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Discussion in 'Legal' started by lizziedog1, Feb 12, 2011.

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  1. lizziedog1

    lizziedog1 Member

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    We can probably agree that there are way too many guns laws. Most of us would also agree that for the most part they are useless. I work at a charter high school for "bad" boys. They often tell me that no gun law will stop them.

    But, we can also agree that there might be some gun laws that are needed. A minimum age for purchase is one example. What that age is could be debated. But I sure don't want an eight year to be able to purchase a gun and ammo. Not that there is anything evil about an eight year old, it has to do with maturity.

    Lets say that all current gun laws could be wiped clean with a "magic" wand. All Federal, State, and local laws are removed from the books. Now a new set of gun laws will be made to replace them. Here is the question.

    What would be a gun law that you would except? I mentioned age restrictions. Are there others?
     
  2. WeedWacker

    WeedWacker Member

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    Violent felons cannot own firearms until they appeal and have those in the upper echelons of the justice system restore them. I understand it won't keep the guns out of their hands but the consequences can be altered to make them think twice. Like a death sentence if they are found to be in another violent crime involving a firearm.

    I've found that it's more the consequences that deter criminals and humans in general. Why did Roman towns have low walls?








    (rule of law)
     
  3. TexasRifleman

    TexasRifleman Moderator Emeritus

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    Why? Before 1968 it was perfectly legal. The gun crime rate then was about the same as it is now.

    And don't you think it's a parents job to control their children?

    This is the basic fault with all of this kind of discussion, it assumes the gun is the problem.

    No gun laws are needed at all, but OTHER laws, and punishments need to be in place and those are more difficult because they require personal responsibility and people don't want that.

    So, we blame the inanimate object and pile up laws around it all in the name of "doing something".

    Exactly.
     
  4. lizziedog1

    lizziedog1 Member

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    One reason minors are not allowed to possess guns, drive cars, and do other dangerous activities is that they are not held to same level of responsibility as adults. In fact, if an eight year old accidently shoots their neighbor, quess who they come after? I'll give you a hint.........You!
     
  5. browneu

    browneu Member

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    I don't agree that you have to be 21 to purchase a handgun. An 18 year old can enlist and fight for our country but cannot legally purchase a handgun.
     
  6. tyeo098

    tyeo098 Member

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    Thats from an FFL in most states you can buy them from an Joe Schmo no problem
     
  7. NavyLCDR

    NavyLCDR member

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    However, browneu is in Ohio, where private sales of handguns are prohibited to less than 21.
     
  8. BK

    BK Member

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    Maybe, and only, local ordinances restricting the use of unsuppressed fire within city limits.
    Unecessary.
    No, none will do just fine.
     
  9. TexasRifleman

    TexasRifleman Moderator Emeritus

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    But by your own statement there that's not a gun law problem, that's a society not wanting to hold people accountable for their actions or the actions of their children.

    Gun laws don't fix that, they just hide it.
     
  10. lizziedog1

    lizziedog1 Member

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    You can't hold children accountable. That is logical.
     
  11. TexasRifleman

    TexasRifleman Moderator Emeritus

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    Is it? Define "child". Pretty much every state has the ability to try a minor as an adult if the crime is heinous enough and if it's clear the child knew the difference between right and wrong. So clearly at some point even under current law you can hold a child accountable for their actions.

    And, if parents were held more liable for the actions of their children we wouldn't have to worry about an 8 year old buying a gun at Wal Mart, which was the initial supposed downside of having no gun laws.

    The argument was presented that we need gun laws to keep children from buying guns at Wal Mart. Really? There's such a danger of that happening that if GCA '68 was undone there would be blood in the streets from all those toddlers with Glocks? If that's the best argument for keeping GCA '68 you have to admit that's pretty weak ground.

    Not going to happen of course but the idea that some gun laws should be kept even if we could start from scratch doesn't hold up very well. Pretty much every gun law can be shown to do more harm than good. As usual, only the law abiding are impacted by gun laws and criminals keep on doing what it is that they do.
     
