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Surprise! Guns Not enough for Chuckie Speech next

Discussion in 'Legal' started by Master Blaster, Jun 21, 2005.

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  1. Master Blaster

    Master Blaster Member

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    SAN FRANCISCO (Reuters) - A new video game which lets players join crime gangs and kill police officers has become the target of a proposed boycott by a U.S. Senator.



    Sen. Charles Schumer , a Democrat from New York, said the "cop killer" video game, called "25 to Life," had hit an "all-time low" and discouraged the sale and distribution of the title, due out this summer.

    "'25 to Life' makes 'Grand Theft Auto' look like 'Romper Room'," Schumer said on Monday in comments e-mailed by a spokeswoman. The blockbuster video game series "Grand Theft Auto" from Take-Two Interactive (Nasdaq:TTWO - news) is frequently criticized for its violence.

    "Romper Room" is a popular U.S. children's television show.

    The new video game lets players "be the law" or "break the law," taking the side of police or thugs in running gun battles through a grimy urban landscape.

    The criminals use human shields in fights, while police call in special weapons and tactics units. The title refers to the length of a jail sentence.

    A spokesman for game maker Eidos, which was recently acquired by SCi Entertainment (SEG.L), declined comment.

    Schumer also urged game console makers Microsoft Corp.(Nasdaq:MSFT - news) and Sony Corp. (6758.T) to end their licensing agreements with Eidos.

    "The last thing we need here in New York is to reinforce a destructive culture of violence and disrespect for the law. Little Johnny should be learning how to read, not how to kill cops," Schumer said in separate comments.

    His statements echo persistent and so far unsuccessful calls from groups of lawmakers, who charge that violent video games promote similar behavior in children.

    Violent titles are a lightning rod for the video game industry, whose $10 billion in annual U.S. sales rival Hollywood's movie box office receipts.

    As a national debate rages over whether the industry should be left to regulate itself, lawmakers from several states want to make sales of violent video games to minors illegal -- efforts courts have rebuffed saying that the games are protected by laws that apply to creative expression.

    Meanwhile, some fans of the controversial games describe them as scathing critiques of American society.

    Based on sales, the fans of violent video games are legion.

    Take-Two's "Grand Theft Auto: San Andreas," the latest installment in the series, was released in October 2004 and quickly became a best-seller.

    That game was harshly criticized for allowing players to do such things as running pedestrians down with a car and killing prostitutes or police.

    Retailers and console makers tread lightly when the subject is violent games.

    " Xbox appeals to a broad audience of game players and, like all forms of entertainment, not every game is appropriate for every player," a spokeswoman for the unit that oversees Microsoft's Xbox game player said in a statement on Monday.

    A Sony spokeswoman was not available for comment.

    "25 to Life" carries an "M" rating -- for those 17 and older -- from the Entertainment Software Rating Board for blood and gore, intense violence, sexual themes, strong language and drug references, according to the Eidos Web site.

    Other titles from Eidos include "Laura Croft Tomb Raider: The Angel of Darkness" and "101 Dalmatians II: Patch's London Adventure." (Additional reporting by Franklin Paul

    "liberals Must control everything because ordinary folks like you and me are not intelligent enough or responsible enough" Where will it end? I'm sure someone could find something in any video game objectionable. Freedom of speech is not in the Bill of Rights to protect popular speech.
     
  2. El Tejon

    El Tejon Member

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    Self censorship

    [think twice, post once]

    Just like to say for the record that I despise Chuckie.
     
  3. KriegHund

    KriegHund Member

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    What a...tool.

    Chuck, i despise and think your existence is an insult to humanity, and ruins my poor poor childrens fragile minds. I demand you be put to death, but first you need to pay me 2 billion dollars.

    If i dont want the game..guess what! I wont buy it!

    Hmmmmm....

    me and all my friends think that tele-tubbies is a pretty retarded show and encourages the fantasy related side of my childs mind. You should ban it.

    :banghead:
     
    Last edited: Jun 21, 2005
  4. Third_Rail

    Third_Rail Member

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    So... it's a video game of "Cops and Robbers"? Where the heck is the harm, Chuckie?!
     
  5. Henry Bowman

    Henry Bowman Senior Member

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    I bet if someone made a video game that allowed the player to stalk and kill characters who looked like anti-gun politicians he would complain about that too. :eek: Wouldn't be very "High Road," but probably not low enough for the ACLU to defend on 1A basis.
     
  6. foghornl

    foghornl Member

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    If "UpChuck The Schmuck" Schumer is against it, I'm gonna buy it! ! !!

    ;) :evil: ;) :evil:
     
  7. armoredman

    armoredman Member

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    Ban Teletubbies AND the Wiggles!
    UpChuckie can bite my posterior - I don't have the game, or the box, or any desire for either. Banning it is as stupid as any other idea he's stolen, original thought not being his forte...
     
