Tennessee Constitutional Carry bill

Discussion in 'Legal' started by WestKentucky, Mar 6, 2021.

  1. WestKentucky

    WestKentucky Member

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    https://www.google.com/amp/s/myfox8.com/news/bill-allowing-people-to-carry-gun-without-a-permit-likely-to-become-law-in-tennessee/amp/

    I’m no legal scholar, and absolutely don’t understand how things have to go to become law here, but I will say that my governor is a proponent of civil liberties and personal choice. If this gets to his desk he will sign it in a heartbeat, especially since he has pushed it at least twice now.

    At any rate, there’s a constitutional carry bill floating around here, and nobody is talking about that. I’m excited about it. The news media acts like it’s likely to pass muster.
     
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  2. Hugger-4641

    Hugger-4641 Member

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    I've been wrong before predicting what Lee will do. We'll see.
     
  3. WestKentucky

    WestKentucky Member

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    He can’t afford to flake on this one. He is too invested. He hammered it with the state of the state speech and has been flapping jaws about it for too long. I like the guy, but he IS a politician.
     
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  4. hso

    hso Moderator Staff Member

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    It isn't the Governor that will decide. The House and Senate leadership have killed permitless carry repeatedly in the past sessions by scheduling it at the end of the calendar so that it can't be voted on before recess. There's no reason to expect that to change this session. That's just politics in TN. Appear to support, but then use parliamentary procedure to kill what isn't really supported.

    There's another wrinkle. The largest pro 2A group in the state, Tennessee Firearms Alliance, is supporting SB318/HB18 the alternative to the "Governor's Bill" SB765/HB786 because the language in the Governor's Bill limits carry to handguns and those 21 and older where SB318/HB18 doesn't. They are asking people to call and email to have the Governor's Bill change wording to "any person who can legally possess a firearm to be able to carry that firearm" - not 21 and up, not handgun only - "any person who can legally possess a firearm to be able to carry that firearm". I'm not sure if this conflict will hurt either bill's chances.
     
    Last edited: Mar 7, 2021
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  5. Mousegun

    Mousegun Member

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    In my opinion, the "on line" permit available here in Tennessee is one of the most useless things in the gun community you can get. It is not recognized by a number of other states and it seems to be a simplified way of relieving the burden of the permit process from the Department of Safety. One of the things that allows Tennessee to have as many reciprocal states as we do is the fact that we have a full day class to get our permits. Constitutional carry is a good way of showing that Tennessee is a Second Amendment honoring state, but we must remember that Tennessee Constitutional carry would be good only in Tennessee and can not follow to other states. Those other states that have already passed it have had few if any problems and no increase in crime as a result.

    Generally speaking and if true to form, a person that is suddenly allowed to carry a firearm that has not had to go through the day long process of obtaining a permit, soon finds it more a chore than a right and soon leaves the gun in the night table drawer. This was told to me by a few buddies that live in Constitutional carry states that have seen it first hand so it becomes sort of a self regulating process.

    The Tennessee Firearms Association is an organization headed by John Harris, a Nashville lawyer that is instrumental in getting through some of the better laws that needed a "tune up" from the original writing. He brought up the short comings of the Governor's Bill and recommends SB318/HB18 as the best working alternative.

    I agree with HSO in his assessment of the little chance that it will pass due to what we have seen in sessions gone by. Maybe this time there is a better chance of success. Many times the bills to allow it have been killed in committee and never got to the floor for a vote.
     
  6. Johnm1

    Johnm1 Member

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  7. hso

    hso Moderator Staff Member

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    Except for other constitutional carry states that honor all other states. TN would still need to establish a permit to issue for states that would grant reciprocity. That probably wouldn't include states that require training as part of their permit process unless TN also established training as an issued permit process. None of which is addressed in either of these bills.
     
  8. JN01

    JN01 Member

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    The bills affect those people who would meet the qualifications for obtaining an enhanced carry permit. One of those qualifications is to be a Tennessee resident or a non-resident who is employed in Tennessee. That seems to mean that everyone else would have to have a permit from another state in order to legally carry concealed.
     
  9. Mousegun

    Mousegun Member

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    I was probably misinformed about states that allow constitutional carry to their residents vs. non residents just passing through. My initial belief was that if a state allowed constitutional carry, it was for that state only, but further research shows there are some states that allow non-residents to carry constitutionally if that non-resident can legally carry a firearm.

    According to the web site, "concealedguns.procon.org/state-by-state-concealed"
    there are some states that do allow non-resident to carry constitutionally as follows:

    Constitutional Carry and Shall Issue to Residents & Non-Residents
    10

    Residents and non-residents are allowed to carry concealed firearms without a permit. However, the state will issue permits if the applicant meets the requirements.
    Arizona, Arkansas, Idaho, Kansas, Kentucky, Maine, Mississippi, Missouri, New Hampshire, and North Dakota

    But like any internet information (including what I formerly posted :notworthy:, the information may be skewed.

