This is my snubby

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Several folks attempting to justify unsafe practices with 'practicalities'. Ok, let's have the discussion.

The rule is: Never point a gun at something you don't intend to kill (or shoot). Ever heard of it? If not, your training is deficient and you really need to get some soon. If you have heard of it, you're intentionally ignoring it. Let me say that again: intentionally ignoring firearms safety rules. And now you're bragging about it in public. Was romel intending to shoot the camera? I really don't think so. Was he intending to shoot himself? Even less likely. Both actions are clear, unmistakable violations of the most basic rule of firearms safety there is. And here we are saying, "Oh, that's ok, the gun wasn't loaded." Do I really need to point out the fact that continual and intentional violation of that rule breeds carelessness, and the day will come when it happens with a loaded gun. Yeah, yeah, you're super careful and it would never happen to you, you always check to be sure it's unloaded and you never, ever make a mistake (the last guy who could say that truthfully died 2000 years ago, and friend, you don't qualify).

As for loading a revolver without putting your hands in front of the chambers, well, just stop by the pistol firing line at Friendship one day and I'll show you several hundred people who can do it. NOBODY on that line grabs the barrel while loading the cylinder. Far from being impossible, holding the grip is actually easier.
 
Rules are meant to be broken. I'm glad we dont have you around when we are shooting, we wouldn't hear the end of it. I guess someone has to be the nag.


On a different note, I notice you also choose to ignore the question of how to load a front stuffer musket/rifle without putting your hand directly over the barrel. Im not talking revolvers here.
 
Romel, that is a very nice gun. Thanks for the video. But, for me, please leave the background racket, noise, music?, what ever it might be called, out.
Please don't let "mykeal" keep you from making other videos. And, if you have to put the racket in them, that will be okay, I can turn the volume off.

Mule

BTW...I don't follow the rules either. Not on anything.
 
Gunsmiths and gun makers build guns and work on guns, and folks buy guns and inspect the bores of those guns, and folks clean their guns, and folks make videos....and how guns are handled during all of these events are matters of excercising sound, acceptable judgement.
It was an unloaded cylinder in the video, in a room that we can all reasonably believe that was only occupied by the video maker himself.
Romel trusts his own senses and judgement to determine that his own gun handling was safe in that situation. I agree with him that he didn't do anything wrong. I'm standing up for his RKBA and his right to make an acceptable gun video as he sees fit to promote his good purposes and intent.
There was no rules violation because it wasn't a loaded gun.
The situation wasn't real, it was contrived for the video.
We all know that.
That gun in the video was less dangerous than a live, modern primed cartridge round that's fully assembled and loaded with powder and a bullet and primer. Yet no one even thinks twice or complains about a live cartridge round being pointed at oneself or anyone else when they're simply holding it in their hand or inspecting it without being loaded in a firearm.
It's a common sense judgement that the gun handling in the video didn't pose a threat to anyone and was totally sanitary. It's just like TV shows & Hollywood, and no one likes to have their media censored when it's supposed to be free for us gun lovers to enjoy too.
Why is it okay for Clint Eastwood to point his guns at anyone he wants to in his movies but not for romel in his video? :cool:
 
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MyKeal: As much as I appreciate your posts on this and other fora, I, too, am wondering how you can push a PRB down on to a rifle charge without having your hand over the muzzle or put OS cards onto a shot charge in a fowler.

