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Thank you Chicago Democrates

Discussion in 'General Gun Discussions' started by hotpig, May 11, 2007.

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  1. hotpig

    hotpig Member

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    I'm glad the Northern Illinois voters keep these folks in office. It makes me feel safe.:rolleyes:

    This bill a few days ago this bill was about child sexual exploitation. They gutted it and changed it into this stuff.



    Senate OK's ban on high-capacity gun magazines
    By John O'Connor
    Associated Press
    Advertisement


    SPRINGFIELD -- With suggestions that it could help limit tragedies like April's Virginia Tech massacre, the Senate on Wednesday approved a ban on high-capacity gun magazines.

    Ammunition clips holding more than 10 rounds of ammunition would be illegal under legislation that passed 31-26 and was sent to the House.

    Sen. Dan Kotowski, a Park Ridge Democrat, sold the bill as one that doesn't limit the manufacture or sale of guns in a state reluctant to toughen controls on weapons despite solid Democratic control of the Legislature.

    But in a legislature that has struggled for several years to ban assault rifles, Kotowski refused to concede his bill was a smaller bite of the apple.

    ``In this day and age, you need to limit the lethality,'' Kotowski said after the vote. ``Acknowledge the reality that there's only so much we can do. There's 300 million guns in the country.''

    Kotowski said the gunman in the Virginia Tech shooting April 16 squeezed off 170 bullets in nine minutes. His weapon was a handgun with 15-round clips.

    Requiring smaller magazines would force such killers to change clips more often, saving lives, he said.

    ``Criminals are going to get guns,'' Kotowski said. ``Why not limit the damage that they can cause?''

    The bill allows the continued sale of high-capacity magazines to police and the military, exempts shooting competitions, and allows current owners of the clips to keep them.

    But critics said the legislation does nothing to stop violence and would drive gun manufacturers out of the state.

    ``The manufacturers are sick and tired of being pushed around by a bunch of Chicago liberals,'' said Sen. Mike Jacobs, D-East Moline.

    Kotowski also is sponsoring a ban on .50-caliber assault rifles which is awaiting a Senate floor vote.
     
  2. Tommygunn

    Tommygunn Member

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    Has this been proven? I think not; does the author of the statement have any idea how quickly mags can be changed out?
    Not to mention the V tech murderer had two guns.....
    Politicians are among the dumbest critters on the planet.
     
  3. js

    js Member

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    more liberal bs... I feel sorry for gun owners in not just Chicago, but all of Illinois... Of course, if Democrats around the country have their way, we'll all be screwed.
     
  4. Kacerdias

    Kacerdias Member

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    ``Criminals are going to get guns,'' Kotowski said. ``Why not limit the damage that they can cause?''

    Yeah, because someone who's bent on mass murder is obviously going to comply by using 10-round mags. They wouldn't want to break the law, right? :banghead:


    Seriously, how does someone with such brain-dead arguments get elected?
     
  5. WoofersInc

    WoofersInc Member

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    How do these people keep getting elected?:banghead: Des any one really believe this garbage will help crime rates go down?
     
  6. obxned

    obxned Member

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    Stupid!
     
  7. hotpig

    hotpig Member

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    Tommygunn

    Do not try to cloud issues with facts. It really confuses the politicians.
     
  8. esmith

    esmith Member

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    This proves liberals illogical mind scheme. Cho seung carried a walther p22 and Glock 19, the walther had 10 and from what the quote says it sounds as if they think the glock had 15. However i dont trust them because they cant seem to get the facts right that he had 2 handguns. Even if he wanted to he could have bought a 10 round mag for the glock. But I suppose if liberals cant ban guns all together then they must find ways to get around it. This person makes me sick, in fact all liberals make me sick.
     
  9. daveohno

    daveohno Member

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    Democrats are clueless. They keep outlawing what was legal to make it illegal. Vote? I haven't voted for anyone that won in an election here except GW in years. Ryan deep sixed the Republicans and it's gotten worse ever since. My US Rep is Gutierrez, what a piece of work he is. My US Senator's are Durbin and Obama! Have you ever seen a more useless and dangerous pair than that? Not to mention that nit wit Guv. Blago. I get a headache every election day. But I keep voting against the nit wits.
     