  8. CentralTexas

    CentralTexas Member

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    U.C. The video game!

    "I bet if someone made a video game that allowed the player to stalk and kill characters who looked like anti-gun politicians he would complain about that too"

    Ha, that would get me to by a playstation! ;)
    CT
     
  9. RealGun

    RealGun Member

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    He has a very valid concern in my opinion, but he will have to figure out how doing anything about it would be legal and constitutional. First I think that there would need to be credible studies of the psychological effects on users of these games. If the game was "Kill the Christian" or "The Assassin" or "Blow up the Infidel", I think the point would be made very quickly. The question is really whether it's "okay" to hate policemen or the "establishment" in general and to be encouraged to rehearse that behavior in a game. Society has an interest here. I don't believe rights are intended to enable barbaric regressions in our behavior.

    I believe we already know that television and movies significantly influence behavior. At least, I think I would have an "adults only" game rating controlling how this stuff is distributed. The final argument of parental control, freedom of choice for adults, has been used before, and I think it is valid.

    That said, I think Chuck Schumer has little credibility here, and rightfully so. It is not so easy to be objective about anything he proposes.

    I would also expect leaders of black communities or any culture that spawns gang violence to step forward and express concerns about these endemic hatreds and violent behaviors. The quality of succeeding generations is to a great extent their responsibility.
     
  10. MechAg94

    MechAg94 Member

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    So what about if the game was about SWAT team guys that raid houses and shoot bad guys? :)
     
  11. Zundfolge

    Zundfolge Member

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    I've got two words for Chuck Schumer; Carl Schaumberg :evil:
     
  12. Justin

    Justin Moderator Staff Member

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    RealGun- Quite frankly I don't care what the content of a video game is. It's a game. Even as a child, I have to admit to being terribly irritated with adults who couldn't seem to tell the difference between reality and fantasy.

    ESRB Ratings


    As for Charles Schumer, well...
     
  13. Lone_Gunman

    Lone_Gunman Member

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    I agree with Shumer on this issue. He is not calling for a legislative ban, or any new law, just asking for voluntary efforts to curb sale of this item. He is entitled to his opinion, and as a prominent Senator certainly has a platform for expression

    There is a big difference between a legislator expressing a personal opinion, and trying to pass a new law.

    I would be against legally banning this game. It should be protected by the first amendment, but have no problem with our leaders discouraging sales.
     
  14. Zundfolge

    Zundfolge Member

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    THIS is the next video game I'm going to buy ... so what's your point?
     
  15. captain obvious

    captain obvious Member

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    I've really cut down on things like this - I don't have a television in my house at college, don't use my cell phone anymore, but...

    ...now I HAVE to buy this game :evil:
     
  16. RavenVT100

    RavenVT100 Member

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    What's your point? The anti-gun lobby doesn't believe rights are intended to enable people to own guns, just because. And playing a game is hardly what you could consider barbaric behavior. The adrenaline isn't there, the fight/flight component isn't there, and none of the telltale factors of being in a real fight are there. It's not the same thing.

    "Common good," "for the children," "in the interest of society"-- all of these are talking points that we hear so often from the anti-gun crowd that I'm surprised you'd use them in a similar context. Efforts to ban violent video games are cut from the same cloth as efforts to ban guns. One group finds something politically incorrect and or offensive (i.e. gun ownership) and attempts to use the power of the state to enforce its version of political correctness and social policy on everyone. And yet no one is forcing anyone to play these games or own guns.

    Anyway, it looks like you agree with me here. I just wanted to re-iterate this. It all comes down to personal responsibility and not letting your kids use entertainment media that is unsuitable for their age. I believe that we can do this without having to pay legislators to do it for us.
     
  17. RealGun

    RealGun Member

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    I will never say that rights are unconditional. I don't think it is intelligent to do so. It is hard to get past the notion that one is not free to yell "fire!" in a theater, freedom of speech and all that. The same concept of society's interest could apply in other contexts. The legislatures and courts are supposed to decide such questions. Whether or not they can be trusted to provide decisions that make sense is another problem.
     
  18. Beethoven

    Beethoven member

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    I demand that chuck schumer, as MY employee, show me precisely where the Constitution gives him the authority to do or say ANYTHING related to video games.
     
  19. Zundfolge

    Zundfolge Member

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    With a combination of the ESRB ratings and the fact that WalMart (the biggest seller of video games on the planet) doesn't sell "objectionable" games, these "voluntary efforts" are already in place.

