VA Open Carry in Wash. comPost article

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I was there, sitting a couple of seats down from Dave. I'm very surprised that people consider an event like this news... but strictly speaking (if you can go by the headline/title) the "news" is the fact that some people consider the exercise of a right to be "unreasonable." <IRE & E>I mean, we all know that reasonableness is the ulitmate moral standard, right? </IRE & E>
 
but at least, I would like to have FPD charge the patron that called 9-1-1 for the full cost of the police presence.

Oh, I don't know that I want people to feel reluctant about reporting concerns to the police. The way some people process information they might decide that if reporting the open carry of a 9mm handgun costs them a few bucks, then reporting a suitcase nuke might cost them the price of a new automobile. This is an area where erring on the side of caution isn't a bad thing, and we just need a little extra public education about open carry. The last thing I'd want to do is put a chill in the public's watchfulness, even if it's a hassle sometimes.
 
Openly carrying weapons is "not a good idea," said Kristen Rand of the Violence Policy Center in Washington. "This is the gun lobby's vision of how America should be. Everybody's packing heat and ready to engage in a shootout at the slightest provocation."
I think she is absolutely terrified of open carry. She loses every time a fence sitter or a grabber notices that they've just walked past someone openly carrying, without getting shot.
When they walk past enough people openly carrying, without anything bad ever happening, then they'll be able to spot her lies. (Even if unconsciously.)
 
"This just shows you the extreme nature of what they're trying to do," said Bob Ricker, head of Virginians for Public Safety. "You don't want to go to Starbucks or Reston Town Center and see somebody with a firearm strapped on," he added, referring to two locations where armed patrons were found. "It's just something that I think is completely unreasonable. We all understand the concept of self-defense. . . . But when you're talking about Fairfax County, you have to look at what is reasonable."

"This just shows you the extreme nature of what they're trying to do," said Nathan Forrest, head of Tenneseans for Public Safety. "You don't want to go to the General Store or Memphis Town Center and see a darkie," he added, referring to two locations where freed slaves were found. "It's jsut something that I think is completely unreasonable. We all understand the concept of equal rights... But when you are talking about Memphis County, you have to look at what is reasonable."

:cuss: :fire:


A right that requires prior approval and permission to exercise is NOT a right.
 
I hope VCDL is at the Dulles Expo Center show on the 31st. I'm looking forward to joining.
MJRW, we will be there in force, including Philip Van Cleave and much of the leadership. Stop by the table! (I'll be the guy open carrying a SIG P220. :) )
 
Leatherness here - I don't get it - what's so special about Fairfax??? That quote struck me the wrong way too as I read the article in the Washington Post. We should be able to open carry anywhere in the Commonwealth - End of story.
 
Brief (I hope!) digression:

MJRW, we will be there in force, including Philip Van Cleave and much of the leadership. Stop by the table! (I'll be the guy open carrying a SIG P220.)
David, what are the venue's rules about carry, both open and concealed, for the attendees?

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"But when you're talking about Fairfax County, you have to look at what is reasonable."

Reasonable in the eyes of whom?? I think anything under a .50BMG is reasonable, and I'm sure I can find a few dozen people who'd agree..

"We've had 40 people open carry, in a restaurant, with no problem," he said.

40 people open carrying, that's more defense then the french army! I can't imagine what kind of "problems" couldn't be solved by 40 open carries..

Everybody's packing heat and ready to engage in a shootout at the slightest provocation."

Liberals spouting off the lack of self-control on their parts.. :cuss:

Friggin' elitist swine.

Swine becomes good bacon for breakfast, so please don't insult the swines... nor my breakfast..
 
Further reaction: WP 16 Jul 04

Gun-Toting in Va. Educates Public, Advocates Say

By Maria Glod and Michael Laris
Washington Post Staff Writers
Friday, July 16, 2004; Page B6


Jim Snyder was sipping a Coke at a Champps restaurant in Reston, his Colt .45 strapped to his hip, when three Fairfax County police officers walked over to his table. Several of Snyder's dinner companions also were openly carrying weapons -- a scene that prompted a call to 911.



The diners explained that they were simply exercising their rights under Virginia law, Snyder said. And, as the officers made some phone calls to check whether that was true, Snyder relaxed and settled in to enjoy his dinner.

"It didn't bother me at all because I knew what the law was," Snyder, 54, who lives in the Kingstowne area, said yesterday. "I just wanted to see how long it took them to figure it out."

Snyder carries a gun for protection but had it that night because the group had been at a shooting range. He knows that it is perfectly legal in Virginia to openly pack a pistol, and he's delighted that his dining experience, along with a few recent similar incidents, have helped educate some folks, he said.

Fairfax police said that three times in the last month, including the July 2 incident at Champps, residents have been spotted in the county with guns strapped to their hips. In one instance, police wrongly confiscated guns from two college students at a Starbucks and filed misdemeanor charges, mistakes that were corrected the next day.

That case prompted the department to issue a reminder to officers that it's legal to "open carry" most guns in the state.

Philip Van Cleave, president of the Virginia Citizens Defense League, said his group spread the word about the Starbucks incident, perhaps prompting other gun owners to openly carry their weapons.

"I think people said, 'I don't like what happened to these guys and I'm going to open carry,' " said Van Cleave, a former Texas deputy sheriff. He noted that it is illegal in Virginia to carry concealed weapons in restaurants where alcohol is served, so those patrons don't have the option to hide their weapons. Concealed weapons require a permit.

