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smith and wesson lock

Discussion in 'Handguns: Revolvers' started by jgo296, Mar 25, 2008.

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  1. jgo296

    jgo296 member

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    i havent bought a new s&w since they put locks on them
    id never lock it if i had one but i have a question
    does the lock do anything that could make the gun less reliable or durable?
     
  2. Archie

    Archie Member

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    Numerous reports of the lock locking itself under recoil.

    This seems to be denied by S&W, but I know for certain my non-lock guns have never locked accidentally. In my not so humble opinion they're just another doodad without purpose to malfunction at some inopportune point.
     
  3. Erik

    Erik Member

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    There have been reports that the heavier loads available for the big bore magnums can tie up the Scandium framed Smiths; the recoil enables the lock, apparently.
     
  4. jhco

    jhco Member

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    never had my 642 do anything unusual but it is a concern but not enough of one to stop them from selling
     
  5. Virginian

    Virginian Member

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    Can you totally disable the lock from inside? Ruger's new lock is totally unobtrusive under the grip panels, and I don't see how recoil could tie the gun up, but I am planning to disable it or remove it anyway when my Wolff Springs, new base pin, and grips get here.
     
  6. Sir Aardvark

    Sir Aardvark Member

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    Disabling the lock is as simple as grinding off the little inside tab.
    You cannot tell that it has been altered from the outside.

    Removing the lock leaves you with the issue of now having a hole in the side of your gun.
    It would be best to order a spare part from S&W and then you could always return it back to "factory-specs".
     
  7. Bendutro

    Bendutro Member

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    I own a Performance Center 629 with the IL and it hasn't caused me any trouble. If I was gonna CCW an IL S&W, I'd remove the internals to make 100% sure though.

    (The only unintentional IL events happened with Scandium revolvers and Magnum loads.)
     
  8. BMW2

    BMW2 Member

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    I've put about 800 rounds of various factory loads through my 629 and never had a problem. My .02
     
  9. Evyl Robot

    Evyl Robot Member

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    I wasn't going to mention this, but when my wife's 627PC came back from the factory, we took it to the range that night. After about thirty rounds, the action locked up. The hammer, trigger, and cylinder were all three immobilized. After playing with the IL keys in the lock for 15-20 minutes, we got the thing to release, and it has not been a problem since. Granted, we've only put a couple hundred rounds through it since then, but still.

    My purpose for mentioning it here is this:

    When I got my 29, I had never seen the IL before. I got the keys, and played with the lock a couple of times, then I put the keys in the box and never thought about them again. when wife's gun came home, we did no such thing. If the lock were to rattle into an in-between position during shipping, neither locked nor unlocked, it stands to reason that recoil could have enough of a jarring motion to lock the gun.

    In the couple of cases that I have seen documented of people having this problem, I have to wonder if they could have solved the issue themselves by this means. I know a lot of people who are modern Smith fans, having put lots of rounds through many IL-equipped guns without any problems. I actually asked several of them about this after the incident with the 627. The response was a unanimous "heard of it, but never seen an actual case of it happening in real life."

    Needless to say, I think we're going to pull the lock from my wife's gun if she decides to carry it. I'm not sure I want to risk it in a carry gun, either. I keep thinking that surely, somebody makes a plug-kit, so you don't wind up with a hole in your frame... If not, somebody should...
     
  10. jgorniak

    jgorniak Member

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    Over by here...
  11. Thaddeus Jones

    Thaddeus Jones Member

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    The lock is a poor solution in search of a problem. S&W can pound sand till they make revolvers without locks. TJ
     
  12. Deer Hunter

    Deer Hunter Member

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    The reports came from very lightweight (non-steel) revolvers being loaded with very hot magnum rounds. This was years ago, and I have not seen or heard of this happening since then, even with the small revolvers.

    Not buying the gun because it has a lock that you can see? That's fine, leaves more for me. S&W makes a damned fine revolver with or without the lock.
     
  13. bdjansen

    bdjansen Member

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    The lock on my gun doesn't effect the cylinder at all. It locks the trigger and hammer but I can still load and unload the gun as normal. Sounds like it could have been a different problem?
     
  14. Evyl Robot

    Evyl Robot Member

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    BDJ,

    I'm not going to rule out that possibility, but the fact of the matter remains that playing with the lock fixed the problem. the gun has not acted up in the least since then. Strange things, at any rate...