    Chuckie is just throwing his weight around as a Senator ... if he's not calling for a law then he needs to ****. Its not his job to "express himself" or share his opinion, its his job to make laws (and as such it is right for us to assume that when he expresses himself or shares his opinion that a new law is coming next).

    Chuckie has demonstrated that he has no tolerance for us serfs living free, so why would we assume his intentions here are benign?
     
  20. Lone_Gunman

    Lone_Gunman Member

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    I don't assume his intentions are benign. However, speaking his mind is his right. Just like it is my right and your right.
     
  21. Zundfolge

    Zundfolge Member

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    And just like its my right to respond to him exercising his right.


    However in addition to his right to speak his mind, he also has an obligation to reign it in when he's not discussing public policy lest his words be misconstrued as a discussion of public policy.

    And I have the right to point that out :D

    And he has the right to ignore me.
     
  22. Master Blaster

    Master Blaster Member

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    Really????? TV influences how you behave????????, even my 6 and 8 year olds can tell that TV is fantasy that nothing they see or hear there is to be taken as real.
    I taught them that, and they have human brains which are smart enough to see the difference between reality and the entertainment they see on TV even at ages 6 and 8. My 6 yearold son and I play bang shoot em up games in the arcade, we play army in the house and the yard with toy guns and toy grenades. When we go to the range he knows that his .22lr is a real gun and you cant just shoot all around like you do in a video game, because real guns kill people for real. He is 6 he KNOWS THIS.

    You know that there is a lawsuit being filed on behalf of 3 police officers shot, 2 killed, by a 16 yearold miscreant after he had been playing Grand Theft Auto. Even the 16 year old knew if he took a police officer's gun and shot him with it he would die for real. The Lawyer is claiming that the game trained him to kill cops so its not really his fault and they are suing the game manufacturer Walmart and the Game Stop becuase this turd played the game and then went on a rampage for real. Thats why the Chukster is flappin' his pie hole, he's rolling in the blood so he and his fellow facists in the congress can restrict and control, what we do, see, and hear.

    I dont want Chukiecrapmaster or the other side of the aisle, those Christian conservatives, deciding what books we can read, video games we can play, or GUNS we can own.
     
  23. Ektarr

    Ektarr Member

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    RealGun: "I will never say that rights are unconditional. I don't think it is intelligent to do so."

    Sorry, but I disagree. Rights, by their nature, must be unconditional or they're not Rights. Suppose someone said you have the Right to live, provided you behave appropriately. The person making the decision as to the 'appropriate' condition now holds the cards to your being able to exercise your 'right' to life. Would you relinquish your authority over your Rights? Should anyone?

    Not everyone should have a gun. Not everyone should have a driver's license...or publish their ideas...or be permitted to procreate! But it is their Right to do so, and Rights are like dominoes. Take care of which ones we choose to flick over.

    Ektarr says: "Everyone's allowed to piss on their own shoes." Just please don't piss on mine.
     
  24. Master Blaster

    Master Blaster Member

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    TUSCALOOSA, Ala. Feb 15, 2005 — A lawsuit claims the video game "Grand Theft Auto" led a teenager to shoot two police officers and a dispatcher to death in 2003, mirroring violent acts depicted in the popular game.

    The suit announced Tuesday seeks damages from the game's manufacturers and two stores that allegedly sold it to Devin Thompson, now 18.

    An attorney for relatives of two of the victims said Thompson, who is charged with murder, had played the video game repeatedly.
    Top Stories



    Thompson is accused of killing the three men in June 2003 after being brought to the Fayette police station on suspicion of driving a stolen car. Thompson allegedly grabbed one of the officer's guns, shot him and the other two, then fled in a patrol car.

    The suit alleges Thompson purchased "Grand Theft Auto III" at the Gamestop in Jasper and "Grand Theft Auto: Vice City" at the Jasper Wal-Mart when he was under 17. The games, which depict police killings and other acts of violence, are rated M, meaning they are appropriate for those 17 or older.

    "What has happened in Alabama is that four companies participated in the training of Devin … to kill three men," attorney Jack Thompson told The Tuscaloosa News, which reported the suit's filing.

    Named in the suit are Wal-Mart Stores and Gamestop along with Take-Two Interactive Software, the manufacturer of the games, and Sony Computer Entertainment, the maker of the PlayStation 2.

    Messages left for officials of three of the companies were not immediately returned. There was no answer at the listing for Gamestop in Grapevine, Texas.

    At a December hearing, authorities said Devin Thompson, when he was apprehended, told officers, "Life is a video game. You've got to die sometime."
     
  25. TimRB

    TimRB Member

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    "I demand that chuck schumer, as MY employee, show me precisely where the Constitution gives him the authority to do or say ANYTHING related to video games."

    Would that be the part about "freedom of speech"?

    Tim
     
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