The Rundown on 9mm Carbines?

[1911user]

The kel-tec sub2000 has the fold-in-half thing going for it and can use common double-stack 9mm mags unlike the hi-point. Has anyone made a conversion unit to use non-hipoint mags in the hipoint carbine? That's a better mousetrap that should exist.

Low recoil, lower noise, decent/good mag capacity, common/cheap mags, and the much longer sight radius make for a potent package to 100 yards. I was at a local steel match recently and one of the ladies used a ruger 9mm carbine to just mow the targets down and didn't miss once. She did it for fun since it was a pistol match, but she had good hits quick and didn't have to work hard to do it. That's something consider for a lesser-experienced person who needs a defense firearm.

 

[Daniel T]

StrikeFire83:

I think the fact you already own a Glock 17 would make the Glock version of the Kel-Tec sub2000 a no-brainer. Light, handy, inexpensive, and decently accurate.

 

[Just_a_dude_with_a_gun]

My opinion....

-I've fired the ruger PC40 with ghost rings. Yes, a bit heavier than the plastic guns, but handles so quick, and target aquisition was effortless. Definitely solid. I would probably buy one of these used, and would definitely buy one
new ord used, if they made a pistol grip stock for it.


-The kel-tec Sub2000 is a very handy carbine though. The fact that it folds, uses your pistol mags, and known to be pretty reliable with decent ammo.
again, +1! Pistol grip = perfect for this application.

-A clean, unabused Camp-9 is always a fine bet. Nothing wrong with these,
though they've been creeping up in price. pistol grip stocks are available.

-The Hi-point seems like a really good idea if you're looking to have fun.
The only people that hate it seem to be folks that would never buy one. That ATI CX knock-off stock is cool! I'd buy one, as the price is right enough to gamble. Heck, at this price for a pistol grip/caliber carbine , even if it were a dog, I'd make it my hobby and challenge to get it running flawlessly.


-The beretta CX4 is my favorite for a number of reasons, but honestly the price keeps me from buying one. I'm not cheap (I've got a Sig and Springfield) but, until they're under $500 used I can't make myself pull the trigger (pun intended).

To me, the AR15 based pistol caliber uppers seem like a fantastic Idea for a guy who is already a .223 AR guy, and wants to use it indoors. I can't say the cost is worth it for me, to bother with a $750-950 9mm AR. Silly.

 

[Devonai]

Has anybody used 20 or 30 round 9mm mags in their Ruger PC40? I ask because I know Beretta magazines are interchangable and it would be nice to have more than 11 rounds in the PC40.

 

[Fred Fuller]

The HiPoint carbine is a sleeper, it's a good little gun. Only real drawback is the factory 10- round magazine. With ATI making a replacement stock for it now (that really makes it look pretty sharp), I don't see why they didn't design the replacement stock to take one of the common double stack pistol magazines. They'd sell a million of 'em if they did, I'd bet.

lpl/nc

 

[Prince Yamato]

I've never fired it, but doesn't Masterpiece Arms sell a 9mm carbine that takes suomi mags and drums? The Defender I think they call it. It's a hybridization (though bastardization is probably more accurate) of an FAL, Mac-11, Thompson, Suomi, and an AR. It looks like a Tommy Gun, kind of.

 

[mp510]

Go with a Ruger PC-9. They arevery comfortable to shoot, and hi cap mags are very easy to obtain. They are accurate, tacticool but still have a level of sheeple friendliness. They are accurate and reliable as well.

 

[Zach S]

One problem with 9mm ARs is the magazines. They only ones that work properly, with just about any ammo you put in it, are factory colt SMG mags, which you get a deal on if you pay less than $50 for. Promag makes some mags that can be had for less than $20, but IME they arent very reliable with anything that resembles defense ammo. Notched UZI mags run pretty well, but they dont lock the bolt open when theyre empty.

If you decide on a 9mm AR, and you just want a plinker, I'd reccomend the Oly that uses sten mags. I dont care for the glock lowers because of the bolt catch setup. Or if you want to swap back and forth between 9mm and 5.56, you can get a standard lower and a mag block that uses un-modified UZI mags that are readily available (but you have to live without the BHO). Remove the block and swap uppers at will. The 9mm buffer is a bit too heavy to use with wolf .223 though.

you could go for one of the AR-15 9mm variants.

