Straight wall cartridges for Illinois deer?

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PapaG

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In today's ISRA bulletin Rich Pearson, executive director, noted that a bill was introduced which would make straight wall cartridge rifles legal in certain counties of Illinois for taking deer. Counties would be determined by the IDNR and would be those with terrain similar to Wisconsin and Missouri.
What a good thing that would be for a lot of folks. I'm about to the point that slugs are really hard on the arthritic shoulders and hands. My 44 and 357 rifles are as or more accurate than even my 220 Savage at the ranges found on my land.
Funny, though, that I can shoot fox, coyote, groundhog, and crow with my 222, 223, 30-30, 30-06.
Logic of the legislatures. Similar bills have been introduced but maybe this one has a chance.
 
Here in Indiana we have about the same rules for public land. It doesn't make since that private land next to the public land they can shoot 30.06 & larger for deer.
I shoot the 300 blk in pistol or 350 Legend carbine for deer on public land.
 
I think they should let you hunt deer with centerfire rifles, but I can see the logic of the regulations. There are a lot more deer hunters than varmint hunters, so they restrict you to shorter range weapons for deer season. Same with public vs. private land. You have a much better idea who is on your private land than knowing who is on the public land you are hunting.

NY used to be shotgun only. They began opening up counties for rifle maybe 12+ years ago and now most of the state is open to rifle. I have not heard anything about an increase in injuries/deaths as a result.
 
PapaG said:
In today's ISRA bulletin Rich Pearson, executive director, noted that a bill was introduced which would make straight wall cartridge rifles legal in certain counties of Illinois for taking deer. Counties would be determined by the IDNR and would be those with terrain similar to Wisconsin and Missouri.
What a good thing that would be for a lot of folks. I'm about to the point that slugs are really hard on the arthritic shoulders and hands. My 44 and 357 rifles are as or more accurate than even my 220 Savage at the ranges found on my land.
Funny, though, that I can shoot fox, coyote, groundhog, and crow with my 222, 223, 30-30, 30-06.
Logic of the legislatures. Similar bills have been introduced but maybe this one has a chance.
Click to expand...
That's wonderful news. If it passes, I'll have a sharps 45/70 by November!
I'm a dues paying member of ISRA, but don't get the newsletter...? I'll look into that...
 
Illinois may be the last slug-only state right now. If straight wall passes, it will be a serious death knell blow to rifled shotguns and the slug market in general. I hunted with slugs for over 3 decades before moving south. I do play around with handloaded Lee key-drives at the range, but haven't found even a single day I felt like taking one out to put meat in the freezer since.
 
illinoisburt said:
Illinois may be the last slug-only state right now. If straight wall passes, it will be a serious death knell blow to rifled shotguns and the slug market in general. I hunted with slugs for over 3 decades before moving south. I do play around with handloaded Lee key-drives at the range, but haven't found even a single day I felt like taking one out to put meat in the freezer since.
Click to expand...
I'm afraid that a lot of counties will be excluded, at least the more populated, flatter ones.
 
I don't even understand the logic of such restrictions, unless the authorities are just trying to make it more difficult to tag a deer. I have deer hunted with centerfire rifles in Fl,, NC, Ky, and Tn , on both public and private land. While those states do have some mountains and uneven terrain (except Fl) much of the terrain is very flat like in these places- just like here in the gunshine state. Somehow, we manage to hunt with rifles without wiping ourselves out every fall. What do these people think the ballistic properties are for the straight wall rounds and muzzle loaders? Have they never watched Quigley down under? The "effective range of a miss" on the intended target, an errant shot/accident, or incompetency resulting in a hunter not properly identifying his/her target before letting one fly is still present. Factor in requirements for blaze orange on public land and hunter safety training requirements, and it seems like the risk is even more mitigated. IMO, the most dangerous part of deer hunting involves elevated stands. I would really like to hear good explanations for these restrictions.
 
illinoisburt said:
Illinois may be the last slug-only state right now. If straight wall passes, it will be a serious death knell blow to rifled shotguns and the slug market in general. I hunted with slugs for over 3 decades before moving south. I do play around with handloaded Lee key-drives at the range, but haven't found even a single day I felt like taking one out to put meat in the freezer since.
Click to expand...
Does Iowa allow centerfire rifles now? I thought that they only allowed shotguns and muzzleloaders???
 
wombat13 said:
NY used to be shotgun only. They began opening up counties for rifle maybe 12+ years ago and now
Click to expand...

Iirc when I started hunting, mid 80's rifles were allowed in kess populated areas. The nysdec printed what areas were shotguns, muzzle loaders and pistols only. The line sort of followed the susquehanna riverfront Windsor through Afton, North of the River were rifle areas south of river shotgun, most of the county I lived in, Broome, was shotgun. Follow I 88 north east between Belden hill Nineveh the susquehanna ruver, so north of there. Afton was split as the river ran through town.

Can't remember where else the line ran. But this I remember cause I hunted the rifle side of Afton and at times still do
 
stillquietvoice said:
Iirc when I started hunting, mid 80's rifles were allowed in kess populated areas. The nysdec printed what areas were shotguns, muzzle loaders and pistols only. The line sort of followed the susquehanna riverfront Windsor through Afton, North of the River were rifle areas south of river shotgun, most of the county I lived in, Broome, was shotgun. Follow I 88 north east between Belden hill Nineveh the susquehanna ruver, so north of there. Afton was split as the river ran through town.

