Tydephan - Hey thanks, I have been looking at the M&P now since it was released. I love glocks but they make my hand hurt...lol. Well maybe that's because i fired 150 rounds in an hour.....Could it be? Or maybe it's just not comfortable at all. I have small hands.
Smith and Wesson M&P 9mm Problem
- Thread starter Ermac
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tydephan
Member
Lots of people complain about discomfort with Glocks. I've been fortunate enough that they don't bother me too bad.
With that being said, the M&P has, hands down, a much more comfortable grip. I have big hands, but like the small insert. Everyone's preferences are different, which is what makes the new polymer pistols so nice (i.e. you can change the palm swell to help custom fit the grip.)
Go get one. You'll not regret it.
With that being said, the M&P has, hands down, a much more comfortable grip. I have big hands, but like the small insert. Everyone's preferences are different, which is what makes the new polymer pistols so nice (i.e. you can change the palm swell to help custom fit the grip.)
Go get one. You'll not regret it.
cyncurl999
Member
- Joined
- Dec 14, 2009
- Messages
- 1
magazine?
Can it be a crappy magazine design? I just took possession of my new S&W M&P 9mm tonight and I'm having a heck of a time loading the magazines ... both of them. I have a Springfield XDM 9 (well, I did until I gave it to my husband because it was too big for my hands and ordered the S&W) and the initial quality difference is very apparent. Mine is definitely the bare bones version - no firing pin indicator, no safety. BUT it fits my hand excellently - - hoping to go shoot some rounds tomorrow! Will advise, but my perception is that the magazines are substandard. FYI - I'm still pretty novice to handguns so I could be way off base.
Can it be a crappy magazine design? I just took possession of my new S&W M&P 9mm tonight and I'm having a heck of a time loading the magazines ... both of them. I have a Springfield XDM 9 (well, I did until I gave it to my husband because it was too big for my hands and ordered the S&W) and the initial quality difference is very apparent. Mine is definitely the bare bones version - no firing pin indicator, no safety. BUT it fits my hand excellently - - hoping to go shoot some rounds tomorrow! Will advise, but my perception is that the magazines are substandard. FYI - I'm still pretty novice to handguns so I could be way off base.
Cyncurl999, mags, especially doublestack mags, are often hard to load because of the strong spring, which is necessary for reliable feeding.
I suggest that you buy a UpLULA pistol magazine loader, a very useful and affordable device that will make loading magazines a heck of a lot faster and easier.
The S&W M&P has a good magazine.
I think you will enjoy your M&P 9, they are excellent pistols.
I suggest that you buy a UpLULA pistol magazine loader, a very useful and affordable device that will make loading magazines a heck of a lot faster and easier.
The S&W M&P has a good magazine.
I think you will enjoy your M&P 9, they are excellent pistols.
9MMare
Member
Hi Cyncurl....yeah, this thread is about 3.5 yrs old and I think most of the bugs are out of the M&Ps.
I bought one and it has performed flawlessly out of the box. And it was (& is) my first gun. Have a few thousand rounds thru it now (purchased in Sept).
As for the mags, yes, brutal to load, so I bought a mag loader....forget the name, but works like a charm. I think it's just because I dont have strong hands/fingers. I imagine it takes a pretty strong spring to be reliable for thousands of rounds in a 17 round magazine.
I hope you enjoy your new pistol...I know I really like mine.
I bought one and it has performed flawlessly out of the box. And it was (& is) my first gun. Have a few thousand rounds thru it now (purchased in Sept).
As for the mags, yes, brutal to load, so I bought a mag loader....forget the name, but works like a charm. I think it's just because I dont have strong hands/fingers. I imagine it takes a pretty strong spring to be reliable for thousands of rounds in a 17 round magazine.
I hope you enjoy your new pistol...I know I really like mine.
Full Metal Jacket
member
i actually had the same exact problem with my mp40c. the slide would lock back with rounds still in the mag.
i've sent it off to s&w 3 times for it! i haven't fired it yet since getting it back the third time, so i don't know if they managed to finally fix it or not. prob gonna sell, not cool that it took three trips back to the factory....
i've sent it off to s&w 3 times for it! i haven't fired it yet since getting it back the third time, so i don't know if they managed to finally fix it or not. prob gonna sell, not cool that it took three trips back to the factory....
Sorry, been reading this thread and most everything I see points to the problems coming from the shooter with a poor shooting grip, certainly more likely than the gun considering what's been described.
