So i got to fire a s&w scandium snubby today...

[miko]

Missing someone who's shooting at you is surprisingly easy even at very close range.
The classic example was the example of the Kehoe brothers traffic stop. There was a 4 person gunfight ranging from point-blank to about 10 feet in which at least a couple of guns were emptied. No one was hit.

...Don't EVER fool yourself into thinking you can't miss--even at point blank range it can be--and IS--done.

True. One can even miss while commiting suicide.
But the important aspect of the issue is - are you much more likely to miss at 10 feet with a 340 compared to some other gun?

I think thats true, in my case i think that if i have to deal with loads of recoil i better gets loads of power and the Sc snub doesnt deliver it.

Sc snub delivers exactly as much power as any other snub. The "loads of recoil" that you have to suffer is a tradeoff for portability - having the gun with you. If you empty the cylinder at BG(s), your arm will smart some. The alternative is not a better gun - if you could wear a better gun, you would not have to use a 340. The alternative is no gun or a much less powerful gun.

The grips can be greatly improved if you just use the 3-finger combat grip standard with model 60. It has a closed backstrap. The concealability does not have to be sacrificed - you can just cut off the bottom for a 2-finger result, as I did:
http://www.thehighroad.org/showthread.php?t=231172

miko

 

[honkeoki]

FWIW -- I couldn't handle more than about 15 +P rounds from my 442. I remember walking out of the range one day, thinking I was a total pu55y, trying to shake the sting out of my hand, when I met this guy going in. He saw what I was doing and shook his head.

"My Smith Airweight always beats me up," he said.

"Mine, too!" I said.

"I only shoot .38 plus ps in mine," he said.

"Me, too!" I said.

"I bought one of them Uncle Mikes grips," he said.

"Me, too!" I said. Then I left because I felt like a putz.

I traded the 442 for a Kahr P40 Covert... and it only got worse. Much, much worse. :banghead:

 

[JohnKSa]

But the important aspect of the issue is - are you much more likely to miss at 10 feet with a 340 compared to some other gun?

Dunno...

I can only say that you're less likely to miss with a gun you shoot well, and you're more likely to shoot a gun well if you practice a lot with it.

 

[miko]

I can only say that you're less likely to miss with a gun you shoot well, and you're more likely to shoot a gun well if you practice a lot with it.

Yes. But how well is well enough for practical purposes?
Here is a mental experiment. Imagine you can practice a lot with a 340 full-house magnums without experiencing any pain. You would undoubtedly get very good at it.

Now imagine you practice very little with a 340 full-house magnums but insted shoot some mild 38s, or even none at all from that gun but instead some other revolver - maybe even 22. But you still zero in and carry .357.
How much would your groups open at 10 feet? From 1 to 2 inches? 3 Inches? I doubt that much.

So what would you rather have at 10 feet? 1 inch groups with 38 Sp +P or 2-3 inch groups of 357 Mag that carry 40% more energy?

Some might prefer the former but it is not a foregone conclusion.

miko

 

[Vern Humphrey]

Yes. But how well is well enough for practical purposes?

I have never been in a shootout as a civilian. All of my experience is in combat. But that experience tells me you should expect a 90% degradation of skills in actual combat.

Oddly enough, when you look at records of how police perform on the range and in real shootouts, that seems to be borne out -- in fact, it might be a bit on the optomistic side.

So I would say a well-trained man, in his first shootout, would be doing well to get one hit out of five at 10 feet, anywhere on his opponent's body.

 

[tubeshooter]

That's a pretty sobering stat. I bet a lot of gun owners actually just feel safer than they actually are, considering training and experience with such encounters.

That being said, the deterrent-by-presence factor is still very valuable. And nothing wrong with feeling safer, either. Feels better than the alternative.


I've never had a deadly encounter, and I pray I never do.

 

[JohnKSa]

So I would say a well-trained man, in his first shootout, would be doing well to get one hit out of five at 10 feet, anywhere on his opponent's body.

That matches well with the statistics I've seen.