So, how stupid must the NRA think we are?

[buzz_knox]

I've asked myself the same question, Boats - almost verbatim, too.

Though, this is probably a good crowd to get an answer to the following question too: has the US signed/ratified any treaty in the last century or so that has conflicted with any provision of the US Constitution?

I can't think of any myself, but goodness knows that doesn't rule anything out.

Yes, it has. At a minimum, the US has become part of the WTO, that enables foreign nations to assert our tariff structure is unfair. This abrogates the Constitutional authority to impose tariffs on foreign commerce.

 

[mordechaianiliewicz]

I've said it before, and I'll Say it again

:banghead: Look, while the u.n. hasn't got the power to tax, they are irrelevant. Give them international taxation, they begin to count.

I do agree that the u.n. is dangerous to american civil liberties, but at home the nra needs to be attacking the '89 assault weapon eddict. And marketing campaigns need to get set up which are serious about getting young people, immigrants, etc. who aren't interested in guns on our side.

The antis plan to take us down piecemeal, but we can take back ground piecemeal. Just a reform of the '89 law, or gca '68 lightening it a little would be great.

As for international, supporting Brasil, supporting former Commbloc warsaw countries which now wish to liberalize gun laws should be a focus, but the primary focus must be at home.

 

[Mad Chemist]

I wish the NRA would organize a concentrated effort to implement nation-wide CHL reciprocity. This would be effective for countering authoritarian state and local HG restrictions.

I'm happy that they've begun more earnest recruitment of female members. We can't implement any significant change if we ignore 50% of the population. Especially when that 50% faces a disproportionately higher risk of criminal assault.

JH

 

[JohnBT]

Join the NRA and VOTE. Heck, join and run for office.

I can't stand whining.

John

 

[flatdog]

It's all the fault of the NRA.That is if George Bush is busy.:banghead:

 

[Bartholomew Roberts]

Now wait just a minute...............Look at what they did for the people of New Orleans when the Police took their guns...........0.00

You mean besides filing the injunction in federal court (even though there was hardly a Louisiana court to file it in) and stop the process as well as currently fighting the state and city to get an accounting of all those guns?

The NRA doesn't want the 2nd Amendment to be protected. They're a big business now, and if the 2nd Amendment was safe they would go out of business.

Of all the silly reasons to bash the NRA, that one has to be the silliest. The NRA is prohibited by charter from using its membership funds for lobbying. So the NRA gathers around $90-120 million a year ($30 x 3-4M members) to run shooting ranges, safety programs, etc.

By contrast the NRA-ILA and NRA-PVC exist only on whatever donations people wish to give over and above their membership fees. According to Neal Knox, the best fundraising year for these groups was 1995 when they pulled in $35.4 million - a fraction of what the NRA proper pulls down.

For that matter look at any number of pro-choice organizations formed to legalize abortion in the 1970s. Did they disappear or lose membership after Roe v. Wade? Did they suffer a sudden membership drop even after conservative nominees stated they considered Roe settled law?

Anti-gun people won't suddenly vanish if we win a Second Amendment battle. In fact, the NRA will be more important than ever if the Supreme Court were to adopt the individual rights decision in Emerson; because then we have a big debate about what are "reasonable restrictions".

 

[rock jock]

The NRA doesn't want the 2nd Amendment to be protected. They're a big business now, and if the 2nd Amendment was safe they would go out of business.

By that logic, one might say that half the members of THR don't want the 2nd protected either; otherwise, they wouldn't have anything to complain aobut.

 

[ArmedBear]

The NRA is the only organization with a real track record at the national level.

If you don't like the NRA, get involved and work on influencing the NRA. Ditching the NRA is the same as supporting the Brady Campaign.

The political world is not black and white. You have to recognize where there is power, and where you are just pissing into the wind.

Winning isn't everything; it's the ONLY thing.

 

[taliv]

The NRA is prohibited by charter from using its membership funds for lobbying.

perhaps, but that's potentially misleading, or their literature is. the request i got in the mail says:

I know your membership doesn't expire for quite some time yet.

However, if the NRA is to meet the challenges of the year ahead, defeat gun and ammo bans, enact our anti-crime program, and pay for our NRA media programs to readch gun-owning voters this year, we need your help right now

I hope you'll take a moment today to renew your NRA membership....

and for doing that, i'm guaranteed an NRA travel mug.

 

[Cosmoline]

I give a mini lecture, “The President signs it and the Senate ratifies it. No way, no how is Bush going to sign off on small arms controls that abrogate the Second, let alone would the Senate ratify it. Good night.”