Contrary to what's been said in this thread, limp-wristing is NOT a myth, a locked wrist is crucial to a recoil operated weapon functioning correctly, and limp-wristing would explain every failure to extract/eject that's been described... AND a slide locking back prematurely can only be attributed to a few areas on the pistol not working correctly, 99% of the time it's an issue with the slide-stop, the mag follower, or most often, the shooter inadvertently and unknowingly activating the slide-stop due to a poor or incorrect firing grip... The two types of problems taken together lead me to believe that it's a shooter issue first and would look there before bashing the gun, the M&P's have a very low percentage of issues but they do happen, but what's been described here, especially after going back to S&W just doesn't add up to being the pistol (the OP describing the casings as "shells", and confusion between ejection and extraction and such lead me to believe this has more to do with the indian than the arrow).
Of course it could be the gun but they're not really that complicated, sounds eerily similar to a guy I know who sent his Glock back twice before I showed him that his grip was almost an inch below the beaver-tail and his thumb was riding under and pushing up on the slide-release as he fired...
Contrary to what's been said in this thread, limp-wristing is NOT a myth, a locked wrist is crucial to a recoil operated weapon functioning correctly, and limp-wristing would explain every failure to extract/eject that's been described... AND a slide locking back prematurely can only be attributed to a few areas on the pistol not working correctly, 99% of the time it's an issue with the slide-stop, the mag follower, or most often, the shooter inadvertently and unknowingly activating the slide-stop due to a poor or incorrect firing grip... The two types of problems taken together lead me to believe that it's a shooter issue first and would look there before bashing the gun, the M&P's have a very low percentage of issues but they do happen, but what's been described here, especially after going back to S&W just doesn't add up to being the pistol (the OP describing the casings as "shells", and confusion between ejection and extraction and such lead me to believe this has more to do with the indian than the arrow).
Of course it could be the gun but they're not really that complicated, sounds eerily similar to a guy I know who sent his Glock back twice before I showed him that his grip was almost an inch below the beaver-tail and his thumb was riding under and pushing up on the slide-release as he fired...
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Full Metal Jacket
member
ckone, it's not limpwristing (at least not im my case).
here's a police officers forum where a bunch in this dept are having the same issue.
http://forums.officer.com/forums/showthread.php?t=51326
here's a police officers forum where a bunch in this dept are having the same issue.
http://forums.officer.com/forums/showthread.php?t=51326
fastbolt
Member
The slide stop lever springs and followers have been revised a couple of times for the M&P 40 models since the time in which those postings were done in the old linked forum thread from '06.
The usual causes for early slide stop are shooter's thumb and ammunition (fat bullet ogive which bumps the lever's tab).
It's also possible that an occasional burred condition may exist where the slide stop lever tab catches on the slide's stop notch at the very bottom of the notch. I had that happen in a M&P 40c which perplexed me quite a bit until I closely examined things under my magnifying lamp. Removal of the corresponding burred edges and dressing just the involved surfaces eliminated the problem.
Old thread revived ...
The usual causes for early slide stop are shooter's thumb and ammunition (fat bullet ogive which bumps the lever's tab).
It's also possible that an occasional burred condition may exist where the slide stop lever tab catches on the slide's stop notch at the very bottom of the notch. I had that happen in a M&P 40c which perplexed me quite a bit until I closely examined things under my magnifying lamp. Removal of the corresponding burred edges and dressing just the involved surfaces eliminated the problem.
Old thread revived ...
TeamPrecisionIT
Member
Instead of starting a new thread, I will just add to this one a question:
How do you remove the extractor? It doesn't come out the back like the Glock pistols. I do not understand how it comes out because the pin that looks like it's holding it in does not budge even a little bit. I do not want to womp on it too much because I don't want to cause additional damage.
Damian
How do you remove the extractor? It doesn't come out the back like the Glock pistols. I do not understand how it comes out because the pin that looks like it's holding it in does not budge even a little bit. I do not want to womp on it too much because I don't want to cause additional damage.
Damian
fastbolt
Member
The 9/40/357 models use the typical S&W solid extractor pin. (The .45 uses a roll pin which was adopted in order to meet a perceived military spec when S&W was preparing to submit the M&P 45 in the anticipated, and then suspended, military pistol trials.)
They're removed top-to-bottom, but are very hard to remove. Like the 3rd gen guns, the extractor pins are installed with a press during factory fitting & assembly. Armorers have to do it the harder, old-fashioned way.
Even S&W armorers are told that it's really only recommended to remove them for repair purpose, though. Some experience is recommended, as well, since you really don't want to have the punch slip off the pin and wallow the top of the slide around the pin hole, or mangle the pin during removal or re-installation.