If you wanted to go cheap you could build your own lower, buy a 9mm upper and then maybe have room for a 223 upper later on.

Figure a little over $400 for my upper, $100 for my carry handle, $125 for the mag block, $25 for my buffer and $250 or so for the assembled lower, and the total is around $900 for a complete rifle without a magazine. Not exactly cheap.

Of course, everything I got for mine was new, I dont know what the used 9mm stuff market looks like.

 

[Steelcore]

I have a
Marlin Camp
Beretta Storm
Ruger PC9

I've been thinking about selling all of them and buying an Olympic Glock mag carbine.It uses a special lower that is set up to take Glock mags without an adapter.

 

[marklbucla]

The Colt style 9mm AR is harder to deal with than the Olympic style. The Oly style just requires you do to a straight swap of the upper and mags. You could also get a mag block and just use cheapie Sten Mags. No buffer, hammer, or mag block issues to deal with like with the Colt.

 

[smince]

Another vote for the Mechtech CCU. Mine for my 1911 has been 99.9% reliable(nothing is perfect).

 

[Dr.Rob]

The storm is swoopy and handles well but I really dislike the sights.

 

[444]

A study in excellence

This is another topic that is frequently discussed. A search will provide you with plenty of reading.

I have owned the High Point, the Ruger PC9, and the Colt AR15 in 9mm (factory 9mm gun, not an upper swap).
I sold the other two and kept the AR15. My second choice would be the High Point.

As was mentioned, the AR15 is one of the most popular guns out there, so there are lots of goodies to add on if that floats your boat.
I started out with a standard factory 16" barrel. I then bought a 11.5" upper. Finally I bought an LRM M169 suppressed upper.
The 11.5" upper is one of the funnest guns I own. I have a KAC RAS II rail on it, and Aimpoint ML2 optic and a short Sully stock. This is the perfect carbine for shooting jackrabbits out of the truck. When out shooting jackrabbits, I add a Surefire 900 series weaponslight on the rail. The LRM suppressed upper also has a rail so I can swap all the goodies from one upper to the other if I want: http://www.lrmfirearms.com/suppressors/m169.html As a totally unrealated side note: I chronoed some ammo out of this suppressed upper and it was actually SLOWER than the same ammo out of a KelTec P11 handgun with a 3" barrel. :banghead:

I also recently bought a 100 round Beta mag for it (which is only made for the Colt). http://www.impactguns.com/store/BETA-CCS900.html The Pro-Mags also run flawlessly in my gun and lock the bolt back. Of course the factory Colt mags are also trouble free. I also bought a dozen unknown SMG magazines that work but don't lock the bolt back. Here is a little video on the Beta-C mag FWIW: http://www.impactguns.com/store/beta.html

And here is a good article about the Colt SMG which is the select-fire version of the Colt 9mm that us peons can't own (or at least I don't think so, I have never seen a transferable one, although you could make one from a registered receiver........) http://www.chucktaylorasaa.com/coltm635.html Even though it is about the SMG, most of the information applies to the semi-auto version as well.

I don't know if this has been mentioned or not, but if you go for the gun that takes Glock magazines, there are tons of those 33 round Glock 18 mags at every gunshow I have been to lately. Perfect for the carbine. Natchez has them on sale right now real cheap.
FWIW, I own three 9mm Glocks: 26, 34, 17 and plan on getting a 17L. That isn't enough to make me get rid of the 9mm AR for one that takes Glock magazines.

 

[bearmgc]

Never thought I would, But I did...a camp 9, at a garage sale in excellent condition. its fun, accurate out to about 75 yds for me.

 

[karlsgunbunker]

I have 2 of the Hi-Point Carbines in 9mm. I highly recomend them to anyone who wants a cheap reliable carbine. I had to get the second one because my wife "appropriated" my first. I recently put ATI stocks on both just to improve the appearance and for the added accessories available for them. ($50 at https://securewschent01.websitecomplete.com/marklatimer/shop/showDept.asp?dept=106)

Knock Hi-point all you want. I'm keeping my carbines.

