother to buy any gun.
    Even Concealed Carry licenses contribute to the mindset, paying a fee, getting government permission, and then being allowed to do something with a firearm.

    Our whole culture makes people more accepting of less privacy and the idea of checking in with big brother and being registered. Things that I am sure didn't appeal to as many people in the 60s-90s.
    There is also extensive security screening in airports, sporting events, courthouses, etc people are used to emptying pockets, taking things off, and having to please government or security to be allowed to do something.
    Such screening primarily started in the 90s (metal detectors in the 70s at airports) and ramped up in intensity post 9/11.
    People are also used to being on constant surveillance cameras everywhere, cameras were once rare and expensive, primarily limited to high security locations.
    Look at the widespread use of various websites where large numbers of people put huge amounts of personal details, profiles, pictures, etc
    While all these things may seem unrelated on the surface, it creates a different mentality in society in general.

    People have become used to others having access to lots of information on them, asking permission to do things, and become more comfortable with being tracked by government than I think in prior decades.
    If you had told many in the 50s-70s, or even into the 80-90s that they would have to ask permission, be registered, pay a larger fee, and let us not forget check in with government to cross state lines, I think many would have balked at the notion.

    In a post 9/11 Homeland Security state with widespread technology people are desensitized to a lot of things that were big deals to some before.



    Take it a step further, an individual is also at the mercy of the ATF to properly maintain their records of legal procurement while the individual is known to have items subjecting someone to large sentences for mere possession without the proper paperwork.
    A less than honest government could 'misplace' or lose such records, especially when they were all just paper records locally filed.
    Placing all burden to prove legal ownership of a restricted device on someone with 'forged' or 'unvalidated' documents.
    We might take for granted that won't likely be done in the USA, but you need only visit Mexico to know other places are not like that. Many other governments past and present around the world could readily misuse any such opportunities.






    So both the widespread sharing of information through the internet, and a significant desensitization to many things that would have bothered people in prior generations I think play equal roles.
    Today asking the government permission and going on file as the owner of something is pretty standard. Extending that process to yet another thing, even concerning a right that was originally intended as a protection from that government if it became tyrannical, is hardly even considered anymore. Ask permission, pay a fee, and get to have something that one otherwise legally could not? That is hardly different than many Concealed Carry licenses. Asking permission and being on file as someone with permission to use or own a firearm has become pretty routine for many. NFA is the same type of thing, for owning certain types of firearms.
     
    Last edited: Feb 20, 2011
  22. S.W.G.

    S.W.G. Member

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    Not just back then, it still happens today. Especially here in the South.

    I have not partaken in any illegal activity myself (sounds fun, but I don't think it's worth the risk, everything I have is A-OK), but I have, in my 'travels', come across more than one individual who has an unregistered MG or two in their cellar/barn/attic.

    The sad thing is, one of them was a Korean War bring-back, the gentleman who had it didn't like the idea of the fed's knowing about his trophy.

    Imagine what it would be worth today.:(
     
  23. murdoc rose

    murdoc rose Member

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    I think it has to do with the raise in class 3 dealers and the internet. Seeing one on the shelf really drives home that how easy it would be to bring one home.

    @s.w.g now that you mention unregistered mgs it makes me wonder if and how you could register a suppressor that was previously unregistered. From what I know when you go about getting a suppressor you pay for it then fill out the paper work with its serial number on the paper work. Trying to pass one off as form 1 (home made form iirc) doesn't sound like a good idea.
     
  24. Carl N. Brown

    Carl N. Brown Member

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    I dunno. I recall (in the 1950s) seeing a number of reprints of Maxim Silencer ads from the 1900s. There has always been some interest in cans. I suspect that the closing of the machinegun registry in 1986, led to increased interest in cans, SBRs and AOWs.

    What is ironic are the British constabularies advising folks to get cans for their .22s and .410s if they insist on shooting pests in their gardens; it seems they do not want to respond to "shots fired' only to find it's just a gardener shooting rabbits in the veggie plot. If you can own a .22 or .410 for pest control there, it is no problem to get supressors for them. The real hurdle is getting an ordinary firearms certificate.
     
  25. Sky

    Sky Member

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    Zoogster +1
     
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