Quantcast
  1. This site uses cookies. By continuing to use this site, you are agreeing to our use of cookies. Learn More.

Two people legally carrying involved in shooting in Louisville, KY

Discussion in 'Legal' started by WeThePeople, Jun 5, 2007.

Thread Status:
Not open for further replies.
  1. WeThePeople

    WeThePeople Member

    Joined:
    Mar 2, 2007
    Messages:
    311
    Location:
    Louisville, KY
    http://www.courier-journal.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20070605/ZONE03/706050422



    And a follow-up article:

    http://www.courier-journal.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20070605/ZONE03/70605027

     
  2. HUMONGO

    HUMONGO Member

    Joined:
    Apr 26, 2007
    Messages:
    131
    Location:
    Behind enemy lines in Bodymore, Murderland
    This is just the case that the antis have been waiting for. It sounds like the guy in the hummer showed his weapon trying to intimidate the ex-LEO. Just didn't figure he was carrying too.

    I can only speculate as I wasn't there, but all in all, it's a pretty messed up situation.
     
  3. jeepmor

    jeepmor Member

    Joined:
    Nov 6, 2005
    Messages:
    2,824
    Location:
    Stumptown
    Like any traffic oops is worth drawing a gun over.
     
    Last edited: Jun 6, 2007
  4. mnrivrat

    mnrivrat Member

    Joined:
    Dec 24, 2002
    Messages:
    4,612
    Location:
    MN
    A clearly tragic event - I will withhold opinion until further information is forthcoming.

    At this time who knows which showed their gun first ? Either way it would seem withdrawl from the scene may have been a better course of action since both were still in their vehicles . Just not enough information to make a good judgment or place blame.
     
  5. gunsmith

    gunsmith member

    Joined:
    May 8, 2003
    Messages:
    5,906
    Location:
    Reno, Nevada
    sad but very interesting

    If someone is worth shooting once he is worth shooting 7.
    It's not a turn at a stop sign that got him shot it was blocking the path of the other vehicle that led to the shooting, whether or not Koenig fired in self defense is the real question.
    Did the injured driver display his weapon? Did he consider the other driver to be a serious threat?
    I was once almost forced off the road by a road rager , I was packing but called 911 rather then display my gun.
    Being that the injured driver blocked the path of the retired officer, I'm thinking Koenig is innocent.
     
  6. The Amigo

    The Amigo Member

    Joined:
    Dec 27, 2006
    Messages:
    285
    Location:
    San Juan PR
    Wow

    Another fine example of dont take your weapon out untill you are ready to shoot.
     
  7. Jim March

    Jim March Member

    Joined:
    Dec 24, 2002
    Messages:
    8,732
    Location:
    SF Bay Area
    Oh God. Just what we didn't need.

    Happened in Kentucky where, I believe, CCW is fairly new? We'll need to know how long CCW has been in place.

    And...well, for political reasons...I hope to God it was the ex-cop in the wrong. I don't mean to piss anybody off with that comment and it's WAY too soon to know which it is. But we're better off if it was the cop.
     
  8. XavierBreath

    XavierBreath Member

    Joined:
    Jan 6, 2003
    Messages:
    5,054
    Location:
    Louisiana
    Way to soon to make a call here...........
     
  9. Glockman17366

    Glockman17366 Member

    Joined:
    Dec 11, 2005
    Messages:
    1,150
    Location:
    South Central Pennsylvania
    Even if the ex-cop saw a gun, he should have backed up to retreat, then reported the incident to active duty police. I doubt if it would have been too difficult to trace a black Hummer.
    The other thing that wasn't reported, but should have been is rather the Hummer driver had his gun out.

    Speculation, but I think the cop will be charged in this incident.
     
  10. WeThePeople

    WeThePeople Member

    Joined:
    Mar 2, 2007
    Messages:
    311
    Location:
    Louisville, KY
    We have had a concealed carry law since 1996.

    Unless I missed something in the article, we don't yet know if they had CCDW permits; only that they were carrying "legally." In Kentucky, anyone can carry a loaded firearm in their glove box. Open carry is also legal as stated in the Kentucky Constitution and as affirmed by the Court of Appeals in 1956 in Holland v. Commonwealth.
     
  11. pacodelahoya

    pacodelahoya Member

    Joined:
    Jan 18, 2007
    Messages:
    911
    Location:
    SW PA
    If Koening was blocked and Pickerell had a gun, then it sounds like a good shoot from the available info to me. Does Kentucky force it's citizens to try and run from danger like Pa does?? I wouldn't turn my back to a guy with a gun and I wouldn't convict Koening if I was on the jury if all the facts coincide with his story.
     
  12. HUMONGO

    HUMONGO Member

    Joined:
    Apr 26, 2007
    Messages:
    131
    Location:
    Behind enemy lines in Bodymore, Murderland
    Not innocent, just not legally culpable.
     
