rbernie
Contributing Member
Does the 308 *not* have the Saiga BHO? More importantly, does the Tromix conversion have it?
Tell me about the Saiga 308-1
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Drakejake
Member
MY AK,
Buying a Saiga 7.62 by 39 and a Saiga .308 (7.62 by 51) got my feet wet in the world of rifles. Previously I had only bought and shot handguns. The "by 39" had a really poor trigger and I sold it. The .308 has a really good trigger, although there have been complaints about the way the trigger fulls back and up rather than straight back. My .308 Saiga is a carbine (16 inch barrel) and therefore shorter and lighter than the FAL. My Saiga has been totally reliable and is a handy rifle. I like it even better now that it has a factory thumbhole stock. It takes a handy side-mount for a scope but I have had to shim the thing in order to get to zero. Many people know that the only mag available for this rifle is 8 rounds. Although a private company is producing 20 rounders, these will cost $40-$50, much more than $10 or less for FAL mags. My FALs can also shoot from 30 round Bren mags, about $30 each from DSA. The Saiga is a new, modern rifle, not a Frankenrifle assembled from parts by Century and other American companies. I paid only $250 for my Saiga from CDNN and at that price it was one of the best values in rifles. If you can get a Saiga .308 for $300-$350, I think it is still an excellent value. Once you add the cost of a number of mags, it will not be much cheaper than a Century FAL. The FAL comes with a pistol grip; you have to "Americanize" the Saiga to install a pistol grip without violating federal law. You decide. I like both rifles.
Drakejake
Buying a Saiga 7.62 by 39 and a Saiga .308 (7.62 by 51) got my feet wet in the world of rifles. Previously I had only bought and shot handguns. The "by 39" had a really poor trigger and I sold it. The .308 has a really good trigger, although there have been complaints about the way the trigger fulls back and up rather than straight back. My .308 Saiga is a carbine (16 inch barrel) and therefore shorter and lighter than the FAL. My Saiga has been totally reliable and is a handy rifle. I like it even better now that it has a factory thumbhole stock. It takes a handy side-mount for a scope but I have had to shim the thing in order to get to zero. Many people know that the only mag available for this rifle is 8 rounds. Although a private company is producing 20 rounders, these will cost $40-$50, much more than $10 or less for FAL mags. My FALs can also shoot from 30 round Bren mags, about $30 each from DSA. The Saiga is a new, modern rifle, not a Frankenrifle assembled from parts by Century and other American companies. I paid only $250 for my Saiga from CDNN and at that price it was one of the best values in rifles. If you can get a Saiga .308 for $300-$350, I think it is still an excellent value. Once you add the cost of a number of mags, it will not be much cheaper than a Century FAL. The FAL comes with a pistol grip; you have to "Americanize" the Saiga to install a pistol grip without violating federal law. You decide. I like both rifles.
Drakejake
That 30/06 one and the BAR mags got me thinking I'd buy one if they ever import them. But anyway, my theory is that it makes more sense to get a FAL, G3 or M1A because of magazines. There is a real good chance of a new and even worse AWB which will never expire, so now is the time to stock up on mags. Its a lot easier to do when mags are cheap. I got a boatload of mags for 5 bucks a piece from DSA.
I think its fantastic that Correia is supplying the 20 rounders, but as far as I'm concerned the Saiga .308 doesn't make a lot of sense unless you really like the gun.
I think its fantastic that Correia is supplying the 20 rounders, but as far as I'm concerned the Saiga .308 doesn't make a lot of sense unless you really like the gun.
rbernie, it has a BHO, but it is a push button to hold the bolt back manually. It is not an automatic bolt hold open.
quentin, there is no difference in accuracy. Just velocity.
Yes, the magazines are $45, but we put a ton of money into getting them designed and manufactured. (try buying a new magazine for your AR10 and let me know how that goes for you)
This was my philosophy, and the reason that I personally put up a whole mess of money on this project. The Saiga .308 is an awesome rifle. Honestly I think that the bang for the buck is the best of any semi .308 ever. Price wise is smokes everything else. The only thing that was holding it back was the 8 round magazines.
The days of cheap parts FALs are over. And even then, the cheapest available ones were of very hit or miss quality. (I have an excellent Century L1A1, so you never know. I've seen others that were total garbage). Most of the kits are gone.
DSA FALs start in the $1200 range. Springfield M1as about the same. Armalites even higher. DPMS slightly less. The Cetme is a hit or miss gun that will have the same parts issues as the cheap FALs. The PTR is a nice gun starting at between double and triple what the Saiga is.
You can have the base Saiga, new for $350. You can get a top of the line, all the bells and whistles Tromix for $700 on up. You can do a conversion to AK configuration yourself for $100 and twenty minutes of time if you have a little bit of knowledge and skill.
For $1200 I can get a Saiga and 19 magazines or a Tromix and 10 magazines. Or I can get a basic DSA, and then buy cheap magazines after.
About once a month there is a question about which battle rifle should I get, and it was always the same choices. I wanted a whole new choice. I'm not knocking the other rifles, I own some of each. But I think the Saiga is a great gun.
But I'm biased. I've got 2,200 magazine bodies sitting in the center of my gunstore right now.
quentin, there is no difference in accuracy. Just velocity.
Yes, the magazines are $45, but we put a ton of money into getting them designed and manufactured. (try buying a new magazine for your AR10 and let me know how that goes for you)
This was my philosophy, and the reason that I personally put up a whole mess of money on this project. The Saiga .308 is an awesome rifle. Honestly I think that the bang for the buck is the best of any semi .308 ever. Price wise is smokes everything else. The only thing that was holding it back was the 8 round magazines.