  10. bclark1

    bclark1 member

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    There needs to be a video showing the "time-consuming complexity" of reloading to make these people understand. Let's say for argument's sake you cut mag size by half. Buying 20 mags, instead of 10, is no problem if you have a credit card and don't care. Anyone out there can afford that if they're upset. I would be willing to bet anyone remotely proficient with a semi-auto can reload in 5 seconds. I would honestly say it's probably more like 2-3 if they've handled the weapon at all, but we'll err on the side of caution. Therefore, 20 reloads is 100 seconds. 10 reloads would have been 50 seconds. Although you doubled their reloading time, you have cost the shooter less than a minute during the event. Less than 1/9 of the shooting, in this case. That gives Superman or whoever can stop this an increased response time of 11% (giving the benefit of the doubt for a whole minute). Whether that is substantial is a good question, I would tend to say no. But even if you consider 11% substantial as a percentage, you have to understand that shooting sprees do not last that long, at least not long enough to make any fraction of the total time consequential. When you're talking about ten minutes as an eternity, whether it's 11 minutes, or 9 minutes, that time is not going to save any lives. We don't tend to recover these shooters alive. They go 'til they're low on ammo or motivation and then off themselves. That's how it is. I am pretty sure I could go to the range and put 170 rounds downrange and on a silhouette at 10 yards (not all of them terribly accurate, but on the paper) with a 6-shot revolver, perhaps even without speedloaders - you have, on average 3 1/2 seconds a shot. Cutting it to 2 seconds between shots - you are, after all, at close range - you still have nearly half of your time, well over 4 minutes, to be dumping the casings and refilling the cylinder. There is no way that limiting capacity can be seen as in any way decreasing the lethality of a spree-shooter. Short of confining the world to primitive muzzleloaders, there is no way that forcing reloads will have a substantial impact on the outcome of these sort of events. But it's not even about guns. I am pretty sure that someone could do the same with a homemade spear if they were determined. And we needn't even delve into the increased danger of explosives, which will never be regulatable so long as we have any agriculture, or industry, or even cars. What "these people" can't understand about that, I have no clue.
     
  11. Guy B. Meredith

    Guy B. Meredith Member

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    Not to mention that the no carry rule forced everyone to just politely wait around while he reloaded. Would not have done anything during more reloads.
     
  12. js

    js Member

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    I just heard on the morning news that some idiot got on a bus in Chicago yesterday and shot a few people, killing a 16 year old kid...? This can't be good...
     
  13. fletcher

    fletcher Member

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    At least they got something right...
     
  14. Titan6

    Titan6 member

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    That proposed .50 cal ban should help fight that crime wave of gangstas knocking over liquor stores with Barrets....
     
  15. Mannix

    Mannix Member

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    Anyone know if ANYONE has ever been killed with a 50 cal "assault rifle" in this country? I've yet to see one documented case. The anti-gun folks seem to be getting more clueless by the day...
     
  16. Titan6

    Titan6 member

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    It happens. Been about 15 cases nationally in the last 15 years. Including a couple of LEOs. But it sure is rare.
     
  17. Dorryn

    Dorryn Member

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    I dont own any clips! But what about my magazines?
     
  18. balletto

    balletto Member

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    The sad part of this is not the Democrats that voted for this, it's the DuPage county supposed-Republicans that did.
     
  19. azredhawk44

    azredhawk44 Member

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    I'm not in Illinois, but I'm curious:

    If I were living in Illinois and I went out and purchased a new Springfield Armory M1A or XD and wanted to participate in shooting competitions with this rifle or handgun, would I be able to purchase 20 round magazines for the rifle or 16 round magazines for the pistol? Do I show my FOID, NRA, IPSC and CMP membership to a gun store and they sell me 16 or 20 rounders rather than 10 round mags?