Usually a 'starter' punch is used to break them loose (and a 4 oz ball peen hammer), and then once freed they can be removed out the bottom of the slide with a straight stank 1/16" pin punch. (More than one armorer has 'created' an extra starter punch when bending/breaking a 1/16" Starrett pin punch.
)
We were told in the M&P armorer class that the pins are mostly in the slides tighter than in the traditional model 3rd gen pistols, too.
It's not easy. I know another armorer who's very experienced with removing/replacing extractor pins in 3rd gen guns, and he broke a couple of pin punches trying to break M&P extractor pins loose. I haven't had any reason to remove an extractor in a M&P except in the class, and those guns were relatively easy because of all the times the pins had been removed and re-installed by armorer students.
The pins are installed bottom-to-top, in reverse order of removal.
Did you damage an extractor? If you're not familiar with removing S&W's pinned extractors it might be best to have it done by the factory, or else by a licensed gunsmith familiar with S&W pistols.
They're removed top-to-bottom, but are very hard to remove. Like the 3rd gen guns, the extractor pins are installed with a press during factory fitting & assembly. Armorers have to do it the harder, old-fashioned way.
Even S&W armorers are told that it's really only recommended to remove them for repair purpose, though. Some experience is recommended, as well, since you really don't want to have the punch slip off the pin and wallow the top of the slide around the pin hole, or mangle the pin during removal or re-installation.
Usually a 'starter' punch is used to break them loose (and a 4 oz ball peen hammer), and then once freed they can be removed out the bottom of the slide with a straight stank 1/16" pin punch. (More than one armorer has 'created' an extra starter punch when bending/breaking a 1/16" Starrett pin punch.
)We were told in the M&P armorer class that the pins are mostly in the slides tighter than in the traditional model 3rd gen pistols, too.
It's not easy. I know another armorer who's very experienced with removing/replacing extractor pins in 3rd gen guns, and he broke a couple of pin punches trying to break M&P extractor pins loose. I haven't had any reason to remove an extractor in a M&P except in the class, and those guns were relatively easy because of all the times the pins had been removed and re-installed by armorer students.
The pins are installed bottom-to-top, in reverse order of removal.
Did you damage an extractor? If you're not familiar with removing S&W's pinned extractors it might be best to have it done by the factory, or else by a licensed gunsmith familiar with S&W pistols.
TeamPrecisionIT
Member
I just like to be able to do anything that needs to be done to the guns I carry with my own hands. I have gunsmiths at work that I can take it to, I just wanted to see if maybe there was a trick to it that I couldn't figure out. And no, it's not damaged in any way, I just broke down the slide yesterday and was trying to figure out the extractor removal to in a sense complete the detail strip.
Damian
Damian
Nuke8401
Member
I switched from a Glock 34 to an M+P 9 full size about six months ago for IDPA. The slide was locking back with rounds in the gun,,,, operator error,,,,, I was used to the Glock and my big fat thumb was hitting the slide stop/release. After a few hundred rounds I was retrained. Love the M+P. No other failures so far, though I only have about 5,000 rounds through it so it’s really just getting broken in. I also did the "Burwell" trigger job, easy and a big improvement.
I guess I have been lucky over the past 40 years, when one of my guns doesn’t work it has been because either I put it together wrong or operator error.
I guess I have been lucky over the past 40 years, when one of my guns doesn’t work it has been because either I put it together wrong or operator error.
fastbolt
Member
If you have gunsmiths at work who are familiar with the 3rd egn S&W's, then they could show you how the extractors are removed and replaced. The method is the same, although it does seem the pins are pressed into place a bit tighter than on the 3rd gen guns.
Even S&W armorers are discouraged from 'detail stripping' the M&P pistol to the point of disassembling the sear housing blocks or removing the extractors just for cleaning, though.
Repeatedly removing & replacing the extractors in the demo guns used in the armorer class causes the pins to become loose in the slides. It's not a problem to replace the pins with new ones, but it's not a good idea to remove & replace the hardened pins so frequently that the hole in the slide becomes worn and a bit wallowed out.
Even S&W armorers are discouraged from 'detail stripping' the M&P pistol to the point of disassembling the sear housing blocks or removing the extractors just for cleaning, though.
Repeatedly removing & replacing the extractors in the demo guns used in the armorer class causes the pins to become loose in the slides. It's not a problem to replace the pins with new ones, but it's not a good idea to remove & replace the hardened pins so frequently that the hole in the slide becomes worn and a bit wallowed out.
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