 

[444]

" I had to get the second one because my wife "appropriated" my first. "

I took a girl I was dating out to shoot and brought along my High Point 9mm carbine with the laser. She said, "Why would someone put that little light on a gun ?" I told her to just put the little red dot on the beer can and squeeze the trigger. That was the last time I touched the gun. I couldn't pry it out of her hands. I just stood there loading magazines. I finally had to insist we were leaving when it got dark.

9mm carbines are a lot of fun. I have never seen anyone shoot one that didn't want one.

 

[The Deer Hunter]

Get a thompson semi-auto 45.

things rock

 

[ZeroCool]

Love my 9mm AR.

It was pricey, but it is an extremely fun rifle. 9mm ammo is cheap, and you get to shoot an AR type gun at an indoor range. Little to no kick. Hi cap mags. Reliable.

Others will probably say that it isnt a "serious" rifle. While I agree that its no .223, it is much more fun as well as cheaper to shoot.

I say get one.... you'll only have to buy 1 type of ammo!!!

 

[Don't Tread On Me]

Does an M1 carbine count?


Didn't the Automag III shoot .30carbine? See - pistol round!

 

[HMMurdock]

My two cents:

Ruger 9mm Carbine is cheap and doable. Great if youre on a budget.

Hi-Point will get the job done, but ugly as crap and I've never been really impressed with anything about them except their price. But you'll never see one in my arsenal.

Beretta Storms are wonderful. Personally owned one and I've regretted getting rid of it. Accurate, almost no recoil, and you can find a wealth of 9mm beretta 92 mags. Warning: it will make you want to buy a Beretta 92! I did and I liked it, but I got an Italian-made (not made in USA... the italian mades are better).

AR-15 9mms are sexy, but hard to find good ammo/mag combinations. I've heard of bad experiences with the new Rock Rivers 9mm versions, but Bushmaster has a couple of variants (including a carbon one). If you have the money to drop and wanna look like a badass DEA agent or something, then go for it. But otherwise...

Kel-Tecs look and feel cheap, but they certainly get the job done. They can take Glock mags which is wonderful if you have a glock. If im not mistaken they also fold in half for storage.

I think keeping to one caliber is great, and 9mm is perfect if you dont use FMJs. The military has to use FMJs because of the geneva convention, and 9mm FMJs have crappy expansion. But get a high-expanding hollow point and you'll be fine. And the bullet drop isn't nearly as bad as on a .45! Go for it. Try them out and see what you like, but I have shot them all and I can personally endorse the Beretta Storm!

TRL

 

[briansmithwins]

Just bought a used Ruger PC9 w/5 mags for $450. Now waiting for delivery.

I wanted a pistol cal carbine to shoot some of my local matches that don't allow rifle caliber rounds.

I decided that I would get either the Beretta or the Ruger based on what I could find first at a decent price.I didn't want to spend $600 on what I consider a match toy.

I was looking very hard at the various AR 9mm uppers and actually borrowed a Oly 9mm and shot it. What a jam-o-matic. Upon further investigation it seems that the Colt/RRA 9mm ARs are more reliable, but you have to put out $50 per magazine, which I'm not willing to do.

I'll post a review of the Ruger when I get it. BSW

 

[obm]

olympic makes an AR that takes glock magazines:

http://www.olyarms.com/?rootView=browse&view=cat&ids=gl

 

[marklbucla]

What a jam-o-matic.

Were you using the Oly modified Sten Mags or were you using some type of mag block and the unmodified Stens? A SOCOM block by chance?

 

[Beren]

it was actually SLOWER than the same

444: I think the upper you have is ported to lower the velocity? I have a 9mm upper with a TROS 5" unported barrel, and there isn't any noticeable velocity difference between it and my Beretta, both with the same suppressor.

 

[nero45acp]

I've owned a Ruger PC9 and a Vector Arms semi-auto Uzi with a 16" barrel and the folding stock. Both were 100% reliable, accurate, well built/durable, and a blast to shoot. The Uzi was easier to field-strip and clean, had higher capacity mags, and had the Ruger beat in the coolness dept., but the Ruger did have a little better trigger.


nero