    ./Michael
     
  15. mec

    mec Member

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    lockfailure1.png
    Here's one that happened last week. Partial Lock as they were able to get it back in battery by maniipulating the trigger and hammer. the shooter was doing fine with medium loads then switched to a jhp magunm. the gun partially locked twice in a short time.
    Shooter said that the hammer apparently bounced to the pictured position as the trigger is full back and the cylinder still locked. There have been some reports of the lock engaging on model 21-22s as well as the heavy recoiling revolvers.
     
  16. earplug

    earplug Member

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    Its possible to take the lock out without grinding or breaking anything.
    If the lock is a problem to you, take it out. New S&W revolvers are very accurate and stout.
    The lock can be compared to the cars of the 1960's that had the first seat belt buzzers or open door noise things. Live with it or disable it.
     
  17. Boats

    Boats member

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    Or don't buy and further enable the stupidity. The Hilary Hole is far more obtrusive than a door buzzer. No buzzer holds the possibility of getting killed for its malfunction.
     
  18. btg3

    btg3 Member

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    This was after 15-20 of fiddling only with the lock? Or a combination of lock, trigger, hammer, cylinder, manipulations? I think the jury is still out.

    So limp wristers may fare pretty well with IL revolvers? --LOL
     
  19. Thaddeus Jones

    Thaddeus Jones Member

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    Well said Boats. How people can buy handguns with this idiotic feature, and then admonish those of us who won't, to simply ignore the lock, or disable it, astounds me. Thanks, I'll keep buying real S&W's, you know, the ones they used to make without locks. :)

    S&W only cares about dollars, nothing else. Don't buy the product and perhaps they will make a better product. Equating internal locks on revolvers, to seat belts in automobiles is ludicrous.

    The internal lock is NOT A SAFETY!!!! OK?? IT IS A SAFE STORAGE DEVICE!! :banghead:
     
  20. earplug

    earplug Member

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    I did not imply the lock was a safety device as a seat belt, only that if the noise/lock bothers you you can remove it.
    And the new S&W revolvers are as good or better shooters then the old stuff.
    I'll trade my four inch M29-2 for another 625-8
     
  21. batmann

    batmann Member

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    If you like what you see---get it.
    My S&W with IL HAS NOT BEEN a problem. If you are concerened, take it out, 10-15 min deal.
     
  22. xring44

    xring44 Member

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    My experience with the locks has been all positive. I shoot hunter silhouettes with a 8 3/8" 686 S&W .357 magnum, it has over 10,000 rounds through it of full bore magnum loads, it has never had a failure due to the lock and only 1 of any kind, the ejector rod backed out slightly. That was some 2 or 3000rounds ago, a little blue loc-tite cured that ailment.
     
  23. Old Fuff

    Old Fuff Member

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    Not pointing a finger at Smith & Wesson, but as a general observation…

    When it comes to personal weapons there is an old saying, “Keep It Simple Stupid,” or KISS. Adding anything that isn’t necessary increases the possibilities that something might, just might… go wrong at a bad time.

    Therefore it is not wise to add anything to your life insurance that you don’t need. If you need to secure the gun a metal box with a lock will suffice just as well as an internal lock, without possibly compromising the gun’s core purpose. A handgun without an internal lock is one where a possible malfunction has been eliminated, simply because it isn’t there, never has been, and never will be.

    The same can be said about some other features that certain anti-gun politicians and lawyers advocate. Most of them will never show up on any firearm I own. Those that do will be neutered in short order.

    I have never needed a bliss-nanny to direct my choice in anything. After a long life I see no reason to start now.
     
  24. popeye
    • Contributing Member

    popeye Member

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    Old Fuff hit the nail on the head. Murphy's law applies. There's plenty of used Smith's around without locks.
     
  25. btg3

    btg3 Member

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    ...and it's easy enough to disable the locks on the new ones.

    (FWIW, I'm shopping for a used 638 or 642 and am not finding any deals, so I figure why not buy new? I'm not in a hurry and will keep looking for few weeks, including the next show here. Also, the gun shop has a counter full of used S&W in condition that I would not consider, so I'm leery if I can't inspect prior to payment. Anyone been burned?)
     
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