Can't remember where else the line ran. But this I remember cause I hunted the rifle side of Afton and at times still do
Click to expand...
I trust that you are correct, but I can tell you that in the early 2000s my FIL was using a shotgun to hunt deer in Allegany county which is at least as rural as Broome county. He was quite happy when the regs changed and he could use his father’s ‘06. The counties surrounding Rochester remained shotgun only for several years after that. I used my FILs shotgun for the first few years I hunted in 8H. Now most of the state allows rifles.
 
FL-NC said:
I don't even understand the logic of such restrictions, unless the authorities are just trying to make it more difficult to tag a deer ..... I would really like to hear good explanations for these restrictions
Click to expand...

Well sorta but not exactly. It's not like the rifle rules came out of thin air. Deer were at one point essentially wiped out. When conservation efforts had succeeded to the point of supporting deer hunting, shotguns and later archery were the limited means allowed to keep success rates low and throwing in moderate range safety helped small land owners feel safe. Over the decades since then deer populations and hunting popularity exploded. A lot of season expansion did happen -- more tags, more days afield, and more seasons with different weapons. Archery went from longbow and recurves to compounds and finally crossbows, all while existing hunters resisted them. Firearms went from shotguns to inline muzzleloaders to straight wall handguns. In each case the arguments are stepping stones to more effective means. Most shotgun states let in handguns twenty or more years ago. The current argument is to allow those same cartridges in a better package, hence pistol caliber or straight wall rifles and carbines. There is still a lot of hunters and land owners who do not want regular rifles allowed but as the incremental changes happen they will be quickly adopted.
 
Actually, I remember archery being the first modern season for Illinois deer hunting, about 1957. My buddy's dad got one that year.
 
illinoisburt said:
moderate range safety helped small land owners feel safe.
Click to expand...
Understood- it seems like feel-good placebos are back in style again, in our day-to-day lives.

illinoisburt said:
Archery went from longbow and recurves to compounds and finally crossbows, all while existing hunters resisted them.
Click to expand...
Kind of like virtue-signaling. I totally get it now.
 
stillquietvoice said:
Iirc when I started hunting, mid 80's rifles were allowed in kess populated areas. The nysdec printed what areas were shotguns, muzzle loaders and pistols only. The line sort of followed the susquehanna riverfront Windsor through Afton, North of the River were rifle areas south of river shotgun, most of the county I lived in, Broome, was shotgun. Follow I 88 north east between Belden hill Nineveh the susquehanna ruver, so north of there. Afton was split as the river ran through town.

Can't remember where else the line ran. But this I remember cause I hunted the rifle side of Afton and at times still do
Click to expand...
Yeah, a lot of NY was rifle, I was hunting in the Catskills almost 50 years ago with a rifle. Westchester is still bow only, and will probably never change unless they ban hunting there altogether.

It's good that a lot of states have seen the light and at least allow straight wall cartridges in place of shotguns. I don't see straight walls as much of a handicap, certainly more accurate.

Hope it passes for you IL folk!
 
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Ohio did this several years ago. Everyone on an Ohio board thought it would end the rapid firing during deer drives. It did until the 450 and 350 AR started coming out. Now its rapid fire again. I hunt farm country and sometimes big woods where you can see hundreds of yards. I like using a straight wall round due to better accuracy, cheaper to practice with and less recoil. I've been holding onto my old slug gun cause I shot my first deer with it and also for a backup but now that we are several years into this and I've got a 45-70 and 44mag carbine I think i may sell it.
 
When I left NY and moved to a state that had recently gone straight wall, I sold my hunting rifle, a .308 Browning lever action, and picked up a .357 Rossi lever action.

Certainly cheaper to practice with and much less recoil, but at reasonable distances it will still do the job.
 
Armored farmer said:
That's wonderful news. If it passes, I'll have a sharps 45/70 by November!
I'm a dues paying member of ISRA, but don't get the newsletter...? I'll look into that...
Click to expand...
Cool another Sharps shooter!
I'm running a 40-70 Sharps Straight 2 1/2. Nice in the stand I don't like for slip hunting heavy cover. So when slip hunting I finally broke down and got my last dream rifle. 1886 winchester built 1891 in 40-65 wcf. 20220401_202556.jpg
 
According to this article, it seems that pretty much all of Western NY (i.e., west of I-81) at least was shotgun only until 2005. I've seen articles as recently as 2017 that Orleans and Genesee counties (between Rochester and Buffalo) were newly allowed to hunt with rifle.

https://www.outdoornews.com/2012/05/03/rifle-bills-introduced-in-albany-new-york/

“Since 2005, several counties in the Finger Lakes Region, Central New York and the Southern Tier have been allowed to permit hunting of deer and bear with rifles,” Kolb wrote in a memo attached to the bill. “There have been very few reported adverse incidents or problems. Given the rural nature of Cayuga County and the safety record of hunters in the counties where rifle hunting has been permitted, it would be reasonable to now permit rifle hunters in Cayuga County the same opportunities.”
 
Oh, crap!!! Looks like it will be single shots only. I wonder if I can plug my 94 44. I'll email the DNR after the law gets passed.
 
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