Somebody give me the skinny on 6.5 Creedmoor

People were shooting fast twist 6.5-08's for long range sling comps and highpower rifle years before the Creed came about. What led to the 6.5 Creed was that high BC bullets were too long for short action mag length in Tubb 2000's so barrel twist had nothing to do with it.

We have a 1 260 Rem in the family and the 1:10 barrel shoots 140 gr. flat base soft point hunting bullets quite well. He has killed a bunch of whitetails and a black bear with that rifle, and I think that a 140 Partition would be effective on elk sized game as well.

The 6.5 Creed case is a little bit shorter to allow for longer bullets, and that reduced powder capacity results in maybe 100 fps less velocity in 140's. Even if you can stabilize heavier 150+ gr. bullets, the rainbow trajectory and slower impact velocity is going to limit your effective range. Or does the increased BC really matter?

I don't think that there is much difference between the 2 in hunting situations, unless you consider the extra 100 fps. give the edge to the 260.

 

Its evolution, not magic.

8x57 => 30-06 => 300 Savage => 308 Win => 30 TC => 6.5 CM

And, if we live long enough, one of these days something else new will come along and we can have the same discussion again.

And, it is performance in the field and on the range that matter, not theoretical analyses on paper. I don't think I have ever seen a deer killed by a ballistics table (or ever chrongraphed a handload that exactly agreed with a reloading manual).

I like the 6.5 CM. It is accurate, easy on the shoulder, and the deer don't go far if they are hit properly.

 

I own a RPR in 6.5CM, and an AR-10 in 6.5CM. Both are accurate, and because of the mild recoil when compared to 308Win or 300WinMag, I get to shoot the 6.5CM more often. I do not hunt, so I cannot opine on how well the 6.5CM would perform when engaging big game (deer), but I guess the 6.5CM will be enough to an ethical kill. Unsure if the 6.5CM will be enough for moose or elk.

 

Yes, you’re right, and I don’t disagree with anything you’ve said. The point I was trying to make is that Big Green mucked it up way back when they brought the 260R to market. It took the fine folks at Hornady to properly develop and market the CM. Kudos to their success.

 

This came out two years ahead of the creedmoor

 

Eh, the world was different even only those 25yrs ago. Most folks even then had no clue what was the twist of their rifle, and shooting 1000yrds was a disbelieved myth to most folks, even many gun owners and shooters. 22-250, 243win, 25-06, 7rm, 300wm, and many others of the pre-2000’s era all have standard twists too slow for the longer, high BC bullets we want to use for long range shooting.

We don’t hear things any more in advertising like “long range laser” to describe rounds with light bullets and blistering speeds, because we’ve come to the broader reach of realization of the truth that light, fast bullets fly like wiffle balls… We’re finally seeing marketing groups listening to their markets and driving development of products - cartridges, bullets, and rifles - which align with market wants, and finally, advertising which isn’t selling on absurd silliness like Weatherby’s old advertising claims that their cartridges would anchor deer even if shooters missed the vitals…

 

Bullet design has definitely come a long way over the years. And that is part of the reason why I am having a hard time deciding what caliber to go with when it comes to 6CM or 6.5CM.

 

I prefer the 7-08, but I don't shoot over 400 yards. I kid guys about the 6.5 Creedmoor but it is near identical in performance, plenty for deer and superior beyond 500 yards. I think it is a good choice for you.

 

Ya Remington was never too swift with their marketing decisions. .244 and .280 Rem are other examples of great cartridges that they let languish. Chamber it in a 700 and hope that people bought it, and generally they did. It seems that all of the necked down, or up, cartridges based on the .308 are very useful and have a following. Big Green wasn't forward thinking enough to see the future of long range target shooting and aerodynamic .264 bullets.

 

I miss the old silvertips.....so cool looking.....worked well too.

 

Dunno ‘bout that. .22-250 and Remington 7 Mag come to mind. But yeah, they’ve probably had more swings and misses than home runs. I suppose it’s easy to look back through the lens of history and tell people what they should and shouldn’t have done. Winchester did the smart thing and grabbed military calibers which would be popular due to milsurp ammo. As much as people crow and flap their wings about Winchester, their two most popular calibers were “appropriated” from the govt.

In the 50’s and 60’s it was all about speed and more speed.

 

I have video disproving this premise. I can turn them off (only once) at less than half that speed.

 

I've got a full box of the Silvertips, in nickled cases in 357mag. It's the only box of ammo I have for "collecting purposes". More because I think they're cool, rather than any monetary motivation. Although I'm sure they're worth at least a few bucks.

 

The most impressive thing so far is that an opinion topic has gone 8 pages with minimal bickering and personal diatribes, and hasn’t been shut down

this may be a record

 

I agree that at that point tissue damage is much greater than below that velocity. In theory that might be correct. But as others have pointed out, it doesn't always work that way actually hunting. I have hunted many years with many different weapons and have shot dozens of deer. I have seen a smaller deer shot through the heart leave a massive blood trail for way over 40 yards. That deer was shot with a high velocity 30-06 with a quality expanding bullet. Another deer shot end to end with a 7 MM mag that had to be tracked. And I have shot deer with a slug gun that often doesn't perform well drop dead right there. There are many examples of unpredicted results in my experience.
I prefer high velocity bullets as they in general do more damage and are certain killers if placed correctly but I have seen the same results with bullets below 2600 FPS many times as well. Shot placement is by far the most important thing. Even then results vary. Results are not always predictable because we can't predict how each animal will react.

