Thoughts on .32ACP pocket pistols

[berettaprofessor]

For those who don't like shooting the Keltec P-32, the Pachmayr flip on sleeves really make it fit better in the palm. Now if someone would just make a better aftermarket trigger for the thing.

 

[orionengnr]

I can tell you that as a whole, the four Kel-Tecs I owned were the biggest disappointment ever.
One P-32, two P3ATs, one whatever the first single stack 9mm was...
Four strikes, you're out... I won't be back.

 

[JCooperfan1911]

Let’s see prone to rimlock jam no power and a .380 can be had in the same size gun.

do not see appeal or a .32 gun.

 

[Ignition Override]

---------Sauer 38H. All of you know what a decocker is?
Note. As a Carry Gun, verify that this spring- or a spare - works.

A. With the internal hammer, the 38H is cocked by racking the slide, or pushing down on the decocking lever.
B. If I remember correctly, a second push on the lever decocks the hammer for safe carry.

 

[bannockburn]

berettaprofessor

For those who don't like shooting the Keltec P-32, the Pachmayr flip on sleeves really make it fit better in the palm.

You're right, the slip-on sleeve helps improve the way the gun handles without being too big or obtrusive in keeping with the small size of the gun.

 

[Monac]

Let’s see prone to rimlock jam no power and a .380 can be had in the same size gun.

Could someone tell me what a rimlock jam would look like? I've been assuming that means the rim of the top cartridge gets caught behind the rim of the cartridge below it and can't move forward out of the magazine. Is that correct? Or does rimlock simply interfere with proper feeding and cause an ordinary-looking feed jam?

I've shoot a lot of semi-rimmed pistol ammo over the years - mostly 32 ACP, but also some 25 ACP and 9mm Browning Long - and I've never seen a feed jam the way I describe it. Nor with 22 rimfire ammo, now that I think of it. So, as usual, I probably have the wrong picture in my mind. Thanks!

PS - The last time I went to the range, I shot a Daewoo 380, which is a copy of the Walther PP, only slightly larger because it is designed around 380 from the start. It has an 8 shot magazine as standard, for instance. The recoil was surprisingly sharp. It really dampened my enthusiasm for trying an LCP-sized 380 pistol. Yet my Kel-Tec 32 seems surprisingly mild. Is it the weight of the Daewoo's slide slamming back and forth that makes the difference?

 

[jar]

In a whole bunch of decades of shooting a fair variety of different 32acp pistols I have never experienced 'rim lock'. But I also tend to shoot the ammo type it was designed to use.

The 32acp is certainly not 'no power' and was used effectively as police, military and civilian handguns also for a whole herd of decades.

I find my 32acp pistols easier to control and more rapidly repeatable than my 380, 9mm Corto, 9mm Kurz pistols.

Looking at my personal use I find I tend to carry 32acp and to own more 32acp pistols than 9mm Browning, 9mm Mak and 9mm Parabellum combined.

The 1967 Importation ban was not because the small size & caliber handguns were hard to conceal, inefficient or ineffective.

 

[chicharrones]

Could someone tell me what a rimlock jam would look like? I've been assuming that means the rim of the top cartridge gets caught behind the rim of the cartridge below it and can't move forward out of the magazine. Is that correct? Or does rimlock simply interfere with proper feeding and cause an ordinary-looking feed jam?

See the video in post #23 at the 6:20 mark.

Two things that keep me using only FMJ ammo in .32 ACP guns. Preventing rimlock and wanting maximum penetration that a .32 ACP can provide.

 

[Tallball]

"Let’s see prone to rimlock jam no power and a .380 can be had in the same size gun. do not see appeal or a .32 gun."


I've never had rimlock and have been shooting 32acp for close to ten years now.

Agreed, there are better choices for SD.

However, they are a lot of fun as range toys.

A nice heavy one like a Colt 1903 has almost no recoil and is a good way to introduce new shooters to a caliber larger than 22.

 

[chicharrones]

PS - The last time I went to the range, I shot a Daewoo 380, which is a copy of the Walther PP, only slightly larger because it is designed around 380 from the start. It has an 8 shot magazine as standard, for instance. The recoil was surprisingly sharp. It really dampened my enthusiasm for trying an LCP-sized 380 pistol. Yet my Kel-Tec 32 seems surprisingly mild. Is it the weight of the Daewoo's slide slamming back and forth that makes the difference?