  12. Tom488

    Tom488 Member

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    Yep... I've got a few. First, we start out with either a re-written 2A, or another amendment to clarify the existing 2A, to wit:

    Now that there's no punctuation to argue over, we then have the legislature re-write title 18 USC, chapter 44, as such:

    There.... that oughta take care of things.
     
  13. The Real Wyatt

    The Real Wyatt Member

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    The Times They Are a-Changin'

    Things are different now than they were in 1940. I got my first .22 when I was 6 years old, a gift from an old man who lived on the next farm over in rural Appalachia. He thought it appropriate that that old widder woman's youngest boy be taught mannish things.

    I'd save pennies to buy ammo for that thing. I'd manage to accumulate about 1 penny per month. When I had 8 of 'em I'd hike on down to the country store and buy a box of .22s. No problem in buying them. I was painfully shy and wouldn't talk to anyone not in my immediate family so I'd put my 8 pennies up on the counter and point to the .22 shells. The sweet old lady who ran the place would grab a box of shells and hand 'em to me and I'd run out of the store, my .22 held at high port. I'll never forget those experiences. I roamed the hills and hollers with my .22 looking for game. Many a squirrel and rabbit was brought home for the dinner table as a result.

    Our family later moved, after the war, to Takoma Park Md., a surburb of Washington D.C. I bought my first gun with my own money there when I was 12. I rode a streetcar to downtown DC to a Western Auto store where I purchased a brand new .22 rifle; I'd since completely worn out the one I was given at 6 years of age. I cradled that thing in my arms and carried it back to Takoma Park on the streetcars making several transfers and waiting, sometimes up to 15 minutes or so, at a streetcar stop ... all the while kinda standing in the middle of the street and cradling my precious new possession across my chest.

    As I said ... things are different now.
     
  14. S.W.G.

    S.W.G. Member

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    A new National Firearms Act.

    - Keep FFL system. (simplified, only one class)

    - Refine NICS system to prevent ATF from compiling data.

    - All gun purchases 18+. (no more waiting 'till 21 to buy a Glock)

    - No leagal distinction between rifles, shotguns, handguns.

    - No guns for felons, illegal aliens.

    - No SBR or SBS categories.

    - Redefine AOW's to exclude foregrips and shotguns.

    - Redefine DD to exclude shotguns.

    - Keep MG, DD registry and new class of AOW's (cane guns, pen guns)

    - NO HUGHES AMENDMENT

    - Safe passage clause.

    - No importation restrictions

    This is just for starters.
     
  15. oneounceload

    oneounceload member

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    A basic competency test before being able to purchase a gun - coming from a basic understanding of gun safety, local gun laws, and basic gun handling

    No one mental incompetent or found guilty of psychopathic tendencies to be able to legally acquire a gun
     
  16. Bhamrichard

    Bhamrichard Member

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    Not sure where your living at but minors are allowed to possess guns (12 years +), drive cars(15 +) and do other dangerous activities. If that's the way it is where you live, I thank my lucky stars I live in Alabama..
     
  17. kingpin008

    kingpin008 Member

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    Why? If they're not safe with a gun, keep them in prison. Otherwise, they should have the same rights as you and I.
     
  18. browneu

    browneu Member

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    I tend to agree. They should have the same rights if they've done their time and are truly rehabilitated. They won't be out for long if they plan to be lifelong inmate.
     
  19. cambeul41

    cambeul41 Member

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    The Real Wyatt (post 13) --

    Thank you for that.
     
  20. Geckgo

    Geckgo Member

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    We don't need no stinkin gun laws, and while we are at it, I can think of a few other laws I'd like repealed :)

    I wish that were the case, but too many people today are finger pointing sheep with only vengence on their minds.
     
  21. oneounceload

    oneounceload member

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    Prisoners, including felons, are released every day due to illogical reasons like not wanting to make them suffer due to overcrowding, or early release due to the same reason. Too bad that the recidivism rate is somewhere about 80+%, so no, felons do not get their gun right back.
     
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