The caplock pistol.....I suppose that one could grasp the gun by its grip and the loading lever with the other hand in order to seat a bullet.
Pete
 
SixxshootinSam said:
I notice you also choose to ignore the question of how to load a front stuffer musket/rifle without putting your hand directly over the barrel. Im not talking revolvers here.
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I didn't ignore anything. You need to read all the posts. See Post No. 11.
confederatemule said:
Please don't let "mykeal" keep you from making other videos.
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Nowhere did I say he shouldn't be making videos. He did a nice job with the video, except for the safety violations. He can continue making all the videos he wants, just pay attention to how he handles his guns.
arcticap said:
There was no rules violation because it wasn't a loaded gun.
The situation wasn't real, it was contrived for the video.
We all know that.
That gun in the video was less dangerous than a live, modern primed cartridge round that's fully assembled and loaded with powder and a bullet and primer.
Click to expand...
If you'd read my posts you would have noticed that I acknowledged the gun was unloaded. That's not the issue and you know it. Are you really not aware of the following safety rule: Treat every gun as a loaded gun? It's posted at every manned firing range I've ever been at. You are advocating intentional violation of that rule. Is that really your position?
 
And I venture to say the vast majority of the members of this board do the same. Every one of the hundreds of individual loadings of long rifles, pistols and revolvers I oversaw at Friendship last year were done that way.
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actually you said none of your body parts are ever in the danger zones and thats how everyone at your shoot load theres too. thats where i thought you are just trying to blaze someone from up on that high horse. lol I only shoot a muzzleloader a few times during muzzleloader deer season but I cant figure out how you would do that.
 
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so anyhow whats that .36 like shooting? does it have snap like a .357? I have never shot a 44spl but I would imagine it would be in that relm of recoil.
 
Mykeal, I just have a simple question for you. If you are really supposed to "Treat EVERY gun as if it were loaded" and "NEVER point a gun at ANYTHING that you don't intend to destroy" then how do you take your gun anywhere?

Do you store you gun in the safe with the muzzle pointed at the floor, in case it discharges?

How do you get a gun into your car without pointing it at the car?? If it's in the trunk then it's usually pointed at the wheels from behind the safety of its plastic case.

Bet that you are gonna tell me now that this stuff doesn't count b/c it's "not loaded" right?

IMO those are the two stupidest gun rules of the top ten, not because they are inhearently wrong, but they are vauge at best in their application. It is IMPOSSIBLE to follow the two of them together. Now a rule about keeping your finger away from the trigger until ready to fire, that one is number one on my list and everyone who goes shooting with me is reminded of that rule before, during, and after we shoot, like a mantra. I like it because it can be followed all the time with no prejudice as to gut feeling, hairs standing up on your neck, personal interpretation or anything else. Vague rules breed nothing but arguments when the boundaries and limitations of such rules are not adequately defined.

Just my two coppers.
 
Mykeal, I did re-read post number 11, and you don't explain in that one either HOW to load a longrifle muzzleloader. I'm just very curious is all.

oh and by the way don't watch the 2nd vid if you are going to have a coronary about "breaking rule number one" :lol:
 
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mykeal said:
You are advocating intentional violation of that rule. Is that really your position?
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My contention is below. The anti's want to censor TV shows because of the misinterpretation of a gun range rule that simply doesn't apply to making a video production.
You have favorite western movies or TV shows that contain reckless gun handling and even people shooting each other. Do you want them censored as the anti's do? Is that really your position?
Maybe you would like there to be a warning flashing on the screen every 30 seconds or so warning all of the innocent little children who may be watching to look away or to go get their parents to turn off the TV?
That's not the America that I live in.

It's a common sense judgement that the gun handling in the video didn't pose a threat to anyone and was totally sanitary. It's just like TV shows & Hollywood, and no one likes to have their media censored when it's supposed to be free for us gun lovers to enjoy too.
Why is it okay for Clint Eastwood to point his guns at anyone he wants to in his movies but not for romel in his video?
Click to expand...

Do some folks not want to admit that there's a world of difference between producing an informative Hollywood style video production and the cardinal rules of gun safety while at a gun range?
Do you not like Clint Eastwood movies for some reason or is it just romel's?
Even all of the Star Wars movies were big hits with the kids...:rolleyes:
 
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Sixshootingsam:
Rules are meant to be broken.
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That's just dead wrong. It's an irrational excuse that allows a person to be sloppy or worse.