Blowback versus locked breech also plays into that. The Daewoo/Walther is blowback, while the Kel-Tec is locked breech. If the Daewoo was a locked breech .380 it would feel softer to shoot.

I can compare two guns in .32 ACP in this regard. My now gone NAA Guardian (blowback) and my Taurus TCP732 (locked breech). The slightly larger and lighter Taurus has always felt softer to shoot. My Guardian always felt like I was shooting a .380 Ruger LCP (also locked breech).

 

[berettaprofessor]

"Let’s see prone to rimlock

Not as long as you use ball ammo and the OAL is long enough

 

[bannockburn]

chicharrones

Blowback versus locked breech also plays into that. The Daewoo/Walther is blowback, while the Kel-Tec is locked breech. If the Daewoo was a locked breech .380 it would feel softer to shoot.

I have had any number of straight blowback semi-autos, in both .32 and .380 caliber. All of them have a fair amount of felt recoil even something larger and heavier like a Walther PP. Now compare that to a locked breech pistol like the Colt Mustang and SIG P238 (both of them .380s), and it makes for a world of difference in how soft shooting they are. Not only is there less felt recoil but the guns themselves are easier to control and get back on target faster than a comparable straight blowback pistol would be.

 

[Monac]

See the video in post #23 at the 6:20 mark. Two things that keep me using only FMJ ammo in .32 ACP guns. Preventing rimlock and wanting maximum penetration that a .32 ACP can provide.

In many years of shooting 32 ACP pistols, I can't recall ever having a malfunction like the rimlock jam shown in that video. On the other hand, I don't carry a gun, which would give much more opportunity for the cartridges in the magazine to get jolted into that configuration. Also, the large majority of my shooting has been with FMJ, not hollow points, and the the video points out that rimlock is more likely to happen with shorter cartridges, i.e., hollow points. All of which goes to say that my experience doesn't count for much. But I'm glad I had the right picture of what a rimlock jam would look like. Thanks!

 

[.455_Hunter]

I have quite a few .32 auto guns and like the caliber. I have never experienced rim lock, but generally always shoot full OAL ammo, and not the shorter JHP or WWB flatnose FMJ. S&B can have hard primers that require a second strike in some platforms.

 

[.455_Hunter]

I have quite a few .32 auto guns and like the caliber. I have never experienced rim lock, but generally always shoot full OAL ammo, and not the shorter JHP or WWB flatnose FMJ. S&B can have hard primers that require a second strike in some platforms.

 

[chicharrones]

I have quite a few .32 auto guns and like the caliber. I have never experienced rim lock, but generally always shoot full OAL ammo, and not the shorter JHP or WWB flatnose FMJ.

Good point about the truncated cone flat nose Winchester. I had nothing but problems with that ammo in my .32 ACP pocket pistols. Rimlock did happen on occasion and feed jams did occur as well with that ammo.

S&B can have hard primers that require a second strike in some platforms.

My NAA Guardian would never light off S&B consistently. That gun preferred Fiocchi.

 

[Tallball]

I had trouble with the Winchester White Box stuff and never used it again.

I just use full-length FMJ, preferably the European stuff like S&B or Fiocchi.

I have a half dozen or so 32acp pistols, and none of them give me trouble with normal ammo like that.

My daughter started shooting around age eight with 22 caliber rifles and handguns. She got bored with those and tried some 32 revolvers. The Colt 1903 was next in line after those, and she was fine with it, also. She has never liked recoil. It was a couple of years before she would even try a 38 special or 9mm. She's 16 now, and 6'1", and has yet to want to shoot a handgun caliber that starts with 4.

This is the aforementioned Colt 1903.

The sights are very small, but it's gentle to shoot and points well. Everyone who shoots it likes it.

Colt 1903

• Tallball
• Jan 7, 2018
• 1

 

[.455_Hunter]

My NAA Guardian would never light off S&B consistently. That gun preferred Fiocchi.