By my calendar, GW is only in office for two more years. You want the NRA to stop fighting the UN efforts in the mean time?

 

[Maxwell]

By that logic, one might say that half the members of THR don't want the 2nd protected either; otherwise, they wouldn't have anything to complain aobut.

Both are partially true.

I for one learned the NRA to be a "gun sports" lobby, not a 2a defender.
I suppose because their the biggest they are our best hope, but thats not saying much. The NRA will still be around to collect money when the only firearms left are for target shooting.

The right to own firearms is there below freedom of speach as an essential right and duty of Americans. Its not something that should be questionable or easily blocked by states and outside organisations.
These fights should be easy. I believe that the NRA would be able to mop up in lawsuits like the ACLU and other organisations.

When theres a war on and we've got all the rights and all the guns, the front line should be over there on enemy turf and not here in our laps.
We should be debaiting things like weather criminals can own guns or if full-autos can be sold over the counter, not weather buying my target pistol from the wrong vendor is a violation of state law.

To re-use the same example with the first amendment; we should be discussing things like if we can cuss in public, not weather I have the right to apply for the right to apply for a license from the govenor and chief of police to open my mouth in the first place.


To me that makes the NRA very suspect.
Yes we're holding our own in many respects, but the war is not moving as robustly as it should.

 

[Boats]

Cosmoline said:

By my calendar, GW is only in office for two more years. You want the NRA to stop fighting the UN efforts in the mean time?

Why not? Bolton's got our backs right now. How difficult and expensive could it be for the NRA to monitor and track the bloviating of international antis who have to come to NYC or set up a well publicized international conference to even attempt something. Is it like Bolton or someone else sympathetic to our cause is going to keep us all in the dark, that the NRA needs this effort TO COMBAT THEIR DESIRES TO TAKE AWAY EVEN YOUR HUNTING RIFLES?!?!?!?"

Hogwash.

In the meanwhile, we have heavy lifting to do right here at home. Most of the world adopted Kyoto and we didn't. Most of the world could adopt a small arms treaty and if we are NOT signatories, they can just hate us some more than they already do.

If that pitch last night would have been about cash needed for a campaign to whack our stateside antis into the deepests depths of a hell of irrelevancy, I'd have opened my wallet. Instead of a campaign against that which ails us directly on a daily basis, I am instead asked to get alarmed enough to pay for some stupid shot at the shadows which are hiding an international disarmament conspiracy.

Soros and Peters scare me not. They only bear watching, not turning the NRA top brass into international jet setters.

 

[saltydog]

But you can't hang the 1968 GCA on the NRA because the NRA wasn't in the politics business at that time.
hillbilly

I'll back the NRA on just this one. The blame lies on the people who voted those morons (Congress Critters, etc) into office.

People vote politicians into office to "Represent their view" and HaHa!, we get the 68 GCA! Onward registered American voter---->

 

[JohnBT]

Jet setters? I'd have thought you'd want them out of the country.


"and for doing that, i'm guaranteed an NRA travel mug"

I got a nifty pocket knife for upgrading from Life to Endowment. Now where did I put that leather jacket they sent me for upgrading to Life? I've never worn it. I should give it to a long-time Life Member because I doubt I'll ever wear it - I like my Coronado jacket better.

John

 

[Silver Bullet]

Look at what they did for the people of New Orleans when the Police took their guns...........0.00

I can’t tell if you’re being facetious.

But, just in case:

NRA Wins Restraining Order Against Confiscations

 

[Cosmoline]

Hogwash.

You don't seem to understand. 99% of world public opinion views the likes of you and I as at best a dangerous anachronism. You ignore that at your peril, particularly given the drive towards a world criminal justice system and world government. This is not paranoia. There really is a global push to get rid of us, one way or the other.

Can the NRA do more at home? Certainly. I'd like to see them take on everything from the zero tolerance policies of schools for even DRAWING a firearm to the expansion of federal "gun crime" laws. But I recognize the political difficulties of making such moves. This is a very long game of chess we're playing, not football. The NRA is an important piece on our side of the board. Just because it only moves back and forth is no reason to abandon the piece.

 

[palerider1]

i just pay my yearly membership and ignore all of the fund raising stuff.

 

[shecky]

The UN is irrelevant to the US. Period. If the US doesn't want to follow UN ideas, it won't. End of story.

When organizations like the NRA try to make hay with such a paper tiger as the UN, all it does is make folks write them off as a bunch of whiny delusional whackos.