MyKeal: 11th post
I will admit that using the short starter or ramrod on a single shot pistol or long rifle puts my hands NEAR the muzzle, and if the gun were to discharge I'm sure they'd be burned. But there wouldn't be a hole through the palm like there would be in the case of the OP's method.
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You are being disingenuous there.....or you have a very different definition of what "near" means. Given that a ramrod has to be run all the way down to the powder charge to seat a PRB or a OP card. (I'm looking at my gun here. Running the ramrod down the bore.) for a largish percentage of the time my fingers are directly over the centerline of the bore. Don't see how I could hold on to the rod otherwise.
Pete
 
confederatemule said:
I enjoyed the second video, even more.
I am very new to BP. I have two NAA revolvers, a .22lr and a .22mag. I did not know they made a BP revolver. I'll have to check into them. That may be something I would like to play with.
Thanks again.

Mule
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In Spain we have a very strict for firearms and those small NAA of metal cartbritge are not allowed. The weapons with less than 13 cm. between point and upwards are prohibited to civilians....I want to go to USA;)
 
Two very basic principles we've all heard from the very first day. But hey, since it's necessary to have your hands NEAR - not completely over - the chamber openings for a brief second, well then I guess they don't apply to you guys. You're bullet proof or something, eh? There's a world of difference between using two fingers to unlatch the loading lever and placing your palm over the muzzle, fully covering all five chamber openings; you know that, but hey, it's a good excuse to justify intentionally violating safety rules, so what the heck. What other unsafe practices do you use this to justify?
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Do you treat loaded cartridges the same way? After all the loaded cylinder is nothing more than a loaded cylinder, whether black powder or smokeless powder.

I would say you're in much more danger going to and from the range that loading a B/P firearm.
 
"so anyhow whats that .36 like shooting? does it have snap like a .357? I have never shot a 44spl but I would imagine it would be in that relm of recoil. "

Actually, sort of like a .22 IMHO.
A .375 round ball only weighs around 80 grains and cap guns are usually quite heavy, so there hardly is any recoil.
--Dawg
 
Well, this has been a very interesting experience.

I'm constantly amazed at the lengths people will go to to justify unsafe behavior. Everything from changing the argument to one about free speech (!) to just plain saying they don't follow any rules. People seem to believe that the inability to do something perfectly justifies not even trying to do it all: the fact that your hand needs wrap around a ramrod on a muzzle centerline while it's loading a charge justifies placing the center of your palm over a loaded revolver muzzle, an entirely unnecessary action. And one in which the consequences of an AD are much more catastrophic (you'll lose your hand, versus burned fingers or torn flesh on the palm.

I don't really expect to change your minds; all I really want to do is to get you be more aware of your own actions. But it looks like some really don't believe in safety at all - some of its just a bunch of vague mumbo jumbo so obviously it's not important. At best, we'll just pick and choose what rules we'll follow.
 
Lobo9er:
They are a lot of fun to shoot.
In my target shooting days, we would load up a .375 ball with 12 grains FFFg (cap guns are usually most accurate with light loads) and you could shoot it as fast as you could pull the trigger. In Cowboy shooting you can shoot this load as fast as you can move the gun to the next target.
And .36 Navy Colt repros can be had for very little $$.
Too much fun!
--Dawg
 
romel, man we must have been seperated twins! I have two of those little NAA black powder revolvers! not the cool grip, though. And my .31 is a Remmie...
 
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I'm glad your club and all hundreds of its members all do it the same way you do, personally I think even Elmer Keith would laugh at your anal-ness of your precious 'first rule'. Not to mention a confederate/union soldier. You seriously think they were concerned at all times of where their muzzle is pointing in case it might discharge? Ridiculous. We all know for ourselves what we deem safe, I dont need an old man to tell me whats right and wrong. Get off your high horse sir.
Now if you excuse me I have to go into town. I might even not use my turn signal when I exit the driveway, even though that's the rules.

(PS, another fun little movie by Romel, thanks bud. Too bad the guy blatantly disregards rule number 1, imagine that!)
 
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