That is my experience, as well. Mine is loaded with Fiocchi ball in my front pocket today as I write this response.

 

[Hokkmike]

My only thought is that I don't often see .32ACP ammo in the gun stores. Of course, these days, well, you all know what I mean....

 

[CDW4ME]

The 32acp is certainly not 'no power' and was used effectively as police, military and civilian handguns also for a whole herd of decades.

What they did versus what they are doing.
LE in the USA generally selects ammo that penetrates 12-18 inches and consistently expands.
9mm/357sig/40/45 "service calibers" have multiple bullet offerings that meet that desirable criteria.
380 is minimal, a very few loads meet the common standard of at least 12'' penetration and consistent expansion.
Excepting physical limitation or it is literally the only option, can't see carrying less than 380 and strive for at least 9mm.

 

[Paul R Zartman]

Hmmm...shoot EM where it counts...

12 inch penetration? Seems to me that 4 to 6 inch would work on me, now granted... I've never been shot and really don't want to be...but... I have been shot with BB guns and pellet guns, they freaking hurt enough to make me run and hide... 32 auto has to be 100 times worse. IMO
OUCH

 

[Mauser lover]

LE in the USA generally selects ammo that penetrates 12-18 inches and consistently expands.

I agree in general with what you are saying, but I think as a whole "we" (all of us) need to quit repeating this sort of thing. Not because what we are thinking is untrue, but because what we often say is absolutely useless when we forget to state the units.

LE in the USA generally selects ammo that penetrates 12-18 inches in what?

I can get a .32 to penetrate 12-18 inches, but what makes 9/10mm or .357/.40/.45 better is that it will penetrate that amount in some particular and repeatable medium that .32 won't.

 

[halfmoonclip]

The consensus over on the Walther forum is that the bigger taper on the base cannelure on Euro cases was more resistant to rim lock than American cases; personally been shooting both, factory and reloaded, with no real drama. The Euro stuff is loaded a little hotter as well; two things to consider.
If you are shooting shorter JHP ammo in a more lightly sprung locked breech pistol (think KelTec), rim lock is more common.( KelTec really should make a magazine with a spacer for running HPs.) If you use a blowback (stronger springs), it will generally drive a rimlocked cartridge forward.
Really can't remember the last rimlock, but I use FMJ, which keeps things orderly in the magazine.
Moon

 

[TTv2]

My thoughts on .32 ACP pocket pistols is if it's not an LCP or a Kel Tec, it's no good. Of course my definition of a .32 pocket pistol is a modern gun, not the PPK or the Colt 1903 or the Beretta 81. The Beretta Tomcat, Seecamp, NAA all have serious issues either with quality, reliability, or shootability. The Jennings/Jimenez .32's may in fact be better options because they will crack too, but cost a third what the Beretta, Seecamp, and NAA will.

I do wish Phoenix Arms would make a .32, the sights and triggers on their guns are surprisingly decent.

Anyway, there's not a lot of options really for a pocket .32 and until Ruger finally gets it in gear the Kel Tec is the only real option.

 

[jar]

What they did versus what they are doing.
LE in the USA generally selects ammo that penetrates 12-18 inches and consistently expands.
9mm/357sig/40/45 "service calibers" have multiple bullet offerings that meet that desirable criteria.
380 is minimal, a very few loads meet the common standard of at least 12'' penetration and consistent expansion.
Excepting physical limitation or it is literally the only option, can't see carrying less than 380 and strive for at least 9mm.

But I am not a LEO.

I will never be serving a warrant, making an arrest, responding to a domestic violence call. making a traffic stop or chasing a felon.

I will not be protecting property or upholding my honor or keeping face.

If I ever use a handgun in self defense it will be at BBD and only to protect myself or those immediately around me. My priority will be having something small and extremely controllable that allows me to place multiple shots on target in a short period of time even when under stress. I want something with the least possible risk of endangering anything other than the specific and immediate threat. It will be location, Location, LOCATION.

As pointed out above; the 1967 Importation ban was not because the small size & caliber handguns were hard to conceal, inefficient or ineffective.

For me personally I find the 32 family of calibers a sweet spot when considering reliability, accuracy and repeatability.

But I fully support others that have different wants or needs.