 

[gunsmith]

I just paid off my EPL life membership

I am now a fully functional NRA life member after EPL life membership for years.
I have never recieved one phone call ever!! not one, nada, zip, zero.
I got my notices that my dues were due by mail and thats it.

I'm feeling a little left out

Why do they only call people who don't like them? they are like my old cat...he would find people who didn't like cat hair & jump into their lap.

 

[antsi]

I give a mini lecture, “The President signs it and the Senate ratifies it. No way, no how is Bush going to sign off on small arms controls that abrogate the Second, let alone would the Senate ratify it. Good night.”
.

I agree Bush would not sign it, and a Republican controlled congress would not pass it.

But President Hillary and a Democrat controlled congress? They'd ratify that thing so fast it would make your head spin.

It has already happened in Europe where the EU Uber-Government has pressured member states to change their laws. In Switzerland I believe there was pressure to change gun laws. This is a great way to concentrate government power and erode freedoms: if one government won't do the dirty work, create an uber-government over their heads to do it. These people have an agenda, and it has nothing to do with preserving your liberties, least of all your gun rights. And one of our major domestic political parties is right in line with this agenda. They have the support of 49.9% of the US population, and they're a few swing votes away from taking control.

As gun owners we ignore these threats at our peril.

 

[antsi]

The NRA doesn't want the 2nd Amendment to be protected. They're a big business now, and if the 2nd Amendment was safe they would go out of business.

I'm sorry, but this is a groundless piece of nonsense that has been repeated over and over again.

First of all, what would make the 2nd "safe?" Do you think all the anti- groups are just going to go away?

Secondly, the NRA has many functions besides legislation. They run ranges and competitions and and training programs and youth programs and a million other shooting-related activities. The legislative action arm is a small fraction of overall NRA activities.

We hear over and over on this board about how the NRA is only about hunting and skeet shooting, with little interest in firearms rights. Well, it is true that there are many shooters and many NRA members who are not as concerned with gun rights as they should be. So, the NRA sends out materials warning members about threats against their gun rights, and then they get criticized for hyping up nonexistent problems to preserve their own existence. Which is it, people? You can't have it both ways.

Also, Bart Roberts had a good example citing the abortion batte. Just because Roe v Wade got decided the way it did, the pro-choice groups didn't just disappear. And I can guarantee you, if Roe gets overturned, the pro-life groups won't disappear either.

So, does your same concept apply to the anti's? I guess they don't really want guns banned, because if guns were banned they would go out of business, right?

Shoot, I guess we can just forget about all this. The anti's aren't serious. They aren't really trying to get any gun bans passed. It's all a propaganda stunt. Go home everyone, and vote for Hillary. It doesn't make any difference.

 

[thereisnospoon]

NRA on my Do Not Call list...

I received the same call three times, THREE TIMES in one month and finally asked the lady at the other end of the telephone to put me on their DO NOT CALL list.

I am an NRA member. I have to be to be a member of my club, otherwise they would never get a penny.

When I see them actually taking on real issues , HERE ATHOME, I'll voluntarily send them a check.

Now I know some of you will say "if you lose your guns, don'y cry foul". The NRA has proven ineffective at defending the 2A, otherwise, they would have fixed the '86 AW import ban and 68 GCA already. INEFFECTIVE!

 

[Deathrider1579]

I dream of the day when the NRA sues the ATF / federal government for its infringement of the second ammendment since 1934 (right year?).
I also think that will be the same day hell freezes over, the NRA isnt exactly a pro - weapon orginisation, they are more of a pro-hunting group. That said they are big and they are the best we got right now.

-DR

 

[buzz_knox]

I dream of the day when the NRA sues the ATF / federal government for its infringement of the second ammendment since 1934 (right year?).
I also think that will be the same day hell freezes over, the NRA isnt exactly a pro - weapon orginisation, they are more of a pro-hunting group. That said they are big and they are the best we got right now.

-DR

And if the NRA sues and loses, the 2nd Amendment goes out the door. Ever thought that maybe they know that as well and are waiting for the right case and Court makeup? Would you respect them more if they threw all their eggs in one basket and we all lost as a result?

With Roberts as Chief Justice and Alito coming on, you may see that lawsuit but this time with a higher chance of success.

 

[cbsbyte]

Everyone, this is important. You can have your name taken off their call list. Its easy just call them or tell them next time they call that you want to be taken off all their call list. Thats what I did, and I have not recieved a call in three years. I still get tons of NRA mail every year but it better than being called at dinner time.