 

Right after Sandy Hook, I had a 20" 308 and was getting tired of the recoil, so I went to a local gunsmith and asked him to rebarrel it in a fast twist 243. Due to component shortages and the fact that he loved Lapua brass, he recommended 6.5x47 or 6X47L which was a new wildcat at that time. Back then 260 was probably the most popular but I chose the 6.5x47 based on his recommendation.

Next to my 6BR, it has by far been the easiest cartridge to tune and keep in tune than any of the other cartridges I own. 6.5CM won the popularity contest but I still think 6.5x47 holds an edge in accuracy.

 

Most game animals I've shot have been with .308, usually at around 70-150 yards, at which even hot 150gr loads are already below 2600fps. The longest DRT so far has been approximately 370 yards at less than 2000fps. My other go-to caliber, 7.62x39 (no long distance shots there), starts at around 2400fps with 150gr Sierra Pro Hunters if I load it hot. And so far none has run 50ft - knocking on wood here. I've also shot a few roughly deer-sized impalas with .45-70 at 200yd+(+), all of them have fallen where they stand, and the bullet has barely 1200fps speed left there. But some 400gr of mass, plenty of sectional density and still a rather stratospheric TKO factor to compensate.

Sooo... it's not as much velocity at target as bullet placement you emphasized as well, even though hydrodynamic shock of a fast bullet on impact definitely works wonders, in some cases even when shot placement isn't spot on. I just hate field dressing the mess a high speed magnum bullet leaves behind, it looks like organs in the chest cavity have been run through a blender. Especially if you hit a bone on the way in.

Still, would I hunt with 6.5CM? Absolutely. I'd probably pass a long distance moose and wouldn't tickle a bear with it at any distance unless i had to, but this is a resounding yes. I might even actually give it a try at some point, but now I'm too busy contemplating between .300WinMag and .338Lapua for a long range mountain rifle so even as an idea it'll have to wait a while.

 

I've been debating getting 6.5 Creed just because. Reason I haven't yet is because most of my ammo is .30-30 and .308. .30-30 has become a bit scarce at my normal sporting stores, Scheels and Cabela's. 6.5 Creed seems to be everywhere, even at farming goods stores around me (you can even find .28 Nosler and a few other new ones there).

I think a lot of the hype came from the early years of social media and then a lot of people that saw it, added their own lore to it, putting it on a high pedestal. In a way, I'm kind of surprised .260 never got its second wind really in recent years because of the 6.5 Creedmoor.

I wouldn't mind trying it, it could end up replacing my .308 as far as go to bolt-action. I just don't know if it is even worth it to me to spend $500+ on a new rifle, new caliber, etc. The only real benefit to me would be reduced recoil. .308 hammers my shoulder after a good range session. If I switched to 6.5, it probably wouldn't ding me up as much and I could go longer without getting tired of being beat up.

 

My 308 experience is growing all the time.It's my primary hunting caliber and I have 3 that I like to use a lot.Two are longish range rifles that have done their share of deer killing.One shoots 168 grain A-max bullets at around 2735 FPS.The other one shoots Berger Classic hunters at around 2750.Both of these rifles have done well on deer beyond 400 yards.The farthest shot was 590 yards.When I'm harvesting deer to eat,I always take them in open hay/corn/barley fields and the shots tend to be long.But it's the same creek bottom where I target shoot so I have a pretty good advantage.I can also pick my shots,tending to hunt there on calm evenings.The longest shot was 475 this year past.All of the 20 deer I've killed there with those two rifles dropped in their tracks.The third 308 is a Remington M7 that I do most of my woods hunting with.I shoot 150 grain Swift Sirocco's in it and usually the shots seldom exceed 100 yards.It usually shoots decent bucks,so I can say it has to work on bigger deer by a small margin.No deer shot with that rifle dropped dead instantly.There's always a short blood trail.I think the tougher Swift bullets don't expend all their energy into the vitals.They ruin very little meat,but the knockdown effect just isn't there.As an aside,I killed a doe at 300 yards with my 6.5 Creedmoor at 300 yards,using a 130 grain ELD-M.She ran over 100 yards like a dragster and tumbled end over end when she finally ran out of steam.I've killed right at 305 deer in my life with a variety of weapons,but the 308 is one of the best that I've used as far as raw killing power.The 6.5 hasn't been used enough to prove itself yet.The 35 Whelen,25-06 and 280 AI are all good also,but one jump up in horsepower.

 

Oh how I love the internet.

I'm glad to see you are happy with a 308 but to say the 6.5CM is unproven is comedic.

There is a precision rifle forum that has threads going with dozens of hunters using the 6.5 CM to kill deer every year. I guess the dead little deer didn't question the difference 1mm makes.

 

Sounds more like a shot placement problem or maybe the bullet didn't do its job well, which can happen from time to time. First deer I ever took was a doe from a tree stand 15 feet off the ground. Doe was maybe 50 yards away. Used my dad's 740 .30-06 with 150gr Remington Core-Lokt. Aimed right in the chest. Pulled the trigger. She dropped, then got up, ran 20 or so yards and dropped permanently. So by that logic, .30-06 wasn't proven enough.

I've heard similar stories where a deer was hit, in the heart or lungs by .30 caliber rounds and continued to run for quite a ways. I wasn't there to know whether or not it's true, but I've seen videos of similar incidents, so I can believe it.

6.5x55 Swede has been used for years in Scandinavian countries and Europe for hunting deer and elk with great success. 6.5 Creedmoor in a way is a modern evolution of that round. Bullet selection, shot placement, and sometimes pure luck will make or break taking an animal as humanely as possible.