    Lern somptin' knew evry dahy.
     
  10. BCR#1

    BCR#1 member

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    I like to cross state borders so I'll just keep my permit and not worry IF I'm legal or not.

    Bill
     
  11. Hugger-4641

    Hugger-4641 Member

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    I look at the online permit as more of an option for semi-handicapped or those with other restrictions. For instance, I have neighbor who had a heart transplant and is still somewhat mobil and active, but can't really endure a full enhanced permit class.
     
  12. WestKentucky

    WestKentucky Member

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    Almost all of my travel is in Tennessee and Kentucky. If TN gets constitutional carry, and Kentucky already has it, I only have to worry about vacation. I bet I can find a place to go where they are gun friendly. Why should I spend money to get what I already have... the legal right to carry.
     
  13. WestKentucky

    WestKentucky Member

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  14. hso

    hso Moderator Staff Member

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    The "Governor's Bill" is through the Senate and the House has the floor vote scheduled for 23 March. Barring any parliamentary maneuvering it should pass. Then on to Governor Lee who is expected to sign it.
     
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  15. WestKentucky

    WestKentucky Member

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  16. WestKentucky

    WestKentucky Member

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  17. Mousegun

    Mousegun Member

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    If Gov. Lee signs the "Permit-Less Carry Bill" and the chances are great that he will, keep in mind it is not a true Constitutional carry bill.

    It does not allow people between the ages of 18-20, those that can go to war and die for us, unless someone is in the military or honorably discharged from the military and is at least 18 years old. Non military people must wait until 21 years of age.

    Also, there are restricted areas that someone with a permit can go like public parks and greenways.

    The above information comes from the Tennessee Firearms Association web site.
    https://tennesseefirearms.com/2021/04/bill-lees-hallmark-2nd-amendment-legislation/
     
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  18. RETG

    RETG Member

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    It's a start; now get get work with the legislators to fix the problems!:thumbup: (I have actually had coffee with John Harris a few times back in the 90s.)

    Idaho had a few renditions of the so-called "constitutional carry" laws before they got it right. Same with other states.

    From memory (and I only lived here for six years so memory is limited) it was all Idaho citizens, over 21, could carry concealed anywhere in the state but 18-20 could only carry outside of a city of a certain size (biggest problem is you don't always know when you pass into a large city or it might be while on an interstate). Then they went to all citizens can carry from 18 up anywhere in the state, and then they finally went to ALL in the state, over 18, regardless of state residence. (Other exceptions are still there such as legal to own, etc.)
     
  19. hso

    hso Moderator Staff Member

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  20. Rexster

    Rexster Member

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    Well, parks and greenways are places I would most want to carry, because those are the very places that I tend to carry large, highly-visible, expensive photography equipment. So, my having a carry license recognized in TN remains important.

    We live in Texas, where a permit-less carry bill is active, right now, and stands a decent chance of passing, but keeping a Texas LTC remains important for traveling in states that recognize the Texas LTC.
     
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  21. hso

    hso Moderator Staff Member

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    Since TX has always followed a bit behind TN, TN will recognize your permit. ;)

    When TX finally gets permitless carry, I expect TN will recognize that as well.
     
  22. Rexster

    Rexster Member

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    Texas has not, generally, been as friendly to handgun carry as Tennessee. It will be interesting to see the final form of the Texas permit-less carry bill, when it reaches a vote in the state senate.

    Actually, I am lucky to have the LEOSA, too, but what the US congreth giveth, the US congreth can taketh away, so, anything that the states will recognize is good to have. (Plus, panic-demics can make it difficult to shoot that annual qual that the LEOSA requires.)
     
  23. hso

    hso Moderator Staff Member

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    I have a pro 2A lobbyist friend on the inside of the TX permitless carry effort so I'll try to get the scoop and put it out here.
     
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  24. hso

    hso Moderator Staff Member

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    received_740899016608442.jpeg
     
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  25. Rexster

    Rexster Member

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    This looks good, and the language is predictable, but I am concerned about amendments. In the 2015 legislative session, such a thing happened when knife carry law was considerably improved, when the “Location Restricted Knife” part was added, and became part of the final bill. (BTW, there is a bill, being considered in this session, that would un-do that “Location-Restricted” stuff.)

    Another concern is someone in the Senate inserting an amendment that would cause enough controversy to cause a delay that would last until the end of the legislative session, resulting in time running out. The Texas legislature meets for a relatively short time, in odd-numbered years, so, many bills die that way. (And, of course, such shenanigans happen in every legislative body, to sabotage bills.)
     
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