The days of cheap parts FALs are over. And even then, the cheapest available ones were of very hit or miss quality. (I have an excellent Century L1A1, so you never know. I've seen others that were total garbage). Most of the kits are gone.
DSA FALs start in the $1200 range. Springfield M1as about the same. Armalites even higher. DPMS slightly less. The Cetme is a hit or miss gun that will have the same parts issues as the cheap FALs. The PTR is a nice gun starting at between double and triple what the Saiga is.
You can have the base Saiga, new for $350. You can get a top of the line, all the bells and whistles Tromix for $700 on up. You can do a conversion to AK configuration yourself for $100 and twenty minutes of time if you have a little bit of knowledge and skill.
For $1200 I can get a Saiga and 19 magazines or a Tromix and 10 magazines. Or I can get a basic DSA, and then buy cheap magazines after.
About once a month there is a question about which battle rifle should I get, and it was always the same choices. I wanted a whole new choice. I'm not knocking the other rifles, I own some of each. But I think the Saiga is a great gun.
But I'm biased. I've got 2,200 magazine bodies sitting in the center of my gunstore right now.
Highland Ranger
Member
Just bought one today! Kind of on impulse, glad to hear they are well regarded.
Unfortunately can't buy the 20 round mag in NJ. 15 or less or you'd have an order.
Does anyone know where to get a few 8 rounders?
Also heard there are two tabs at the bottom of the 8 rounder you can break off and make it a 10 rounder.
Unfortunately can't buy the 20 round mag in NJ. 15 or less or you'd have an order.
Does anyone know where to get a few 8 rounders?
Also heard there are two tabs at the bottom of the 8 rounder you can break off and make it a 10 rounder.
Highland Ranger
Member
Thanks.
wally
Member
The eight rounders aren't too hard to convert to 10 rounds, but the price of the 8-rounders on FBMG web site made me forget about them and order some of the 20-rounders instead.
Correia, I note my credit card was charged, I assume this means mine will be shipped within 30 days.
--wally.
Correia, I note my credit card was charged, I assume this means mine will be shipped within 30 days.
--wally.
Highland Ranger
Member
unless all u can have is 15 . . . .
wally
Member
Right, I got that, its why I mentioned the bit about being pretty easy to modify them to take 10-rounds, or would this be illeagal in NJ?
--wally.
--wally.
Highland Ranger
Member
No that's ok as long as it's not more than 15.
Guy in the gun store mentioned something about breaking off some tabs inside the mag but from what I saw on the Saiga forum, seems to be a bit more complicated than that . . . .
Guy in the gun store mentioned something about breaking off some tabs inside the mag but from what I saw on the Saiga forum, seems to be a bit more complicated than that . . . .
280PLUS
Member
I love mine, Trigger is a bit long of a long pull but breaks clean when it does. I'd rather have it in 7.62x39 but they won't let us have it in that caliber in CT. It recoils pretty stoutly in .308. If I was to complain it would be about the price of factory .308 and apparent lack of decent milsurp. If anybody knows of any around let me know!
Corr, money is tight right now but I will be ordering a couple 20 rounders in the relatively near future, good to know you have a "few" hanging around.
Corr, money is tight right now but I will be ordering a couple 20 rounders in the relatively near future, good to know you have a "few" hanging around.
Kymasabe
Member
went to the local gunshow today, they had piles of Saiga 308-1's for sale around $350 AND even had the wooden stocked ones, with or without scope and mount.
wally
Member
Not really, but you have to cut off the tabs instead of breaking as there is a little bit on the bottom that has to remain.
I just loaded 10 without the spring and baseplate with the mag body in the gun sitting "upside down" (so the rounds don't fall out) then pushed in the follower and marked where to cut. Then a little touch up with a file of where I'd cut so the assembled and loaded mag would insert and lock in with the bolt forward.
--wally.
I love mine. Some of the accuracy figures I've seen thrown around I think are wildly optimistic like the guy that said he got 1 MOA with a loose mount, but I can get an honest and consistent 3 MOA out of mine. By that I mean that with ammo it likes I can fire as many shots as I like and put them all into a three inch circle at 100 yards. Most of the shots probably go into a 1.5-2 MOA circle and I do get the occasional MOA group out of it, but I can't rely on it to do that. So you get an idea of it's limitations. Converted, with a 16" barrel, flash suppressor and folding stock it measures 28" folded and has rock solid reliability. I don't find the recoil to be bad at all.
I don't think there are new 20 rounders available just yet, but FBMG is supposed to have a new batch ready to go very soon. At $45 each they're somewhat pricey though.
I don't think there are new 20 rounders available just yet, but FBMG is supposed to have a new batch ready to go very soon. At $45 each they're somewhat pricey though.
MD_Willington
Member
He's waiting on parts from Russia...
Samuraigg
Member
So using those high caps doesn't run you afoul of 922r?
edit: assuming these guns are unconverted...
edit: assuming these guns are unconverted...
MD_Willington
Member
For me, I wouldn't run a higher than stock capacity mag without playing the 922r points game... that's just me...
Samuraigg
Member
Same here, which is why I get nervous whenever I see a thread here talking about using high cap magazines with Saigas without mentioning either 922r or converting the rifle.
Really don't want to see a THR member get thrown in jail because of this ridiculous law.
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