    How else do you include the idea of "well, since you shoot in competitions then its okay for YOU to have 20rd magazines, but home-boy Jamal over there can't have 17 round magazines for his glock..." ?
     
  20. TrapperReady

    TrapperReady Member

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    Titan6 (regarding people in the US being killed with a .50 cal rifle) -

    Um... no.

    According to a VPC press release from 2004, they list about 17 cases in which .50 caliber rifles have been "used" in crimes.

    However, as usual, they are taking a very wide view of the term "used". Of the instances cited, they broke down as follows:

    11 or 12 cases of .50 cal rifles being present during arrests. These primarily take the form of "Members of a group were arrested and LEO found a number of weapons, to include .50 caliber sniper-rifles. Ooohh, and to make it worse, they had ammo." :rolleyes:
    1 case of brandishing.
    2 cases where a .50 may have actually been fired, but didn't result in a fatality.
    2 cases where a .50 was fired and there were fatalities. One of those was during the initial events of the Branch Davidian fiasco at Waco, TX.

    Even in the two cases where .50 caliber rifles were fired and LEOs were killed, there is no confirmation (in the press release) that they were killed WITH a .50 caliber rifle, as other weapons were also present and used.
     
  21. Deanimator

    Deanimator Member

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    I simply don't believe it happened. Chicago has stringent gun controls, so it must be made up.

    How? Will it turn Daley and Blagojevich against gun ownership?

    Will Chicago ban handguns... again?
     
  22. dasmi

    dasmi Member

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    Yes, yes they will. And if they can get the gun, what on earth makes you think they can't get a high-cap mag for it?
     
  23. beaucoup ammo

    beaucoup ammo Member

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    They Strike While Emotions Are High

    Don't pile on the Democrats, or make them the fall guy, for something ALL politicians do regardless of affiliation..curry favor to win votes and dollars. Politicians, as a group, are the most corrupt people on the planet, IMO. Forget the Sopranos..just look inside the Beltway for truely organized crime. It's all about the bucks.

    It's why I'm an Independent and no longer a Republican. The two (Dems and Republicans) have morphed into one large, unethical corportion.

    I always thought Ned Beatty's character in "Network" said it well:"You..think in terms of nations and peoples. There are no nations. There are no peoples. There are no Russians. There are no Arabs. There are no third worlds. There is no West. There is only one holistic system of systems, one vast and immane, interwoven, interacting, multivariate, multi-national dominion of dollars. Petro-dollars, electro-dollars, multi-dollars, Reichmarks, rins, rubles, pounds, and shekels.

    It is the international system of currency which determines the totality of life on this planet. That is the natural order of things today. That is the atomic and subatomic and galactic structure of things today!"

    And that, IMO, transcends political affiliation. Money from Pro Guns, Anti Guns..just so long as they get the geet, politicians will punch emotional buttons or whatever else it takes to rake in the dough.
     
  24. hotpig

    hotpig Member

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    The Politicians are only voting on what their constituents want. Sure their are a hand full of gun nuts in Northern Illinois but it is not enough to stop anything.

    Unfortunately their are a bunch of nut jobs like me in Central and Southern Illinois that spend a lot of money trying to stop them. All that we are doing is delaying their ability to protect the good citizens of our state from gun violence.

    It looks like enough money has been given or spent to stop the state wide AWB commonly know as the 50 caliber ban. Maybe the tactic has changed from a large sweeping ban to a bunch of little ones like the hi cap ban.

    If you have a bunch of one liners you can get a few through at a time without causing a big fight. They require more work for the average gun nut to monitor. By dividing the state shooters you break their power.

    The hi cap ban does not effect the shooters in the LE,Competition,and hunting "camps". With those gun nuts out of the way it makes it easier to pass the legislation.

    Assault weapons is the same. Minus LE and the competition shooters from it and the hunters do not have a dog in this fight so there are just a few gun nuts left to oppose it.

    All they have to do is keep working one side against each other until water guns in pastel colors are the only thing left in the Land of Lincoln.
     
  25. Nekron

    Nekron Member

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    Exactly!! Thank you!
     
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