Virginia Sen. Kenneth W. Stolle (R-Virginia Beach) said 21 other states have similar open-carry laws.

"In a suburban or urban area, it sometimes causes a level of discomfort but, in my opinion, that level of discomfort doesn't outweigh the constitutional right to bear firearms," Stolle said.

Some, such as Cindy Jones, worry that openly toting guns could make them too accessible to the wrong fingers. "The image that comes to mind is a child could grab it," said Jones, 50, a psychologist. "It's frightening to think that that's the mind-set. It makes me think of a gunslinger with a holster."

Others said they would not be overly concerned if they ran into gun-toting neighbors.

"I'd rather they were open than concealed," said Amber Smith, 47, a horse trainer who grew up around guns and hunters and was taught to shoot by her father. Smith said she might feel different in some contexts -- such as visiting a high-crime locale -- or if the person next to her had serious firepower.

Still, she added, making a scene by lugging some steel is a little too much for her taste. "It's absurd that people think they need to make a political point by carrying it into a coffee shop. They could leave it in the car," Smith said.

But getting people's attention, even if it makes them uncomfortable, is a virtuous and important part of defending the right to bear arms, argues Del. Richard H. Black (R-Loudoun), an outspoken gun rights advocate and one of Virginia's most conservative politicians.

"Many people don't recognize that the right has existed since the settlement of Virginia in 1607," he said. "A lot of our Constitutional rights tend to make people nervous under certain circumstances."

Black also assumes that most people who would openly carry a firearm would also tend to be those with a concealed weapons permit, a highly law-abiding group, he said.

Government contractor Melinda Meador's gun has elicited a host of reactions over the years. She generally brings hers along when she dines out, she said, and the Sterling resident follows a few basic rules.

She calmly explains the law, avoids confrontation, and keeps her gun in its holster. "You certainly don't clear leather," Meador said.
 
This is starting to get interesting, with the publicity from the ComPost and radio stations. I don't know why it got their attention all of a sudden, because many of us have been open-carrying for quite a while. (Although I admit I didn't, except for rural outdoors activities, before getting my concealed pistol permit). Maybe it's a slow news season? Hard to believe...

Anyway, kudos to Phil et al from VCDL. You guys are heroes! Maybe you could record a few of the interviews for playback at the VCDL booth at gun shows and such?

WildkeepalowprofileAlaska will be along shortly to scold you for inciting terror. :neener:

TC
TFL Survivor
 
*bleat*
"Oh, but the Moonie Times is a CONSERVATIVE paper!" :barf:

With "friends" like that...

Hey, Adrienne: "Wild West" THIS.

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"It's like the Fourth of July," Van Cleave said. "A whole new set of freedoms came in. . . .

Actually, It's more like a whole set of freedoms have been restored.
 
nothing was really new

The local bans were already preempted for permit holders. Now, non permit holders are preempted. Nothing like a bunch of sniveling whiny socialists like Gerry Connolly - didn't he leave the scene of an accident recently, and get charged with a misdemeanor? - complaining about people actually not needing government protection? Oh the Humanity!:rolleyes:

I have news for these control freaks. This is my home. I was born around here, and I'm not going anywhere. You don't like the laws here, move to DC, because your antiquated socialist values belong on the scrapheap of history, not in the Commonwealth. In summary, if people lawfully carrying holstered guns scare you, make plans to leave, because I'm staying.

There was no reaction to the Starbucks incident, there was no statement being made here, no sudden onset, and the plain simple truth is that FPD has encountered us (me) open carrying several other times previously, with not so much as a problem. I suspect that the recent onset of 'War on Gangs' here prompted some different procedures for dealing with potential problem situations. I'll give FPD this, these gangs don't play, and require special handling... Still, it's clear from our appearance that we're not gang or terrorist...
 
Errr... If there are 40 guys open carrying, then something's probably not going to happy. Criminals don't usually "let you know" in advance that I have a gun and am going to use it for malice..

Also, the cops didn't know the laws??

That should prove how confusing most gun laws are..
 
I'd like to send some emails

Adrianne Washington Is a terrible writer and the drivel that she spews is absolutely hateful and intolerant and has no basis other than scare tactics. I need everyone willing to help me send some emails to this paper. or help me write one email stating that her type of anti-gun bigotry and fear mongering has no place in a "reputable media outlet".

http://washingtontimes.com/metro/20...04811-2306r.htm
 
BeLikeTrey...

Bad link.

Maybe if all Virginians were to come out of the closet for a "few days" there'd be less of this drivel.

(I could just imagine the response of open carry on Atlantic Ave and beachfront right now... "Please, Sir, it would be of great benefit if you'd just cover your weapon - Oh! You DO have a permit, right?")

("Yowzza, Sir"... But... )
 
MJRW, we will be there in force, including Philip Van Cleave and much of the leadership. Stop by the table! (I'll be the guy open carrying a SIG P220.)
David, what are the venue's rules about carry, both open and concealed, for the attendees?
Standard gun show rules, no loaded firearms but carry as you normally would (concealed is fine with permit). At the Richmond shows run by the same people, they have State Police on the premises to tie up guns (and run background checks, and arrest the one dummy at every show who tries to buy a gun even though he has outstanding warrants :rolleyes: ).

However, one of the new July 1 laws bans weapons at airports unless you are flying and have a firearm in your luggage. Be *very careful* around Dulles, because the MWAA think they rule the entire area around the airport including parts of Routes 28 and 50. I'm sure there will be a lot of discussion about this at the show. :D
 
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