  13. WeThePeople

    WeThePeople Member

    Joined:
    Mar 2, 2007
    Messages:
    311
    Location:
    Louisville, KY
    No. We have a 'no duty to retreat' law that went into effect in, I believe, 2006.
     
  14. WeThePeople

    WeThePeople Member

    Joined:
    Mar 2, 2007
    Messages:
    311
    Location:
    Louisville, KY
    By the way, this happened maybe 1/2 of a mile down the street from my office.
     
  15. 30 cal slob

    30 cal slob Member

    Joined:
    Mar 2, 2004
    Messages:
    2,092
    Location:
    Location, Location!
    dang.

    was hoping that this would a "2 CCW good guys taking on several bad guys" kind of a story.

    guess not.

    p.s. i have heard you will get harassed in louisville if you OC, even if it is your right.
     
  16. bakert

    bakert Member

    Joined:
    May 1, 2005
    Messages:
    1,668
    To me it sounds like a bit of road rage from two arrogant A--H---s that escalated way too far but from what's in the papers and on TV it's hard to tell what really happened. While most of KY is gun friendly, most of the news media is not at least in Louisville and Lexington. The Courier Journal really jumped on the fact both men were legally armed but you don't have to have a permit to legally carry a gun in your vehicle here. Another thing , most of the Courier's staff writers are about as gun friendly as Rosie O'Donnel. I look for rants from the antis over this incident before it's over. As We the People noted, concealed carry here is not exactly new.

    30 Cal slob, you've got it right about open carry here, especially in the area where I live right outside of Louisville. A person carring openly in public will not be admitted into most places and may be stopped and at least questioned by the police too.
     
  17. buzz_knox

    buzz_knox Member

    Joined:
    Dec 27, 2002
    Messages:
    4,849
    Is it normal to refer to retired police as if they were still on duty?
     
  18. romma

    romma Member

    Joined:
    Jun 28, 2005
    Messages:
    3,208
    Location:
    Southeastern,CT
    ouch! It will be interesting to see what other info comes to light. Really tragic.
     
  19. crazed_ss

    crazed_ss Member

    Joined:
    Dec 27, 2005
    Messages:
    1,652
    Location:
    Sunny San Diego
    So did they find a weapon on the guy who got shot or what?

    It sounds like the former officer forgot he was a FORMER officer. I've read many stories over the years where cops shoot because they thought or it looked like someone had a gun.
     
  20. Sistema1927

    Sistema1927 Member

    Joined:
    May 21, 2004
    Messages:
    4,590
    Location:
    "Land of (dis)Enchantment"
    Oh man, getting PO'ed because someone else wants the right of way is no reason for anyone to start shooting.

    A little ditty that my dad used to recite went "He was right, dead right, as he sped along, but he's just as dead as if he was wrong." Who cares which car was first at the stop sign? Let the other guy go, and don't ruin your day.

    Both guys were jerks, unfortunately both of them were armed.
     
  21. WeThePeople

    WeThePeople Member

    Joined:
    Mar 2, 2007
    Messages:
    311
    Location:
    Louisville, KY
    An Update: Both had concealed carry licenses.

    This is it boys. This is the one the antis screamed about in almost all of our states when concealed carry was passed. They said that gunfire would erupt over simple traffic disputes.

    It may not be very high road of me to suggest it, but the next time someone says anything about shooting someone over something stupid, slap 'em for me. It's not funny. Not even a little bit.


     
  22. vis-à-vis

    vis-à-vis Member

    Joined:
    Jul 31, 2005
    Messages:
    831
    Location:
    Louisville, KY
    I am impressed with the sister of the man shot. She kept it collected and rational calling for truth to be sought for whilst not laying blame on either yet. It usually not that way. I wonder how this will pan out.
     
  23. delta53

    delta53 Member

    Joined:
    Oct 31, 2006
    Messages:
    187
    Location:
    Above your House in a Black Helicopter/ But I live
    no help

    The shooter will not be getting any free lawyers from the police dept as he would have before he retired
     
  24. HUMONGO

    HUMONGO Member

    Joined:
    Apr 26, 2007
    Messages:
    131
    Location:
    Behind enemy lines in Bodymore, Murderland
    Sounds like a classy fella'. Glad he never worked as a cop in my town. I have nothing aginst cops, I like cops. I just hate the ones who feel they're above the law.

    That aside, it may be a clean shoot, don't know, wasn't there.
     
  25. Clipper

    Clipper Member

    Joined:
    Apr 15, 2006
    Messages:
    2,243
    Location:
    Mt. Morris, MI.
    The thing that disgusts me is that with his discilpine record, a civilian would not have been issued a permit to carry in the first place, but ex-LEO gets a pass...Just because he once had a badge (and it sounds as if that badge was in severe jeopardy when he 'resigned'), doesn't mean he's fit to go amongst us armed.
     
Thread Status:
Not open for further replies.

Share This Page