They're not all profiteers!

[RyanM]

Okay okay okay you guys. Supply and demand, it's good business sense to change prices so that stuff enters and leaves the store at equal rates, etc.

That doesn't change the fact that CMMG is showing real integrity, and commitment to making their products available for what they think they're worth instead of "what the market will bear." They're sacrificing profits to make it so that people who aren't made of money, who can't afford $2,000 for an AR, can still still get one at the pre-election price.

I'm waiting on an upper from them. It could be a very long time. But I don't have any regrets, because they're obviously a good company to deal with, and I don't feel like I got ripped off on the price at all.

This is what I've got so far, if anyone cares.

 

[ugly old guns]

Well said, but...

Anyone hear of supply and demand? Essentially the foundation of Capitalism, upon which our economy is based and how things are priced!
Pricing to demand is not gouging, it's business. Economics 101!!

I agree wholeheartedly. Where we diverge is the impression that some are not reacting to market forces, but pandering to, and even increasing a fear that may or not be founded in reality. When a guy rents a table at a gunshow, puts his 900$ gun on it, alone, and tells anyone within 25 yards to "buy it now, and hide it, so they can't take it away", he isn't acting within the dictates of supply and demand. He is acting in concert with those who may or may not be wanting to implement a ban to further his own needs. Profiteering isn't always about cash. If the aforementioned gas station selling essential supplies wishes to sell the high priced gas, water, and ice, so be it. They are his to sell at any price he can get. When he puts out a sign saying "Your babies will die, your food will spoil, and you will get sick, unless you buy my fine supplies!", then he has crossed that line into profiteering. I don't care if every seller raises their prices 10% a day, as long as they are not scaring folks to justify it. Just be honest enough to say this is what they want, and leave it at that.

 

[DocMustang]

Looks like this has been beaten to death

http://townhall.com/columnists/JohnStossel/2005/09/07/in_praise_of_price_gouging

Free Trade vs Force

Large sudden price increases in the setting of increased demand and limited supply ensures that vital goods are available and distributed to those who need them. If you are stranded with a hurricane coming and you have cash or other goods or luxuries that can readily be exchanged for cash, your money and other items have a relatively low value in terms of survival. On the other hand the station owner has pleanty of gas and he wants money in exchange. Then you are faced with a decision: how much do you need the gas? If you are free to trade or walk away and you give the station owner your cash or other items then you must have believed at the time that you were benefiting from the exchange or you would not have made it. Economics 101: all trades are win-win. Whether you respect him in the morning...

Additionally, you have a second way of dealing with the station owner. If you do not wish to trade you can opt to use force. You then offer to take the station owner's life limb or livelihood in exchange for the gas. You can do this individually wherein you hold the gun and threaten the station owner personally or you can do this by proxy through the state or other form of collective (communist) action. The state usually performes this function by threatening buisiness closure, heavy fines or incarceration for non compliance. If you are not justified in threatening the station owner as an individual, where does the government derive the right to do so collectively?

A marxist would argue that the station owner's exploitation of the population is sufficient to warrent both the individual use of force as a primary means of obtaining justice and collective means as the ideal method of obtaining justice. Objectivists like Ayn Rand would argue that greed in the setting of rational self interest is the best means for obtaining justice.

 

[DocMustang]

When he puts out a sign saying "Your babies will die, your food will spoil, and you will get sick, unless you buy my fine supplies!", then he has crossed that line into profiteering.

No, that is advertising. He is merely pointing out information to the public that they should already know. If he sold contaminated water and then sold antibiotics to the same people he infected, that would be profiteering. In the case of retailers increasing their prices it would only be profiteering if the gun dealer did any of the following:
1. lobbied for the introduction of legislation banning certain types of firearms or all firearms inclusively with the intention of reaping a large profit from the increase in demand prior to the ban.
2. Falsely accused law makers of activities similar to the above for the purposes of profiting from fears resulting from imagined threats. (Note: does not apply in this case as the current president elect, speaker of the house and many members of the majority party in the senate are on record as being anti-gun)
3. Voted for politicians with an anti-gun agenda for purposes of profit.

A rational examination of these or similar actions clearly shows them to be against the long term self interests of the gun dealers. Most of these actions will result in long term loss of sales (a justification for increased prices in and of itself) and possible business closure. Either way it would be foolish to do so.

 

[John_galt]

There's a line between capitalism and profiteering and I'm sorry to say quite a few of these companies have crossed that line. 1000 round cases of wolf ammo going up 30 or 40% is a joke as raw material prices have been dropping like a rock for months and the prices of crap wasr 10 ak-47's going up by double on speculation of a weapons ban that might never happen. Or how about some of these places doubling the prices for mags,maybe I missed something did the cost of labor to manufacture these mags double overnight it sure isn't the prices of the raw materials.

I'm sorry who forced you to buy any of these things? I missed that part. Or is the unsaid implication that you have a right to them at a price you deem fair? In which case who exactly gave you that right?

That doesn't change the fact that CMMG is showing real integrity, and commitment to making their products available for what they think they're worth instead of "what the market will bear." They're sacrificing profits to make it so that people who aren't made of money, who can't afford $2,000 for an AR, can still still get one at the pre-election price.

BS. Thye are making a business descision, gambling that in the long run they will come out ahead with a larger more loyal customer base. And there is nothing wrong with that. If they manufacturer and sell their own product they have an advantage and can exploit it as they see fit for there own long term interest. God Bless America! Isn't it great!

"My gripe is seeing people taken advantage of, after being through 7 hurricanes and seeing so much gouging it just aggravates me.

Just how do you propose to fix that for those so desperately in need of your help? Are you going to decide yourself or would you like a Central Committee? I've heard they work well........

CMMG is a manufacturer, so restocking them costs as much as it did before the buying panic. They happen to sell their products directly, but they are a manufacturer first and a retailer second. Since the actual prices of the materials used to manufacture the product has not changed significantly, it will not cost them any more to resupply than it did before the election rush.

Good for them they have uniquely positioned themselves for their market. And just like anyone else they are free to change their prices as THEY see fit. Once again the market at work . . . helping the guy with the right plan. God Bless America! Isn't this whole freedom thing awesome!

good to hear! i HATE profiteers with a passion! and dont give me any of this "supply and demand" garbage. the guys who do this are just plain greedy!"

Then don't buy from them "plain greedy" folks. No one is holding a gun to your head.

A marxist would argue that the station owner's exploitation of the population is sufficient to warrent both the individual use of force as a primary means of obtaining justice and collective means as the ideal method of obtaining justice. Objectivists like Ayn Rand would argue that greed in the setting of rational self interest is the best means for obtaining justice

Thank you Lord. Someone who gets it! There aren't enough of you out there anymore.

OK I think at this point I have messed with everyone. It's late and I am on call till 7am so to hell with it, I'll read this again in the morning and think why in the world did I bite into this agian. If you wonder why I have such strong feelings about this, look at my screen name and make the connection. Atlas Shrugged is my favorite fiction book of all time. If you haven't read it you should. this bemoaning prices as unfair and gouging undermines freedom becasue people making those argument haven't thought them through to the logical conclusions.

One last thing - RyanM. I hope you get that rifle finished up and running. Then I hope you find some way to open a business or get a skill where you make an absolutely obscene amount of money, buy a bunch of stuff from CMMG, because you can, you want to and you just like the way they do business. (Come to think of it, I hope I do too!) I love the opportunities that you only get in the USA! GOD BLESS AMERICA! (because boy are we going to need it the next four years!)